Help with Refinishing 1958 Gibson

[EarthTrot]

Aloha everyone,

I've been trying to date an old Gibson for awhile and thanks to this resource, I think I'm getting closer to being able to put a date and model on this guitar. It looks like a 1958 LG-3. Does that sound right?

I found it in my 79 year old auntie's closet. She has alzheimers and doesn't know much about it but she was an avid garage-saler. Anyway, I took it to a luthier and he said it was in decent shape but someone had tried to refinish it before and there were a lot of spots where the finish was dripping.

I'm trying to refinish it again now, and have it all sanded down but am struggling to find parts for it. The pickguard is proving difficult though there seems to be some options on eBay. Does anyone have any experience in refinishing these things and/or any resources that they'd recommend? As you can likely tell, I'm extremely new to all this.

I've managed to sand down the headstock enough to remove someone's SSN that was etched into it, but I lost the Gibson logo too. I kinda new that would happen but not sure the best way to put the logo back on it.

If anyone has any thoughts, please feel free to reach out. Here's a link to the pictures.

Thank you so much!

Mike

[mirwa]

Its a shame you did not ask before starting to remove the finish, fingers crossed its all okay.

Power sanders leave swirt marks in the wood, those swirl marks start to appear when you shellac the surface, you need to hand sand until they are gone.

Hopefully the top has not been thinned too much, less than 2.5mm thickness is likely close to a top change now

Steve

[charles Tauber]

What sort of finish had you planned to apply?

[EarthTrot]

Yeah, I definitely should have posted here first. Because my family doesn't want it and I was told it was going to cost what it was worth to refinish it, I decided to have a go at it. Thought I'd make it into something I could kick around and try to learn Keb Mo style slide blues guitar with. Obviously I'm not very knowledgeable here, but I will do my best to remove the sanding circles.

I did the neck by hand with 220 and the rest was done with the orbital. I was planning to next hit everything with a 320 and a 600 after that, but again, I have no idea how this stuff is done...

[EarthTrot]

@Charles - I really like the look of the natural color now that it is sanded down. I'd love to put a satin finish on it, but I'm certainly wide open to suggestions. At this point I'm still trying to find the bridge and pick guard for it.

[charles Tauber]

The bridge - and probably fingerboard - on that guitar are Brazilian rosewood. You won't easily find a replacement for it in Brazilian rosewood. Does that matter sound-wise? Probably not. It just seems a shame to replace it unless it needs to be.

"High quality" finishing work requires considerable knowledge and skill. Some types of finishes are easier to apply than others, require simpler, cheaper tools to apply and some are more forgiving than others.

The starting point is to determine what level of experience/aptitude you have and what application tools you have available or are willing to invest in. That will determine what finish choices you have.

The simplest, cheapest and most forgiving to apply is to wipe on a drying oil, such as linseed, tung, "Danish", etc. I do not recommend that on guitars.

A wipe-on poly finish is fairly easy and inexpensive to apply and is available in a satin sheen. You need a can of finish, some rags or brush and some fine sandpaper/abrasive for levelling. It smells bad and is flammable, so one needs to take appropriate precautions with ventilation and management/disposal of application rags.

A wipe on TruOil is another possibility, one I haven't used, but many have had success in using. It requires many light coats. You can find detailed instructions on-line on how to apply it for guitar finishing.


You will also need to decide if you want a smooth finish or a "textured" one. That is, to fill the open pores of the mahogany, or leave them un-filled. Left un-filled, you will have a pitted finished surface.

For most sanding of bare wood prior to finishing, sanding to 220 is sufficient.

[EarthTrot]

Charles - Thank you!

While I’ve never done this before, I have some skill with carpentry (fully gutted and refinished several homes, built cabinets and bed frames) and some artistic qualities (graduated from Art Institute, worked as graphic artists for 20 years). Not that any of that has much to do with guitars, but I’m kinda a perfectionist with things I try to do.

I should be able to manage a wipe on poly finish. That sounds doable. The fingerboard seems pretty good, the bridge I don’t know. It’s ok I guess but I think I’d rather replace it.

I’m ok with the pitted finish, I think. Though if you think it’s better with the smooth I’m open for sure!

[mirwa]

Yes LG-3, 56-59, at my best guess. If its original, which I dont doubt from the photos, its a shame you have tackled the job yourself.

I am going to talk dollars as people seem to understand the value of a good luthier in this situation

As it was i think it was worth 2500usd

If you had it restored and repaired by a good luthier at a cost of say 400usd not playing with the finish, I think it would have been a 4000usd guitar

In perfect immaculate original condition these have fetched up to 8000 usd

If you continue on the path your going, i think with replacement pickguard, replacement bridge, non original finish, this might be worth 800 dollars if your lucky.

It really is the type of guitar you should have done properly and finished properly.

Its not too late to give it to someone.

Just my opinion

Steve

[EarthTrot]

Steve - Thank you for your input and putting dollars on it. Perhaps you're right. I was quoted it was probably worth around $2500 restored and that it would cost close to that to restore it. This was by a local luthier, but I'm sure his numbers were probably a little far off.

To me, it's not about the money or the value of the guitar. I'm a mediocre guitar player who probably doesn't deserve to have this guitar. Of all the guitars I have this one is certainly one of the most valuable, and in by far the roughest shape. But, the guitar reminds me of my auntie whom I love very much and in who's closet I found it. And it reminds me of how she was when she was lucid. Now she is a shell of herself and Alzheimer's has taken her over almost completely.

The guitar needed bridge work and that's where I started with it, but as I looked into it further it needed a bit more. I'm not planning on selling it, so the value doesn't matter to me. What I'd like to do is to restore it to a nice playable condition. I'd like it to be a guitar that I pickup and play and can hang on my wall if it comes out looking like I think it could.

I'm not a complete scrub when it comes to woodworking, and I think I can get it there. Though with that said, I do need a lot of advice as there aren't very many luthiers on my island, I've never traveled down this road before and I don't have the knowledge that you or most of the others in this forum have.

But, this is a project that makes me happy and is a fun escape for me at the moment.

[godfreydaniel]

In the photo of the soundhole it looks like there’s a crack where the fretboard ends at the soundhole. If it is a crack it needs to be repaired or more serious damage will occur once it’s ready to be strung up. That’s a very common area for a crack to occur in old Gibsons.

[EarthTrot]

@godfreydaniel - Thanks! That does seem like a small crack there. I’ll look into how to fix this and if it’s something I can do or will need a hand with.

[ManyMartinMan]

Since the guitar was already poorly refinished, the "original" value of the guitar had been decimated. You've done a lot of the time intensive labor on this. However, prior to finishing the wood, I would take it to a good luthier and have the neck angle evaluated and a neck reset done if required (or even close). I would also have the fretboard examined and re-fretted as well as the braces checked and any cracks professionally cleated.

At this point it's pointless to reassemble everything and not have the total package tweaked to ensure great playability even in the knowledge you have no idea how it will sound and perform when done. Those things that remain undone are what will give it any resale value if you ever decide to part with it. Now that I'm subscribed, I'll wait to see how the project goes.

[EarthTrot]

@ManyMartinMan - Thank you! Yeah that’s probably a good idea. Unfortunately I’ve reached out to a couple guys but haven’t heard back from any of them yet. I’ll keep you posted...

[EarthTrot]

Hi Guys,

Well, I have the guitar all sanded down with 220, 320 and then with a 600 just for the heck of it. It's pretty smooth and I've decided to keep it kinda porous as I like the grain feel to the guitar. I've also decided to use Tru-oil to finish it. I'm probably going to start this process today but I do have a question for you folks...

As I think I noted before, I lost the Gibson logo when sanding down the headstock. I did get a replacement waterslide graphic that I will put on and then I'll have the headstock sprayed to keep it in place. My question though, is should I put the decal on first before I finish with the Tru-Oil or after? I'm thinking after as I don't want to have it slide or run into the possibility of messing it up in any way, but I also want to make sure it stays in place and I don't know if it will stick as well to the Tru-oil finish rather than the wood.

Any thoughts? After the Tru-oil, right?

Thanks guys!

Oh, also, I did take your advice and talked to a luthier who will set it up for me and finish it off a little bit too after I get it stained. Thanks for all your help, I'll post more pictures soon!

[nikpearson]

I’ve used Tru-oil twice and Liberon Danish Oil once - on the same guitar!

It was the first guitar I built and took three attempts to get a finish I was okay with. The first attempt with Tru-oil didn’t go well as I found the oil to be far to viscous; later realised that the supplier had decanted Tru-oil from a large bottle to a small one and that Tru-oil is not quite that thick. By then I’d already used some Danish oil with a UV filter in it which has so far kept the purple heart wood used on this instrument a lovely vibrant colour. The danish oil was incredibly thin and needed a lot of coats to build up a reasonable amount of finish.

The other problem I had was that sanding scratches in the top that were invisible to the eye on the unfinished instrument really popped out once it was oiled. I have since sanded the instrument back and re-finished with a fresh bottle of Tru-oil. Whilst it builds up reasonably quickly it is still fairly easy to apply when fresh. You can produce a mid-sheen finish with Tru-oil if you apply enough coats.

I have one article on using oil finishes, particularly Tru-oil, which I found very useful. The main theme was preparing the wood very carefully with Micromesh. This does really help in producing a good finish but it can be hard to get a near perfect finish on the softwood soundboard. Hardwood back and sides come up beautifully. There also an article in GAL by Kevin Aram, a famous U.K. classical guitar builder, who uses oil finish almost exclusively - I might be able to dig that up as well.

My gut feeling is that producing a flawless oil finish is no easier than achieving a perfect shellac finish - used on my last steel-string guitar - that is they are both very challenging. It almost certainly takes longer to French polish an instrument but I think I may prefer the final look, a very natural looking gloss. Both of these finishes are relatively easy to repair but also considerably less durable than the finishes used by the majority of makers. I mainly chose these as they need little specialist equipment and are pleasant to use. French-polishing is particularly relaxing.

PM me if you’d like the articles.