Martin is officially making too many guitars...

[zoopeda]

Originally Posted by drplayer

I've made a career (over 40-years) in Quality Assurance and have seen it all. If this is a mistake, it happens, and there simply aren't enough safeguards, safety nets, or checks & balances that can be put in place to catch every error--no matter how glaring they may seem. Martin makes close to 100,000 guitars a year, and I doubt anyone needs more than one hand to count the times they've seen this in the last 10-years or more. That's a darn good track record in the world I make my living in; and besides, it's a super easy fix. Much ado about nothin' if you ask me...

This is not a big deal. Certainly not the end of the world. It’s an easy fix, and I’m sure Martin will send the right pickguard to have sweetwater replace it. But it does suggest to me that, with as many eyes that see these $4000 guitars before they leave the factory—combined with those by sweetwater inspection—that the eyes inspecting all these guitars are probably fatigued. But it’s just a pickguard. And suddenly I’m wondering, are occasional major mistakes also present INSIDE these guitars? Do you think if companies like Martin were making 30-50,000 perfect guitar rather than “as many as possible”, that quality and consistency would go up? It’s a tough question if you really think it through.

[drplayer]

Originally Posted by zoopeda

This is not a big deal. Certainly not the end of the world. It’s an easy fix, and I’m sure Martin will send the right pickguard to have sweetwater replace it. But it does suggest to me that, with as many eyes that see these $4000 guitars before they leave the factory—combined with those by sweetwater inspection—that the eyes inspecting all these guitars are probably fatigued. But it’s just a pickguard. And suddenly I’m wondering, are occasional major mistakes also present INSIDE these guitars? Do you think if companies like Martin were making 30-50,000 perfect guitar rather than “as many as possible”, that quality and consistency would go up? It’s a tough question if you really think it through.

Nobody makes 30-50,000 perfect anything. Do you think Bourgeois, SCGC, Froggy Bottom, or Collings are 100% error free? I assure you, they are not...I’ve owned them all. The very fact that Martin makes close to 100,000 guitars a year is actually a testament to their success as a company and the quality of product they put out. People just keep buying them...even though an incorrect pickguard makes it on a guitar once every few years.

[Brucebubs]

Maybe the final touches are being done 'untouched by human hands'?

[zoopeda]

Originally Posted by drplayer

Nobody makes 30-50,000 perfect anything. Do you think Bourgeois, SCGC, Froggy Bottom, or Collings are 100% error free? I assure you, they are not...I’ve owned them all. The very fact that Martin makes close to 100,000 guitars a year is actually a testament to their success as a company and the quality of product they put out. People just keep buying them...even though an incorrect pickguard makes it on a guitar once every few years.

I know that human made products will always have errors. I guess I just saw this one as very glaring. I’m sure you can find a Toyota somewhere with some little metal piece of trim missing somewhere on the body. But would you ever find one in a showroom without a bumper or missing a hubcap? Where do we draw the line for what’s acceptable margin of error? This isn’t one sharp fret end or a cloudy spot in the finish. This is a missing hubcap on an otherwise beautiful (albeit expensive) car.

[EverettWilliams]

Originally Posted by zoopeda

This is not a big deal. Certainly not the end of the world. It’s an easy fix, and I’m sure Martin will send the right pickguard to have sweetwater replace it. But it does suggest to me that, with as many eyes that see these $4000 guitars before they leave the factory—combined with those by sweetwater inspection—that the eyes inspecting all these guitars are probably fatigued. But it’s just a pickguard. And suddenly I’m wondering, are occasional major mistakes also present INSIDE these guitars? Do you think if companies like Martin were making 30-50,000 perfect guitar rather than “as many as possible”, that quality and consistency would go up? It’s a tough question if you really think it through.

That’s my point - the pickguard doesn’t matter but it’s an embarrassingly obvious mistake. Anyone worth their salt doesn’t miss the low hanging fruit. Maybe Martin has enough robots building their instruments now that they don’t make mistakes. But someone at Martin missed this and surely with the numbers they’re pushing out, they’ve missed important stuff.

I’m not a Martin hater - I’m looking at eight of them right now, but I can’t for the life of me figure out why they think getting as big as possible is a wise move. This is tangible proof that they’re compromising in ways that I don’t like. Drplayer says Collings makes mistakes too - and that may be true, but they still have one guy picking the wood for each guitar and actual humans checking them out. I own and have owned a lot of Collings but I need to get out my loupe to start finding faults (there’s one peghead overlay I don’t like). I’ve never seen anything that suggests Fiat level reliability. Would love specific examples.

Martin earned its stripes when it was making 2500-3000 instruments a year. The copies of those are it’s high end authentics now. There’s nothing wrong with problematizing a company that’s gotten too big and is making sloppy mistakes.

[brencat]

Edit: I think the 000/OM is fine. One of them appears to be the 000-28 Modern Deluxe, and the other the OM-28 Modern Deluxe. You can tell by the red dot liquid metal bridge pins.

At first I thought they were the same guitar, but the one on the right has a slightly wider neck as it meets the body, which should be the OM with the 2 1/4 string spacing.

[Willie_D]

Kinda looks like it's wearing a Speedo.

[frankmcr]

LOL. Imagine if had been a J-45. The baying of the wolves would have been deafening.

But it's a Martin, so "Oh come on nobody's perfect what's the big deal who cares!"

[drplayer]

Originally Posted by frankmcr

LOL. Imagine if had been a J-45. The baying of the wolves would have been deafening.

But it's a Martin, so "Oh come on nobody's perfect what's the big deal who cares!"

Nope, not me, I’d feel the same way...because “nobody's perfect what's the big deal who cares!"

[drplayer]

Originally Posted by zoopeda

I know that human made products will always have errors. I guess I just saw this one as very glaring. I’m sure you can find a Toyota somewhere with some little metal piece of trim missing somewhere on the body. But would you ever find one in a showroom without a bumper or missing a hubcap? Where do we draw the line for what’s acceptable margin of error? This isn’t one sharp fret end or a cloudy spot in the finish. This is a missing hubcap on an otherwise beautiful (albeit expensive) car.

I think that’s a poor (or at least a grossly exaggerated) analogy. This guitar wasn’t missing a bridge or tuners or frets...it had the wrong shaped pick-guard. I spent a decade in the automotive industry, and know of examples of automobiles (pick your brand) being built with the wrong color interior, or the wrong trim package, or incorrect options. It happens...everywhere things are manufactured or assembled—in part or in whole—by human hands. I don’t mean to fluff this off...it’s not right, it’s embarrassing, and it needs to be corrected. But, it’s certainly no indication that Martin’s QC has deteriorated...they’re doing just fine.

[MikeBmusic]

"Too many guitars" - yup! Go to GuitarCenter.com and they have 297 different (new) model Martin guitars listed.

A friend was playing her new Martin all-HPL guitar last night. The neck is white birch with richlite firgerboard, felt chunky. I never heard of using birch for necks before - is it stable over the long run? Not sure why they would not use maple.
The plugged-in sound - not good. the acoustic sound (I just played for a minute) - nothing you could not also get out of a $200 Yamaha. She was happy because it sounded as good (to her) as her all-solid wood Martin that cost almost 10X as much and she can now 'decorate' it.

[jaymarsch]

Originally Posted by frankmcr

LOL. Imagine if had been a J-45. The baying of the wolves would have been deafening.

But it's a Martin, so "Oh come on nobody's perfect what's the big deal who cares!"

But just think, if it were a Taylor with a V shaped pick guard? Well, duck and cover!

I would actually be curious now to see a J-45 with that pick guard. Where's photoshop when I really need it?!

Who would have thought that something so minor would have garnered so much attention here? Slow guitar news stretch we are in, I guess.

Best,
Jayne

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by MikeBmusic

A friend was playing her new Martin all-HPL guitar last night. The neck is white birch with richlite firgerboard, felt chunky. I never heard of using birch for necks before - is it stable over the long run? Not sure why they would not use maple.

Birch is a very nice wood. It was used by some manufacturers to make guitar backs and sides in the earlier part of the 1900's. I haven't used birch for a guitar neck, but I don't know why it wouldn't be suitable, other than it not being one of the "usuals".

If cut and dried properly, it should be stable. Its properties can be similar to maple.


If your friend is happy with her 1/10-the-cost Martin, then Martin has a happy customer. She, and many others, get to have a guitar that says "Since 1833" on the head at 1/10 the cost. Different strokes...

[zoopeda]

Originally Posted by drplayer

I think that’s a poor (or at least a grossly exaggerated) analogy. This guitar wasn’t missing a bridge or tuners or frets...it had the wrong shaped pick-guard. I spent a decade in the automotive industry, and know of examples of automobiles (pick your brand) being built with the wrong color interior, or the wrong trim package, or incorrect options. It happens...everywhere things are manufactured or assembled—in part or in whole—by human hands. I don’t mean to fluff this off...it’s not right, it’s embarrassing, and it needs to be corrected. But, it’s certainly no indication that Martin’s QC has deteriorated...they’re doing just fine.

It’s an apt analogy because a hubcap is a highly visible but otherwise inexpensive and minimally essential part of the product. Like a pickguard, it’s no big deal to slap a new one on there, but it’s glaringly obvious when it’s missing or wrong.

No one’s claiming this is the end of the world. It’s not. But it raises an eyebrow. I own Martins and will buy more in the future. I love em. These modern deluxe D28s are pretty special guitars. I’m sure this one will get the right guard soon enough.

[ManyMartinMan]

Originally Posted by drplayer

Nobody makes 30-50,000 perfect anything. ...

You are, of course, absolutely correct. But as you see 4 pages of "much ado about nothing" because there are always those who can't let go of anything Martin.