pa system vs acoustic amp

[odonnell421]

i am looking to buy an acoustic amp for my acoustic/electric, but i came across the idea of a pa system...http://www.music123.com/Kustom-Profi...A-i61048.music
something like that, over an acoustic amp because i would be able to do something at a coffee house, or play in my room....any advice? I am looking in the 200-400 dollar range haha... thanks

[Stixx]

Originally Posted by odonnell421

i am looking to buy an acoustic amp for my acoustic/electric, but i came across the idea of a pa system...http://www.music123.com/Kustom-Profi...A-i61048.music
something like that, over an acoustic amp because i would be able to do something at a coffee house, or play in my room....any advice? I am looking in the 200-400 dollar range haha... thanks

I use a Yamaha powered mixer and two large speakers . To properly gig with it I like to add monitors . Then end result is a lot of heavy stuff. Smaller pa's like the Kustom make sense if the room small enough.
Fender makes one , the passport , Peavey has one as well. These all have
limitations but seem viable solutions . When You get more money though the
Bose PAS is the best sounding for a vocal and acoustic gutiar combination but entry fee there is substantial at about 1600 or two grand if you opt for the sub. Still portabilty and quality of the live sound is compelling. I have that much almost invested in the Yamaha but the yamaha I have is a bit more versatile and has on board effects but the Bose is still the hot set up
for solo gigging.
Pa's just sound better than amps to me espcially with the Taylors ES and with piezo equipped guitars. I really prefer miking my Martins with a good
condenser mike and dong vocals with an SM 58. Through the Yamaha it is
an unbeatable sound in roooms up to about 100 seats.
Hope this gives you some input.

[Celtic Johnny]

What you're asking is a very good and valid question. I can to the same point myself a year ago. I was considering an acoustic amp until I read a lot of thier product literature. As a sales feature many bragged that thier sound was equivalent to a PA. I figured, "why not then just buy a PA"? I began investigating PA systems and settled on a Fender Passport PD-250. I'm quite happy with it. But there are many other good and better systems out there.

Do a search here on PD-250, not necessarily to find out about the Fender, but because there was a lot of interesting discussion on amps vs. PA's

[taylortom]

I had a Trace Elliot acoustic amp which I sold and replaced with one of Carvins portable PAs and I really like it. Carvin makes a great product right here in the US and they only sell direct. I think their products are a great value.

[woodenkings]

agreeing with everyone---i chose first to buy the acoustic amps (including the Kustom KAA35DFX-30 watt amp), because of the ease in setup, break down time, the weight and the effects. i have three acoustic amps now and one Kustom Profile PA System, which i really suggest getting and/or the Fender PD-250 is a good choice also. besure to get stands for them--the Kustom has a one inch diameter hole in the base of the speakers--i am not sure about the Fender.
good pickins' to you.....

[UncleShish]

For small to medium gigs I use the Genz Benz Shenendoah 100.
It features 2 channels, each with a high & low impedence input.
It also has some reverbs and chorus built into it as well as an effects loop and a line out. It also has a speaker stand mount on the bottom as well as a "leg" to angle the cabinet back for projection. This has been a wonderful little investment for me as it saves me a ton of time on set up and teardown and sounds incredible.

I also have a Peavey 250 watt PA for larger gigs but I haven't had to use it since purchasing the Benz as I usually play coffee shops that seat under 100.

Good luck with your search. If possible, try as many different amps and PA's as you can before making up your mind. There's not much worse than making a blind investment, getting it and realizing you don't really care for it, especially if it can't be returned.

[tayloralf]

hi everyohne...please pardon my ignorance...i've been looking to buy an acoustic amp with a channel for my guitar and a second channel for voice...just for church and basic gigging. after reading this thread, i have a couple of questions:

1. what's the difference between an amp and a PA?

2. in terms of power, is there a simple guideline that correspond wattage with crowd size, e.g. 30W for 50 people or less, 100W for..., etc?

3. i was told by a sales person that an acoustic guitar will not sound good with a keyboard amp, though the vocal will sound the same...is that true? i ask cuz i have noticed that keyboard amps, everything else being equal, seem to be a bit cheaper than acoustic guitar amps.

thanks for your help!

[whiskeyjack]

. . .be able to do something at a coffee house, or play in my room. . .

For what you intend to do with it, I'd suggest an acoustic amp. Will you need more than 50 watts?? Lots of acoustic amps I think will meet your needs: Ultrasound DS3, Marshall AS50R, Carvin. . . .

I did a comparison of several 'portable' PA systems last year when I was thinking along the same lines as you. Here's what I think:

Fender Passport series: They're the most portable and the lightest. They occupy the least space in your vehicle. But you'll need to carry speaker stands separately. There's room for one mic, mic cable and speaker cables in the unit. Some of the dials and knobs seem redundant and I really couldn't tell if they did anything or not. I had the Passport 150 and they sell used for around $300.

Kustom Profile One: (If you're heart is set on a PA system try that Kustom Profile One from Music 123 - they have a 45? day return period.) I personnally didn't care for it. It didn't sound right to me and the luggage handle from the bag didn't extend high enough for me (and I'm short!) to comfortably tow the unit. You'll probably need to lift this unit into and out of your vehicle: 80 lbs with spkr stands & mics & cables. . .and it's awkward. The first unit I got from M123 was cracked and looked used. I sent it back and got one that looked mostly new. Speaker stands are built pretty well but they're short: so the tops of your speakers speakers will be a maximum of five feet off the floor. $430 shipped from M123 I think?

Peavey Escort 2000: Seventy five pounds but not nearly as awkward as the Kustom: it has handles on both ends and in the middle. Wheels are not big enough but work fine. There are no 'effects' on this unit like there is on the Profile One. But the sound is the best of the three I've tested: very natural and you have to be trying to get feedback with this unit. Speaker stands are flimsy but they do work. You can find these used for around $500.

[whiskeyjack]

1. what's the difference between an amp and a PA?

Lots of differences: Typically there's more wattage to a PA and the speakers are designed primarily for voices.

2. in terms of power, is there a simple guideline that correspond wattage with crowd size, e.g. 30W for 50 people or less, 100W for..., etc?

If there is I haven't found it. There's too many variables I think. In the old days I remember hearing a minimum requirement of 2-3 watts per head (of audience). They almost had to be talkin' about heavey metal in a HUGE venue with people screaming. But I DO know that a 150 watt pa system is plenty for about 200 people in a Legion Hall where you are center stage and people are listening. But still the absorption of that sound is incredible. Soundchecks are misleading if done in an empty room. I'm not an authority on this at all.

i was told by a sales person that an acoustic guitar will not sound good with a keyboard amp, though the vocal will sound the same...is that true? i ask cuz i have noticed that keyboard amps, everything else being equal, seem to be a bit cheaper than acoustic guitar amps.

Guitar through a keyboard amp (Roland) sounds ok - a little muddy but not bad. You'd be better off though to buy a dedicated acoustic guitar amp for the price difference because an acoustic guitar amp with two xlr's is a LOT more versatile than a keyboard amp. I'd run a keyboard through an acoustic guitar amp before I'd run a guitar through a keyboard amp.

[Sugarlander]

Originally Posted by odonnell421

i am looking to buy an acoustic amp for my acoustic/electric, but i came across the idea of a pa system...http://www.music123.com/Kustom-Profi...A-i61048.music
something like that, over an acoustic amp because i would be able to do something at a coffee house, or play in my room....any advice? I am looking in the 200-400 dollar range haha... thanks

It is funny that you mention nothing about vocals, only playing your guitar through something. Almost all the responses above assume you intend to sing and play. What do you intend to do?

If you sing and play guitar, seems like a PA is very logical.

If you just play guitar, an acoustic amp would be easiest to deal with.

[SteveCat]

Would running my Fishman Platinum preamp into the power amp of my Workingman's 10 Bass amp by using the effects loop return jack provide satisfactory results as an acoustic amp for a Baggs M1 pickup?

[joser]

Peavey Escort 2000: Seventy five pounds but not nearly as awkward as the Kustom: it has handles on both ends and in the middle. Wheels are not big enough but work fine. There are no 'effects' on this unit like there is on the Profile One. But the sound is the best of the three I've tested: very natural and you have to be trying to get feedback with this unit. Speaker stands are flimsy but they do work. You can find these used for around $500.[/QUOTE]

Hmmm.... My Peavy Escort has reverb, which effects are you looking for? The rest of Whiskeyjack's description of the Escort is right on target. It works great for a small coffehouse gig and has been a workhorse for band practice sessions. Comes with everything including a Mic and XLR cord. I got mine new for a single Benjamin Franklin more than the price Whiskeyjack mentioned as used.

What is wrong with using a single powered main, such as the JBL EON as an acoustic amp. Seems like they would be pretty clean, and lots of power? They advertise this solution in AG magazine frequently. Of course I'm not trading my Ultrasound Pro 100 for anything.

Joser

[whiskeyjack]

My Peavy Escort has reverb, which effects are you looking for?

Good catch; thank ya. I also forgot to mention the eq feature on the Escort.

What I meant was, there is no 'battery of effects' like echo, small room reverb, chorus, etc. like there is on the Kustom and assorted other acoustic guitar amps.

Thanks for the correction.
_________________

edit:

sorry for the double post I lost track of where I wuz. . .so wherever I wuz, I really wuzent there?

[stratokatsu]

I have a Carvin AD100 I'm very fond of. Check out the specs on their website.

[4Gtrs]

Originally Posted by SteveCat

Would running my Fishman Platinum preamp into the power amp of my Workingman's 10 Bass amp by using the effects loop return jack provide satisfactory results as an acoustic amp for a Baggs M1 pickup?

I used my Bassman 60 for two years for church as a do-all compromise solution. It worked OK for my 314 and 12'er. I've also used it with strat with a distortion pedal between. I really had to dial out the bass, though. Does you SWR have a tweeter? If it doesn't, it might be lacking crisp highs for an acoustic guitar.