Bridge or Chorus?

[Dave Hicks]

Originally Posted by Jim Comeaux

OK, I read the posts, I think I understand what was said, but then what is a “refrain”?

Sometimes it's a repeating catch phrase at the end of a verse like "Fa-la-diddle-day" or "Fare thee well my honey, fare thee well".

D.H.

[JonPR]

Originally Posted by sprucetophere

Thanks, much of what I’m reading describes the song as containing a double bridge with the same melody and different lyrics for each bridge.

Color me confused.

"While My Guitar Gently Weeps" has no "chorus". Excluding intro and coda, it's a classic ABA format ("ternary" form) and the B is the "bridge" or "middle 8". The three-part ABA classical form is unusual in popular music, which traditionally uses AABA, but this song has a 16-bar A section rather than the conventional 8 bars, so to double it would have felt unnecessarily long.

A1 = "I look at you all..."
B1 = "I don't know why nobody told you..."
A2 = "I look at the world..."

A3 = [guitar solo]: 16 bars
B2 = "I don't know how you were diverted"
A4 = "I look at you all..." (reprise of A1)

Each section is 16 bars, each consisting of 8-bar sequences played twice. I.e., although they would have called the bridge the "middle 8" it's actually 16 bars, 8 repeated. That may be why you've seen it called a "double bridge" - although there are two bridges as well (different lyrics second time).

The A "verses" consist of four 4-bar phrases (a kind of "nested" ABAB within the 16), with a "refrain" as the 2nd and 4th lines: that's the title phrase "While [or Still] my guitar gently weeps".

A "refrain" performs a similar function to a chorus - the main "hook" part of a song repeated several times (same lyric as well as same tune and chords), encouraging listeners to join in. ("Chorus" means "multiple voices", usually in a responding role.)

Choruses are often known as "refrains". The difference - when there is one - is that a refrain is shorter. It might only be one line, typically the last line of a verse. Sometimes in folk songs, the refrain - as here - is the 2nd and 4th lines of each verse as in "Scarborough Fair" ("Parsely sage rosemary and thyme" ... "then she'll be a true love of mine" - that's the refrain.)

So the recurring title of "[While / Still] My Guitar Gently Weeps" is a text-book example of a "refrain".

If you want deeper theoretical commentary, try this: https://www.icce.rug.nl/~soundscapes...WP/wmggw.shtml

[Gdjjr]

Originally Posted by TBman

I think the answer is obvious.

Bridge and chorus:

[mr. beaumont]

Whew, we got complicated.

There's different types of songwriting. In an AABA form, used quite a bit by the Beatles and in jazz/tin pan alley/show tunes, the bridge is simply the B section. To further confuse things, showtunes will often have a "verse," which is played BEFORE the AABA format.

In pop/rock/folk songwriting (verse/chorus structure) the bridge is a third section that is not the Verse or Chorus. It's often played after the second chorus, but there's no hard and fast rule.

[KevWind]

Perhaps a bit more simplified ,,,,in my understanding of how the term is in the profession of Songwriting (not pro myself, but know some and from work shops with pro's )

A bridge is simply and alternate (take on , look at ,or observation of ) the main theme lyrically, (or musically in an instrumental). Then expressed in either the verses or chorus . Which works in a typical verse, chorus, verse, chorus type song or for the B section of an AABA song

[Brent Hahn]

Originally Posted by Jim Owen

Harrison wouldn’t have used the term “bridge.” He tended to use the term “middle eight”—the B part of tunes that went AABA

That's a Brit-ism that's still around. In this case, it's actually a "middle 16."

[Laughingboy68]

To me, this is classic Beatles form. They often had a short refrain to end the verse sections. We Can Work it Out is like this. The title as a lyric provides the refrain in both WMGGW and WCWiO. Both songs also use a musically arresting middle eight or bridge. In WMGGW the key change is the twist, in WCWiO it's a change in meter. In both songs the middle eight is so good that they couldn't resist playing it twice.

One of the keys to the chorus in modern music is that it is usually the strongest hook. In Beatles music, often all the parts are so catchy that it's hard to determine which is the strongest hook.

If my take on this isn't clear, basically I agree with everything JonPR said.

[Italuke]

George would have called that the "middle eight." But to us, it's the bridge.

The thing to remember is that not every song has a chorus. Or a bridge.

It's an art, not a science. Stop thinking black/white.