Laminate or Plywood?

[tonyg]

If the difference between the two are that with plywood the layers alternate the grain direction, whereas with laminate, they run parallel, then are acoustics with "laminate back and sides" (or laminate tops) actually plywood? If so, why do they use the term laminate?

[Glennm]

Marketing.

[tonyg]

Ahhhh.......just as I suspected. I wonder if you cut through all the marketing ploys and hype in the acoustic guitar world, what would be left for us to actually purchase.

[Mike McLenison]

That generally describes my "beater" pass around guitar. If it sounds/feels good, well...

[Bax Burgess]

There is a variety of layered tops, some laminate, some ply. Cheaper guitars, such as the newer Savannah brand, if memory serves, have a razor-thin top layer.

[Willie_D]

The problem is that there are not universally accepted definitions of terms.

Plywood and laminate can be 2 layers of veneer with pretty much anything sandwiched in the middle, from formica to wood to osb. In some cases the woodgrain layer may even be a paper-thin printed layer.

Layered is a more specific term. When Taylor, ferinstance, says the back and sides are "layered sapele," that means three layers of sapele laminated together - no shenanigans in the middle.

[gr81dorn]

Originally Posted by Willie_D

Layered is a more specific term. When Taylor, ferinstance, says the back and sides are "layered sapele," that means three layers of sapele laminated together - no shenanigans in the middle.

Nah....Layered is a way to say "laminate" or "plywood" without using those words because they are incendiary and have negative connotations.

Layered has no official meaning in the world of wood and lumber. It's purely a marketing term created to not have to use the words above.

Taylors aren't layered as you describe, either. The Academy series makes this crystal clear because there is no binding and have the arm bevel. They are listed in the official specs as having "Layered" back and sides. If you look at the photo below, it's sapele veneer over something else completely...not exactly sure what, but looks more like poplar if it's an actual wood species, then another sheet of sapele veneer.

Another proof is with some of the newer veneers they're using, they still have sapele veneer on the underside (inside the guitar). I had two walnut guitars from Taylor recently with sapele clearly in the inside-facing layer of veneer.

[lowrider]

Laminate is plywood. Same thing with ''layered wood''.

[zombywoof]

Originally Posted by Willie_D

Layered is a more specific term. When Taylor, ferinstance, says the back and sides are "layered sapele," that means three layers of sapele laminated together - no shenanigans in the middle.

Not so. Taylor guitars are built with a layer of poplar in between layers of Sapele.

[Willie_D]

Originally Posted by zombywoof

Not so. Taylor guitars are built with a layer of poplar in between layers of Sapele.

I stand corrected. But it is layered wood, not a synthetic substrate.

[merlin666]

Plywood is just plain language for any layered wood. Laminate implies that the layers also include a decorative veneer.

[lowrider]

Just checking back in; it's still all PLYWOOD!

[Dru Edwards]

Not all laminate/plywoods are created equally. Taylor and Godin (Seagull/Simon & Patrick) do an excellent job.

[tonyg]

Still, like I said, according to what I can find out by googling "difference between laminate and plywood", the distinction is that with laminate, the layers run parallel, and with plywood they run at right angles. I would think that is why an all plywood guitar like my Yamaha F325D is much less subject to humidity changes. Also, laminate can also use particles and resins and such, not just thin layers of actual wood. Maybe like Martin's HPL, which can actually break if dropped.

[tonyg]

So by definition, I don't believe they are the same thing as some have suggested.