#31
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I don't follow why you would even need to use a limiter on a solo guitar recording.
As a gain guide I use the K System metering system where I set the loudness meters to where zero on the meter equals -14 dbFS. Also just what does CD level loudness supposed to mean?
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Derek Coombs Youtube -> Website -> Music -> Tabs Guitars by Mark Blanchard, Albert&Mueller, Paul Woolson, Collings, Composite Acoustics, and Derek Coombs "Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." Woods hands pick by eye and ear
Made to one with pride and love To be that we hold so dear A voice from heavens above Last edited by rick-slo; 07-09-2019 at 10:29 PM. |
#32
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But the loudness stuff is a newish (last 10 years or so? Not sure, maybe even more recent than that) attempt at defining appropriate levels for different sources. Bob Katz' approach was a bit early, and people have taken it from there, I think. Katz' idea, as best I can tell, was to try to get you to fool yourself by changing the metering scale, and then mix like you did on analog gear - with the sound centered near "0" (which for you is -14). So you end up with an average level of somewhere around -14db, with peaks upward. The newer LKFS metering systems sort of automate that by just reporting your average level, while still allowing you to use meters that show actual 0db. Two different approaches, roughly the same result. Both are ways to try to measure the perceived average loudness of a track, not just peaks, which can be deceiving. I'm sure Bob Womack, Joe Hannah and some others who mix professionally could offer a more accurate description. But my understanding is that there are some attempts at specs these days for broadcast, etc. CD's are apparently targetted at -15db (tho obviously no one is policing that, and I see lots of CDs with far hotter average levels, even fingerstyle guitar CDs) Here's a reasonable-looking explanation from Waves. https://www.waves.com/loudness-metering-explained
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar |
#33
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I guess that was a less than technical title. You know, the difference an unmixed recording and the final product, which is significantly louder.
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#34
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A common selling blurb on a limiter is how it does it's thing transparently. So the main thing is to simply increase the average volume of the music. Nevertheless there will be some distortion of the loudest transients where the limiter kicks in (though it may not be audibly apparent). So unless there are overs during the initial recording on a percussive instrument like a guitar I would rather use a volume envelope if there were some note or series of notes I would like to bring up or down in volume.
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Derek Coombs Youtube -> Website -> Music -> Tabs Guitars by Mark Blanchard, Albert&Mueller, Paul Woolson, Collings, Composite Acoustics, and Derek Coombs "Reality is that which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." Woods hands pick by eye and ear
Made to one with pride and love To be that we hold so dear A voice from heavens above Last edited by rick-slo; 07-10-2019 at 07:21 AM. Reason: correction added |
#35
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Tonebusters Barricade 4 is a pretty decent limiter at a very reasonable price. By far the best mastering plugin I use is the Leapwing Dynone - a mutiband compressor that always works in parallel
- and extraordinary tool.
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------ AJ Lucas Pavilion Sweep fan fret Santa Cruz OM/E (European Pre War) Martin J40 |
#36
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I've always heard it referred to as "commercial level"..........? ie: suitable for radio broadcast, etc.
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1993 Bourgeois JOM 1967 Martin D12-20 2007 Vines Artisan 2014 Doerr Legacy 2013 Bamburg FSC- 2002 Flammang 000 12 fret 2000 McCollum Grand Auditorium ______________________________ Soundcloud Spotify Mike McKee/Fred Bartlett Spotify playlist |
#37
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Funny you should put it that way -- when radio stations play a quiet record, they simply turn it up. And with everything else being more or less equal, material on the radio with a fair amount of dynamic range will usually sound more subjectively loud than a record that's been extremely brickwall-limited. Even though the brickwalled recording will be louder on your home stereo. Assuming you're one of the eleven people who still has a home stereo.
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#38
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More detailed info here: What's the Difference between Decibels and LUFS? Everything I've read tells -15db/-15LUFS would be a reasonable target for streaming applications but on the low side for a cd for which the target is the -8 - -10 range. There's a metering plugin called Levels that I started using some months ago. It allows you to set your LUFS targets and alerts you when you go over. It has a menu for various target presets (cd, YouTube, Spotify, etc) so you can master for the intended platform. The presets are adjustable so you're not locked into the plugins recommendations. It also keeps an eye on your peaks, the stereo field, and the dynamic range. I find it quite handy.
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |
#39
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar Last edited by Doug Young; 07-10-2019 at 12:32 PM. |
#40
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |
#41
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One of the goals of record-mastering, usually, is to deliver a sequence of songs where the listener doesn't have to fiddle with the volume control. But beyond that, I'm not bothered by the overall volume of one record being different from another. If I was a playlist person like you, though, I might think about loading it all into my DAW, evening out the levels, and then spitting it back out. Like Rhino does with their compilations. |
#42
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar |
#43
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This is an article that has some relevant info regarding "loudness" standards and music streaming platforms:
https://unlockyoursound.com/online-loudness/ Here's a site where you can upload a track and see if, or how much it will be "penalized" by Youtube, Spotify, TIDAL, Pandora, and Apple Sound Check. https://www.loudnesspenalty.com/
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#44
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Music: Spotify, Bandcamp Videos: You Tube Channel Books: Hymns for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), Christmas Carols for Fingerstyle Guitar (std tuning), A DADGAD Christmas, Alternate Tunings book Online Course: Alternate Tunings for Fingerstyle Guitar |
#45
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I just ran a couple of songs I mastered through the test site as well. The top was a master for cd; the bottom was a master for YouTube. The numbers are about what I expected.
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |