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  #1  
Old 12-20-2012, 12:38 PM
Mark Farrar Mark Farrar is offline
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Default First build problem - Removing a abalone rosette

Hi,

Had my first building disaster today I installed an abalone rosette and everything looked great until it went through the sander and some of the abalone disapeared! What I thought and was told was abalone when I bought it has turned out to be a laminate with just a thin layer of abalone. I guess thats what I get for buying it off eBay!

So now I really need to remove it and was wondering if anyone has any tips to getting it out? Is the only option to cut it out with a router?

Cheers,

Mark
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Old 12-20-2012, 01:19 PM
Go4aRyd Go4aRyd is offline
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I think that depends on how it was installed, as there are many ways to do it. Would also be helpful to know what wood it was installed in, how deep, and how wide, if there was trim in or out, etc. A photo is worth a thousand words.

If I had used CA, on a relatively solid wood like spruce, I would likely first try to dissolve it and use a tiny pick to lift up the pieces. If the CA was poured heavy so that dissolving it would be difficult (or impossible), I would look at methods to cut it out (chisel & razor blade, dremel, router, etc.), but that would depend on other install variables including depth of install, width of material I need out, etc. I first inclination would be to make a new rosette slightly deeper and wider than the original - but that may not be pragmatic for your build.

I am sure others with more experience will chime in shortly. Hang in there. Stuff happens to everyone. I would move on to other steps (back, brace building, neck, etc) while you search for a solution or course of action.
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Old 12-20-2012, 03:04 PM
Mark Farrar Mark Farrar is offline
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Default First build problem - Removing a abalone rosette

It was glued in with two part epoxy. It is 5mm wide unknown material and about 1.5mm depth into the sinker redwood soundboard. It has two thin purfling strips on either side of 0.3 and 0.5.

Is using heat an option with epoxy? Or is cutting really the only way?
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:01 PM
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Cutting it out is the best way according to Tim. He wouldn't use heat.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:14 PM
Mark Farrar Mark Farrar is offline
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Default First build problem - Removing a abalone rosette

Are standard steel cutting tools ok for removing shell or whatever the backing is?
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Old 12-20-2012, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Farrar View Post
Are standard steel cutting tools ok for removing shell or whatever the backing is?

You will want to use Carbide cutters.
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Old 12-21-2012, 10:12 AM
ZekeM ZekeM is offline
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Default First build problem - Removing a abalone rosette

Have you cut the soundhole yet?

If you have then I would make a soundhole plug and out a pin in the center and use my circle cutting jig and router and just cut that sucker out like Mary and Tim said. You may have to take the purfling out and redo the whole rosette. It would probably be easier than trying to save the purfling. Depending on how it goes you may have to make the channel a little bigger and install a slightly larger rosette.

You have learned a valuable lesson with shell inlay! I found out the hard way too. You never know what lies just below the surface of the shell. I think it's best to get shell as close as possible to its finished height because once you sand the surface off it may not look as good.

Good luck with your repair.
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Old 12-21-2012, 10:31 AM
mb propsom mb propsom is offline
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I would recommend Zeke's method of making a plug and either routering out the material, or better yet, if the other side of the top is good, do the rosette on that side. If you get the router pin hole in the plug off center just a hair on your original side, you're not going to be able to get the ab from between the purf lines evenly, and you'll have a mess. By using on the other side, you start out with a blank slate as it were, guaranteeing that all elements of your rosette will be equidistant from each other because you'll be starting fresh. Of course, there is the possibility of routering into the old rosette on the other side, but just make a "full circle" soundhole reinforcement on the inner side to ensure structural integrity.
Just a suggestion. Good luck and have fun. Repairing screw ups is how a person really learns the craft. I've done a lot of learning that way.
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Old 12-21-2012, 11:08 AM
arie arie is offline
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cutting seems to be the choice. i might also add that you take small depth cuts when you rout because if the cutter grabs a piece when engaged in a deep cut, you could take out a chunk of your redwood top if the piece of shell blows through the rosette wall. i wouldn't depend upon the purfling to help out much here. also Zeke's soundhole plug is a good idea just to be safe.

a "down-cutting" or "reverse spiral" carbide bit is what i would use. the downward pressure from these tools tends to hold things in place a bit when doing pocket work rather then lifting them out.

p.s. don't forget to wear a mask -shell dust is nasty.

Last edited by arie; 12-21-2012 at 11:15 AM.
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Old 12-21-2012, 04:38 PM
Mark Farrar Mark Farrar is offline
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Default First build problem - Removing a abalone rosette

Thanks for the replies, my teacher suggested exactly what mb propsom said about just doing the rosette on the other side and because of the soundhole reinforcement piece it will be covered at not be an issue. When I cut the slot for the new inlay I won't go very deep so as not to go through to the other cut. I have ordered another rosette and the seller says its definitely solid abalone but will have a good check this time!
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Old 12-23-2012, 09:58 AM
mb propsom mb propsom is offline
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By the way, Mark. I don't know who your pearl/ab supplier is, but I highly recommend Andy DePaule's company. He's been my go to pearl man for years now. As quite a few here on the AGF will attest, both Andy's product and service are excellent. Very reasonable prices also. I stopped cutting my own custom logo a few years back, after I discovered he could make them for barely more than it cost me for the shell blank.
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Old 12-23-2012, 03:04 PM
Mark Farrar Mark Farrar is offline
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Default First build problem - Removing a abalone rosette

Funny you should say that I actually got my abalone lettering for my headstock from Andy and I am about to send him a custom design for my fretboard! I think I will get all my abalone from him in future, the only reason I didn't go with him for the rosette was he didn't have the size I was looking for. I should have just asked him to have one made!
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