Girl song vs. Guy Song

[FingahPickah]

Interesting thread...

For me it depends heavily on the quality of the song... sometimes substituting "gender" words doesn't even apply.

There is a huge difference between performing Joni's "Both Sides Now" (an example of masterful song writing) which goes so far beyond a simple interpretation of a once young girl's changing view of romantic love... and Connie Francis' hit "Where the Boys Are"

A male performing (solo) Carole King's "Will You Still Love Me Tomorrow" works (IMO) because it's a great song.

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

Regarding that song "I'm A Man"

Problem solved!

OMG, this is good. Now I can add that one to my endless repertoire of blues songs I want to learn.

[rllink]

I got this covered. My wife is a very good singer. She carries me on the gender female songs. She has also recently started playing bass. So win win.

[Brent Hahn]

Useless Factoid: Bacharach and David's "Message to Michael" was originally "Message to Martha." And apparently Hal David was dead set against both letting Dionne Warwick record the song and changing the name.

[Italuke]

I look at performing, in general, as playing a character. I've often thought this is why I don't really write songs, that that fire to "express myself" never sparked. In a way, and this is wrong of course, but for me, all the great songs have already been written.

So...if a "girl" song is good enough for me to need to do it, I won't change it at all. I'll be that character and convey that. Then I'll do the next song, in character.

[phydaux]

Salty Dog is an old Bluegrass standard. It was sung by the Darlings on the Andy Griffith show, which is actually The Dillards plus Maggie Peterson.

Since Maggie was singing the song she made it a girl song by changing the lyrics to “Let me be your Salty Dog or I won’t be your gal at all.” Which is interesting to say the least when you consider what the slang term “salty dog” means.

[TheSaint]

A great example here...

https://youtu.be/aN5s9N_pTUs

[The Bard Rocks]

I think it is a bad idea to alter especially well-known songs. I have no personal problem interchanging the sex - but many people do. Sometimes its easier to just find another song.

Originally Posted by The Bard Rocks

I think it is a bad idea to alter especially well-known songs. I have no personal problem interchanging the sex - but many people do. Sometimes its easier to just find another song.

It's a tough call - to modify or not. While riding my bicycle last weekend, I was listening to American Top 40. I can't remember the year, but it was the year in which Captain and Tenille had a hit with Smokey Robinson's "Shop Around." They modified some of the lyrics for her, but not all of them, and it was jarring. It did not work for me. She sang it fine, but the lyrics were a jumble. OTOH, it made the charts, so who am I to say what's what??? I guess if it feels right for the person singing it, that's probably all that counts.

[TomB'sox]

Originally Posted by phydaux

Salty Dog is an old Bluegrass standard. It was sung by the Darlings on the Andy Griffith show, which is actually The Dillards plus Maggie Peterson.

Since Maggie was singing the song she made it a girl song by changing the lyrics to “Let me be your Salty Dog or I won’t be your gal at all.” Which is interesting to say the least when you consider what the slang term “salty dog” means.

it is my understanding that in the south calling someone your salty dog just refers to them as one of your favorite people. From the urban slang dictionary:

Salty Dog 1. Appalachian slang for favorite person, i.e. best friend or lover. Derived from the practice of rubbing salt on hunting dogs to keep off ticks. Since salt was commonly in limited supply, one would only do this to their favorite dog, and it became slang for favorite person.

Based on that, I think the change in lyrics is fine?

BTW, I loved the episodes where the Darlings (Dillards) would play!

[jseth]

As many have said, it really depends on the song in question... for instance, John Prine's classic, "Angel From Montgomery", would just sound WRONG to change to "a man's viewpoint", in my mind...

If it's just a pronoun or two, that's a different story.

I always loved Lyle Lovett doing "Stand By Your Man"... he used to do it when he first came on the performing scene, when he played simply as a guitar/cello duo... and he did absolutely straight-faced and serious... and he KILLED IT!

In the final analysis, do what works for YOU, and feel good about your choices! You've got to believe in whatever song you're playing or it's gonna fall flat on its face...

[Mycroft]

Originally Posted by janinep7

The discussion of Willin' by Seatrain, et. al., got me thinking about girl songs vs guy songs. If I had to put Willin' in one of those categories, I'd say it's more of a guy song. Linda Ronstadt did not change the lyrics to make it into a "girl song" or gender neutral song. She just sang it as it was written.

Yesterday, I was listening to Bo Diddley sing "I'm a Man" and officially got bitten by the Blues Bug. Turns out that is an easy song to learn and play, at least the guitar part, but it's definitely a guy song. A lot of the blues songs that I love are also guy songs. It won't hold me back from learning them; it may make me think twice about playing them in public and singing them in the BART station, but probably not for very long.

What do you all do in these situations? Just sing it as written and toss gender to the wind? Try to convert it to a more gender appropriate or neutral version by tweaking the lyrics, though I have to say, I'm reluctant to do that because I don't like it when I hear songs that have been adjusted in that way. It's jarring, especially if it's a song I really like and know well, like I'm a Man.

I'm really curious to hear what people have to say on this subject.

Nothing about "Willin" specified gender. Just a truck driver looking forward to seeing "Dallas Alice."

As someone noted, I have long thought of singers as inhabiting a character.

I've long been a fan of Cowboy Junkies, and think their primary songwriter, Michael Timmins, is criminally underrated. He is often writes lyrics from a male perspective that are sung my his sister Margo. But he also can write powerfully from a female perspective, such as and that can only be sing from a woman's perspective. Try and listen to "Hunted" without feeling a chill for my female brethren. And some songs are could be undetermined; Susie cutting carrots still, waiting on "Oregon Hill."

I really love "River Song trilogy" and simply can not switch the gender of the protagonist, so John will forever be sitting at my side on firmer ground, with Venus past his face.

Originally Posted by Mycroft

Nothing about "Willin" specified gender. Just a truck driver looking forward to seeing "Dallas Alice."

So you're saying don't change it to "Wallace, Wallace, Wallace?"

[Mycroft]

Originally Posted by janinep7

So you're saying don't change it to "Wallace, Wallace, Wallace?"

No more than I change John Prine's lyric: "I am an old woman, named after my mother..."

[foxo]

It’s interesting - I wrote a song from the perspective of an old woman about her cheating husband and I don’t feel at all awkward singing it. I would love to hear a woman sing it though.

Rotten Fruit

Once the apples from my tree
Were fleshy and divine
Now they’re rotten from the seed
And not fit for the swine
And where the sparrows used to feed
Sit ravens in a line
And adders slithering silently
Through the ivy and the vines

Once this land was arable
With fertile fields around
Destroyed by mines and railway tracks
And slag heaps in great mounds
Now drilling and machinery
Replace the pastoral sounds
As I lie awake at night
To the howling of the hounds

Once I tried to bear a child
Yet fate would not allow
Each time I tried would wound me more
I’m worn and haggard now
I see the man I once did love
Who broke our wedding vows
I see the piglets on the farm
Still suckling at the sow