Bone definitely not equal

[bobbyg67]

Bought a bone saddle online to raise the height on my d18 string action. I've heard there is inconsistency in density or whatever. The new saddle made the guitar brittle and loss of that full Martin sound. The old saddle sounds completely different. How do you get a good one?

[Dru Edwards]

Hey Bobby, it's possible you have an 'inconsistent' bone saddle but it's also possible it's not fitting as well as it should or that the bottom isn't sanded perfectly flat. Any chance that's the case?

[Rev Roy]

Many of us get our saddles, nuts, pins from Bob Colosi. Great guy with good products. http://www.guitarsaddles.com/

[bobbyg67]

don't believe its not being flat. fits good just sounds terrible to my ears. i've done some before but its been years ago. bought from colosi in the past. found them a lot cheaper. don't know if thats an issue or not. seems like there could be better quality. guess i'll go back to Bob and try again.

[Scolaguitar]

MacNichol saddles are reasonably priced and highly regarded here. You can get them on Amazon too.

[LakewoodM32Fan]

I have ordered three MacNichol compensated bone saddles for my Taylors and found them to be quite good.

With regards to making sure the bottom of your saddle is as close to perfectly flat as you can...I shaved my Collings saddle down a bit (after checking that I had the proper amount of relief in the neck) and was very unhappy with the sound change. I double checked and it's ever so slightly not flat (I have a straight metal edge and I can see light peeking through one side). But I took it down so low that if I sand it further to straighten it, the action will be too low.

So I placed my first order with Bob Colosi for a Collings saddle (MacNichol doesn't have one pre-shaped for Collings), and we'll see if it restores the sound to what I recall.

I also ordered the combo kit containing both saddle shims and veneers. I'll use the shims on my Lakewood whose saddle was taken way to low by a luthier many years ago and probably needs to be raised by 1mm, and I may also try to rescue the original Collings saddle by shaving it down to be perfectly straight and applying a veneer (which Bob says raises the saddle much less than a shim).

Items should arrive next week, I'll report back.

[Robin, Wales]

Originally Posted by bobbyg67

Bought a bone saddle online to raise the height on my d18 string action. I've heard there is inconsistency in density or whatever. The new saddle made the guitar brittle and loss of that full Martin sound. The old saddle sounds completely different. How do you get a good one?

That brittle tone could be created by the shape of the top of the saddle. Some of the bulk produced compensated bone saddles I have had have been a little "harsh" and I think that it is the narrow flat or sharp string release surfaces that cause the issue.

Try an old style straight round-topped saddle like the style they use on the Martin Authentics and Gibson Original guitars. You can pick up a straight bone blank with a rounded top for a few dollars on Ebay just to experiment. And you may find that for your playing style on your D-18 that you have no need for a modern compensated saddle.

I have shaped and fitted a couple of old style bone straight round-topped saddles to guitars recently and they have given a more mellow and fuller tone from the trebles than the bone compensated saddles they replaced.

[lowrider]

All guitars are different. I made a bone saddle to replace the micarta saddle in my MartinX and it sounded awful. The micarta went back in.

What was the original saddle in your guitar?

[bobbyg67]

Bone. its been in there for about 6 yrs. changed it to the new one and bad
brittle sound.

[perttime]

I'm a little surprised that more providers don't specify what bone is used.

[Scotso]

Originally Posted by bobbyg67

Bought a bone saddle online to raise the height on my d18 string action. I've heard there is inconsistency in density or whatever. The new saddle made the guitar brittle and loss of that full Martin sound. The old saddle sounds completely different. How do you get a good one?

It happens. Bone density can vary...or so I have been told. I have received replacement bone saddles from various sources that were meh. And most replacement saddles I have received need some sanding adjustment to fit length/width/height. Therefore, I am never sure if it is my adjustments, bone density or breakover issues that are causing the problem.

As a result of these problems I get my local certified luthier to make saddles from a bone blank. I reckon he is more qualified to make and adjust the saddle as needed. Over the years I have never had a bad one from him in my small sample size.

[Dru Edwards]

Originally Posted by perttime

I'm a little surprised that more providers don't specify what bone is used.

+1, although I've read that many are cattle bone. Bob Colosi's website states that his bone saddle/nuts are "byproducts of the beef industry".

[perttime]

Originally Posted by Dru Edwards

+1, although I've read that many are cattle bone. Bob Colosi's website states that his bone saddle/nuts are "byproducts of the beef industry".

That should work, perhaps depending on what part of the cow it comes from. Many luthiers in my corner of the world mention "moose shinbone" or something similar.

[OddManOut]

Originally Posted by bobbyg67

Bought a bone saddle online to raise the height on my d18 string action. I've heard there is inconsistency in density or whatever. The new saddle made the guitar brittle and loss of that full Martin sound. The old saddle sounds completely different. How do you get a good one?

I just had a bone saddle made by a local luthier (Larry Nair) to replace the stock Tusq saddle on my Furch OM . The fit to the slot was a prime consideration when he was making the saddle, not a minor detail. Larry took exact dimensions of the slot, spent some time rampling, polishing and radiusing the saddle. He also slotted the bottom of the saddle-a less common practice-to improve the saddle's conformation to the bottom of the saddle slot. It was all a very subtle thing. Small variations in the saddle can perceptibly affect tone. My best recommendation-if you're able-is to have a good luthier make you a saddle fitted to that particular guitar.

The bone saddle definitely gives more chime to the highs and more snap in the bass, less warmth than the Tusq. The bone saddle gives more sustain, too. Whether this change is desirable is an individual thing.

FWIW, I purchased a set of less expensive bone pins for a guitar and there was a tonal difference compared to good quality LMI pins. The cheaper pins were less dense and more brittle than the LMI pins.