QSC K8.2 and mixer as only main for duo/trio?

[GmanJeff]

Originally Posted by roylor4

Jon, Jeff & Steve - thanks for additional info and perspective.

Jeff, I have read reviews that the QSC Touchmix can be glitcy - have you had any problems with it?

I appreciate the suggestions for speakers to. The world of powered speakers is new to me - always been a powered mixer/passive speaker guy, so any and all education appreciated.

No real issues with the TM-8. The touchscreen can sometimes be finicky and requires a couple of tries to press a "button", but that's infrequent and not really bothersome. It has two operating modes - simple and advanced, and I have mostly stayed with the simple mode, which works nicely for me. If you have golden ears, the advanced mode lets you tweak things like EQ curves and effect attributes almost to infinity, but the presets offered through the FX and channel set-up wizards work great out of the box and I have found no reason to make things more complicated.

It makes some tasks very easy - when my bass player recently forgot his amp(!) at a gig and announced he'd have to go through the PA, it took hardly any time at all to set up a channel for him, using one of several presets for electric bass. EQ, compression, and other channel attributes were already configured in the preset and sounded very good. The gain wizard helped me make sure his channel gain was set optimally, even in a noisy bar where it would have been difficult for me to hear any slight distortion in the FOH had the gain been set too high, especially had he ended up playing more aggressively during the night as compared to when he first plugged in - the wizard can identify and hold for display those transient increases in input signal so I could adjust the input sensitivity accordingly.

While it's far more powerful than the analog mixer I used previously, transitioning to it was not difficult. QSC has a number of instructional videos available for it, and staying with the simple mode and taking advantage of the presets made coming on line with it relatively painless. A few features, like the gain setting wizard, have no analog mixer counterparts, so you do have to watch a video or read the manual to see how they work, but they're not complicated and do seem to help me obtain a cleaner and more refined sound than I would normally be able to get otherwise without those technologies.

[Br1ck]

I only have experience with QSC passive 15s, but if the rest of their products are as good as those, you'll be happy with the QSC quality. Anyone buy their "budget" line yet?

I run bass through a small PA as a last resort. Bass should have an amp IMHO.

And double the inputs you think you will ever need on any mixer you buy.

[jonfields45]

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

I saw these speakers in the store (but didn't audition them). They are very tiny! From your post it sounds like these little guys performance defies their diminutive size? Are these truly a big sound in a small package that might make one look twice before choosing the 12" model? Thx

I think a rock band or DJ would not be well served by them, but for acoustic music I think they are perfect. We carry our own equipment and are both in our 60's so trimming our gear to the minimum is a priority. Certainly the CP8 leaves nothing to be desired in a DBR10.

[gfa]

Originally Posted by roylor4

Jeff, I have read reviews that the QSC Touchmix can be glitcy - have you had any problems with it?

I've been using a Touchmix for a year or two with no issues or glitches. It does look like a lot to learn at first, but if you spend a couple of hours with the manual or the instructional videos you'll be up and running. Lotta tools in that little box.

[Stringmaster]

Originally Posted by jonfields45

I think a rock band or DJ would not be well served by them, but for acoustic music I think they are perfect. We carry our own equipment and are both in our 60's so trimming our gear to the minimum is a priority. Certainly the CP8 leaves nothing to be desired in a DBR10.

Appreciate the response!

[The Kid!]

Originally Posted by Groovekings

I have Yamaha DBR10's - usually just use one for up to 150 people and they will cover as a pair well over that. I use a small Soundcraft notepad 12 fx mixer - the combo is killer. Speakers only weigh 23 pounds each and are 129 db - major power. They are also 1/2 the cost of the QSC, which are also great, just heavier and more expensive. I think the DBR's will do everything you need them to do. My 2 cents

Yes, but the Soundcraft notepad 12 fx mixer won't have enough XLR's for the OP. The EFX8 or the EFX12 would be a better bet. Always get a few more channels than you think you'll need!

Plus the EFX8 & 12 have faders, channel mutes, mid sweeps, and more.

For speakers, the QSC, Yamaha, and other offerings in this class are a great pairing with these mixers. Try a few out with as much of your own equipment as possible or take advantage of the return policy at guitar center.

Allen & Heath Zeds are great too, but the Soundcrafts sound noticeably better to me and have better FX. I picked up a used (mint) EFX8 for $250 and I'm going to sell my Zed60 14FX now.

[roylor4]

Thank you for all this valuable input.

The QSC CP8 and Yamaha DBR10 have probably leapfrogged to the top of the list. One thing I neglected to say is that our gigging vehicle is a Corolla (I know, LOL) - so space is at a premium. Budget isn't a primary concern, but I'm not in the "well-off" category so it's in the equation.

The Touchmix is intriguing, but certainly not cheap. Sounds like lots of cool features though.

For simplicity, size/weight and budget I'm leaning strongly towards the DBR10 or CP8 and the Soundcraft EFX8.

I appreciate all the input, keep it coming - I'm learning quite a bit here.

[varmonter]

Hi
I play in a trio and we use the K10 qsc speakers.
we also use a sub. But we use electric bass as well.
If not for that the sub wouldn't be necessary.
We use a touchmix 16 board with lots of room
to spare. But i'd rather have a mackie board.
The k8 s are good maybe a bit small for us but we
paired down from K12s. I think you'll find
similar degrees of bass response lost as
you go down in size.

[firelakekid2]

You would also like the Yamaha DXR10 and the Soundcraft EFX8 or EFX12 if you need/want more channels.

[The Kid!]

Originally Posted by roylor4

Thank you for all this valuable input.

The QSC CP8 and Yamaha DBR10 have probably leapfrogged to the top of the list. One thing I neglected to say is that our gigging vehicle is a Corolla (I know, LOL) - so space is at a premium. Budget isn't a primary concern, but I'm not in the "well-off" category so it's in the equation.

The Touchmix is intriguing, but certainly not cheap. Sounds like lots of cool features though.

For simplicity, size/weight and budget I'm leaning strongly towards the DBR10 or CP8 and the Soundcraft EFX8.

I appreciate all the input, keep it coming - I'm learning quite a bit here.

I'd grab a Soundcraft EFX8 or EFX12 (as previously stated) in case you need more channels. They sound crazy good and are very easy to operate. I love the A&H Zed series, but the Soundcraft boards sound better and the FX are better too. I'd have an EFX12 instead of the 8 if it fit in my flight case.

I had a QSC Touchmix 16, and it was amazing, but I didn't like dealing with sub menus while I was playing. It can do a LOT though, and I loved mixing other people from out front with my ipad, as well as running my open mic with it.

In a live situation, I want to be able to reach over quickly and tweak a knob one handed. I felt like I needed two hands with the TM16 or the ipad to do what I needed.

As far as speakers go, there are some amazing choices at so many price points. I'd bring your board when you get it and the rest of your gear and see if they can set you up at guitar center to A/B some stuff.

My favorites in order are:

Line 6 L3M & L3T
Line 6 L2M & L2T
(the T models have a two channel mixer on the side.
I have an L3T, an L2T, and an L2M. I love the QSC K10's and they kicked them to the curb.

QSC K10 & 10.2
(I think they sound better than the 12's)
QSC K8 & 8.2
(Pretty wide dispersion too. I don't like them for floor monitors for that reason.)
QSC K12 & K12.2
(I feel like the .2 versions of the QSC sound about the same, but there's more options on the back.)

JBL PRX

EV ZLX

Yamaha DXR

Yamaha DBR

Try the QSC CP8 against a K8.2 and see if it's worth the upcharge. Try a K10.2 while you're at it. I see that space is an issue, but the 10's aren't much bigger than the 8's.

Whatever you choose should work fine. There are some great sounding choices out there at many different price points.

I got the QSC bags when I had my K10's. I'd rather slip on covers from a place like studio slips. Dealing with zipping them in and out of the bags was annoying.

Good luck, keep us posted!

[roylor4]

Thanks Kid!

Very informative post.

[Stringmaster]

I too am baffled (pun intended) by speaker choices! I've decided on the EFX8 mixer; I auditioned some speakers at GC the other day—namely the QSC's. My primary use would be solo or duo acoustic, and perhaps occasionally for vocals (only) with one of my 4-piece Blues or Country electric bands (we don’t play loud). Larger band gigs would have a sound system furnished.

Anyway in the store we mainly listened to the New CP12 and CP8, as well as the K10.2. The store employee who was pretty knowledgeable said he’s not impressed with the CP12's but likes the CP8's, and feels that the K series is a step up. So I walked away thinking that a pair of K10.2’s were the way to go. Now I’m thinking that they are way overkill for my needs. I’ll likely never need that much power or all of the features. I envision a system that is very full and warm sounding (kind of like a tube amp)vs punchy—perhaps the K10.2’s can be dialed in this way, but they sounded a bit “forward” in the store. The CP8’s would probably be adequate, but they just look so small! I’m wondering if I can dial in that warm low end with them. I figure that if I went K8.2's there’s not much difference from the K10.2’s so kind of ruled them out. I thought the CP12's sounded pretty good, despite the employee saying he didn’t like them (based on listening to speakers all day).
Here is a sample of the kind of sound I’d be going for (I only wish I could sing like Don!). Help!!

https://youtu.be/pM-7VaGoRqU

or here:

https://youtu.be/-l8IsaovF_M

Of course the above examples are in a great sounding room, with a pro at the board!

****Edit—since posting these questions (which I would still love to get input on) I hit another GC and the rep was really trying to sell me on the EV Evolve 50 for my needs. I gotta say I was pretty impressed with it, and the ease of setup and portability is definitely a plus—I’m still reluctant as I’m old school and used to more conventional systems—now my head is really spinning! Thoughts?

[The Kid!]

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

So I walked away thinking that a pair of K10.2’s were the way to go. Now I’m thinking that they are way overkill for my needs. I’ll likely never need that much power or all of the features.

The K10's and K10.2's may be overkill for some, and maybe most of your situations, but you'll be glad you have them when you get into a situation where you need more volume.

Also: I'd rather have a more powerful speaker working well within its limits than a less powerful speaker shouting it's lungs out to keep up. I'd go with clean and clear power with the added headroom. I like the K10's better than the K12's. Quicker recovery and more accurate for guitar and vocals.

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

I envision a system that is very full and warm sounding (kind of like a tube amp)vs punchy—perhaps the K10.2’s can be dialed in this way, but they sounded a bit “forward” in the store.

Could have been the room, the reference material, the proximity to the speakers, or all of that and more. The pro audio room isn't a real world listening environment.

It's a good start, but you may not know until you have a few different gigs in various rooms under your belt. Find a busy month and take advantage of that 30 day return policy.

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

The CP8’s would probably be adequate, but they just look so small! I’m wondering if I can dial in that warm low end with them. I figure that if I went K8.2's there’s not much difference from the K10.2’s so kind of ruled them out. I thought the CP12's sounded pretty good, despite the employee saying he didn’t like them (based on listening to speakers all day).

What matters most is what you hear in a real gig situation. The CP8's might be the ticket, but the 10.2's might be a better choice in case you ever need a little more.

Keep the dispersion angles in mind too. The 8's have the widest, and the 12's the most narrow of that series with the 10's being somewhere in the middle. That's why I don't like the 8's for floor monitors.

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

Here is a sample of the kind of sound I’d be going for (I only wish I could sing like Don!). Help!!

https://youtu.be/pM-7VaGoRqU

or here:

https://youtu.be/-l8IsaovF_M

Of course the above examples are in a great sounding room, with a pro at the board!

Not apples to apples as you stated. Looks like a high end Martin with a nice large diaphragm condenser mic in a nicely treated listening room with (as stated) a pro at the board.

I'll assume they were running everything through a carefully thought out pro system, (subs, outboard rack gear, flown speakers,... ) and not just two powered boxes on sticks.

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

****Edit—since posting these questions (which I would still love to get input on) I hit another GC and the rep was really trying to sell me on the EV Evolve 50 for my needs. I gotta say I was pretty impressed with it, and the ease of setup and portability is definitely a plus—I’m still reluctant as I’m old school and used to more conventional systems—now my head is really spinning! Thoughts?

For a band, no. These systems can work in the right situations, but placement is paramount. A scalable modular PA can be made to work in every situation, and isn't that much more complicated. Especially with the lightweight options available these days.

All of this is in my opinion as someone who runs sound from the stage as well as front of house sometimes.

If I were in your situation, I'd start with a 16 channel mixer (always get twice as many channels as you think you'll need, two powered FOH speakers (add monitors later, (an eventually) an active crossover and subs (if need be)

Personally, I don't like to go without subs unless its strictly a vocals only PA. Properly used, subs can really add punch to and clean up your tops to do what they're designed to do.

Best of luck!

[Stringmaster]

Originally Posted by The Kid!

The K10's and K10.2's may be overkill for some, and maybe most of your situations, but you'll be glad you have them when you get into a situation where you need more volume.

Also: I'd rather have a more powerful speaker working well within its limits than a less powerful speaker shouting it's lungs out to keep up. I'd go with clean and clear power with the added headroom. I like the K10's better than the K12's. Quicker recovery and more accurate for guitar and vocals.



Could have been the room, the reference material, the proximity to the speakers, or all of that and more. The pro audio room isn't a real world listening environment.

It's a good start, but you may not know until you have a few different gigs in various rooms under your belt. Find a busy month and take advantage of that 30 day return policy.



What matters most is what you hear in a real gig situation. The CP8's might be the ticket, but the 10.2's might be a better choice in case you ever need a little more.

Keep the dispersion angles in mind too. The 8's have the widest, and the 12's the most narrow of that series with the 10's being somewhere in the middle. That's why I don't like the 8's for floor monitors.



Not apples to apples as you stated. Looks like a high end Martin with a nice large diaphragm condenser mic in a nicely treated listening room with (as stated) a pro at the board.

I'll assume they were running everything through a carefully thought out pro system, (subs, outboard rack gear, flown speakers,... ) and not just two powered boxes on sticks.



For a band, no. These systems can work in the right situations, but placement is paramount. A scalable modular PA can be made to work in every situation, and isn't that much more complicated. Especially with the lightweight options available these days.

All of this is in my opinion as someone who runs sound from the stage as well as front of house sometimes.

If I were in your situation, I'd start with a 16 channel mixer (always get twice as many channels as you think you'll need, two powered FOH speakers (add monitors later, (an eventually) an active crossover and subs (if need be)

Personally, I don't like to go without subs unless its strictly a vocals only PA. Properly used, subs can really add punch to and clean up your tops to do what they're designed to do.

Best of luck!

Thanks for taking the time to write such an informative response!

[The Kid!]

Originally Posted by Stringmaster

Thanks for taking the time to write such an informative response!

Anytime, my brother. Buy once, cry once. You'll save money in the long run. Do as much research as possible and try out whatever you can. Best of luck!