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  #151  
Old 01-15-2019, 12:42 AM
methodinsane methodinsane is offline
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Originally Posted by GuitarLuva View Post
I haven't tried the Dazzo pickup myself but I did watch all the available videos on it and also read a fair amount about it. It gets good reviews and from what I see the biggest issue seems to be getting it installed properly. After all the pickups I've been through over the years I'm quite content with the Schatten HFN. It's an awesome pickup in every way and it's so much cheaper than everything else except the JJB pickup.
Hi,

I've older dazzos in my Lakewood D54 and these are difficult to install; that is to say to get the sound right. I've never managed to match the sound that some other folks. Teddy has offered to swap mine for newer different model for a fee but I'm keeping my options open. Some people have got teddy to install the dazzos but I live in Ireland so that's not an option. I'm glad to hear you're having great success with the HFN. It does sound nice from clips I've heard. I'd probably be running it dual source with my sunrise mag.

Thanks a million.
JP
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2005 Lakewood D54 - Sunrise and Dazzos
2004 Taylor Big Baby - K&K Trinity
SR Technology Jam 400 + QSC K10
TC Electronic 2240
Kurzweil Rumour
(Digitech 2120 for electric duties at home)
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  #152  
Old 01-15-2019, 07:40 AM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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Originally Posted by methodinsane View Post
Hi,

I've older dazzos in my Lakewood D54 and these are difficult to install; that is to say to get the sound right. I've never managed to match the sound that some other folks. Teddy has offered to swap mine for newer different model for a fee but I'm keeping my options open. Some people have got teddy to install the dazzos but I live in Ireland so that's not an option. I'm glad to hear you're having great success with the HFN. It does sound nice from clips I've heard. I'd probably be running it dual source with my sunrise mag.

Thanks a million.
JP
That would certainly be a good choice they recommend using a magnetic pickup as a 2nd source with their pickups.
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  #153  
Old 01-16-2019, 05:47 AM
methodinsane methodinsane is offline
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Originally Posted by GuitarLuva View Post
That would certainly be a good choice they recommend using a magnetic pickup as a 2nd source with their pickups.
Yea well I do like the Sunrise alot, it has a lovely sound of it's own. Plus I got it because alot of my favourite acoustic artists use it. But I also like to play stuff like Preston Reed and Michael Hedges music so I need and want that body response. I can't afford the trade with Teddy at the moment but I do want to do that because frankly the recordings of the Dazzo I've heard and seen on YT show me when it works it works extremely well - I just haven't been able to get that sound . I've also had the K&K and it sounded like plastic in my guitar, I required the K&K mic to mitigate that. I've also had the PUTW #54 which was quite nice but not as feedback resistant as the Dazzos. *sigh* Still searching.
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John Paul

2005 Lakewood D54 - Sunrise and Dazzos
2004 Taylor Big Baby - K&K Trinity
SR Technology Jam 400 + QSC K10
TC Electronic 2240
Kurzweil Rumour
(Digitech 2120 for electric duties at home)
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  #154  
Old 01-16-2019, 10:27 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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Originally Posted by methodinsane View Post
Yea well I do like the Sunrise alot, it has a lovely sound of it's own. Plus I got it because alot of my favourite acoustic artists use it. But I also like to play stuff like Preston Reed and Michael Hedges music so I need and want that body response. I can't afford the trade with Teddy at the moment but I do want to do that because frankly the recordings of the Dazzo I've heard and seen on YT show me when it works it works extremely well - I just haven't been able to get that sound . I've also had the K&K and it sounded like plastic in my guitar, I required the K&K mic to mitigate that. I've also had the PUTW #54 which was quite nice but not as feedback resistant as the Dazzos. *sigh* Still searching.
Well I don't know why but I just decided to have a look at the dazzo website and I must say he really needs to overhaul that website it's like the worst ever and gives a bad impression. That's just my opinion of course but the pickup is $199USD I paid like half that for the Schatten HFN. I listened to all the sound clips out there on the pickup, while it does sound very good, it lacks the mic like characteristics the Schatten has but than again so do all the others.
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  #155  
Old 01-17-2019, 01:25 AM
methodinsane methodinsane is offline
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Originally Posted by GuitarLuva View Post
Well I don't know why but I just decided to have a look at the dazzo website and I must say he really needs to overhaul that website it's like the worst ever and gives a bad impression. That's just my opinion of course but the pickup is $199USD I paid like half that for the Schatten HFN. I listened to all the sound clips out there on the pickup, while it does sound very good, it lacks the mic like characteristics the Schatten has but than again so do all the others.
Hmm I might give it a go so. Its relatively cheap. How is live for feedback resistance? I'd like a pickup that will work at open mics and the like as a single source. Thanks.
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John Paul

2005 Lakewood D54 - Sunrise and Dazzos
2004 Taylor Big Baby - K&K Trinity
SR Technology Jam 400 + QSC K10
TC Electronic 2240
Kurzweil Rumour
(Digitech 2120 for electric duties at home)
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  #156  
Old 01-17-2019, 02:10 AM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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Hmm I might give it a go so. Its relatively cheap. How is live for feedback resistance? I'd like a pickup that will work at open mics and the like as a single source. Thanks.
I haven't used it live yet. There's another Schatten thread going where someone used it live with no issues.
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  #157  
Old 01-17-2019, 06:40 AM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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I might do an experiment on my next days off as well by trying the Schatten HFN passive with the Anthem preamp. I'm eventually going to be selling the Anthem system but it will be an easy experiment to do and I am curious how it will blend with the tru mic.
Please let us know how this experiment goes.

For one thing, I'm curious as to where you'll put the Tru Mic, since the HFN SBT is now in the recommended place.

I'm also curious to know if the Element preamp will add extra bass to your HFN signal, as my "barn door" Baggs Element preamp does with the OTSS UST which I plugged into it. Of course, any extra bass won't be as much of a problem when the Anthem blender is set to the max "mic" position and is only contributing the part of the signal from 250Hz on down. Of course, you'll likely need to adjust the mic level.
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  #158  
Old 01-17-2019, 08:16 AM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Originally Posted by guitaniac View Post
Please let us know how this experiment goes.

For one thing, I'm curious as to where you'll put the Tru Mic, since the HFN SBT is now in the recommended place.

I'm also curious to know if the Element preamp will add extra bass to your HFN signal, as my "barn door" Baggs Element preamp does with the OTSS UST which I plugged into it. Of course, any extra bass won't be as much of a problem when the Anthem blender is set to the max "mic" position and is only contributing the part of the signal from 250Hz on down. Of course, you'll likely need to adjust the mic level.
I seem to remember people trying to combine the K&K and tru-mic. I think the consensus was that the tru-mic wasn't as picky about placement so people were able to stick it just about anywhere.
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  #159  
Old 01-17-2019, 09:55 AM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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Originally Posted by guitaniac View Post

For one thing, I'm curious as to where you'll put the Tru Mic, since the HFN SBT is now in the recommended place.
I've experimented with the tru-mic placement before. Like Petty1818 said, it's not picky at all. I had it behind the bridge plate and even on the bottom of the guitar at one point. So long as it's inside the guitar body it will be fine. Unlike an SBT, it doesn't need togo on the bridge plate. The Schatten certainly won't benefit from the tru-mic as say the k&k would, but I too am curious how they will blend together. I will post the results here when I get to it.
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  #160  
Old 01-17-2019, 10:06 AM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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Originally Posted by Petty1818 View Post
I seem to remember people trying to combine the K&K and tru-mic. I think the consensus was that the tru-mic wasn't as picky about placement so people were able to stick it just about anywhere.
Good point about the Tru Mic. Maybe I should try some placement experiments with my Lyric before selling it. I've tended to like my MiniFlex 2Mic better, but that thing is pretty heavy and bulky.

As for swapping out the Element UST for a Pure Mini, I recall a report of successfully substituting the Pure Mini for the Element UST in an Anthem SL system. I suspect that GuitarLuva is considering the possibility of doing something similar (HFN for Element) for the Anthem SL in his Gibson.

The full Anthem system messes up the acoustic tone of his Emerald guitar, so I'm guessing the full Anthem experiment would just be a temporary thing. The full Anthem test would allow him to put the blender on the full "mic" setting and get an idea of how the swap would work for the Anthem SL. He could also put the blender on the full UST setting and hear how the Element preamp does or doesn't color the sound of the HFN SBT.

Last edited by guitaniac; 01-17-2019 at 10:20 AM.
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  #161  
Old 01-17-2019, 12:55 PM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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Originally Posted by GuitarLuva View Post
I've experimented with the tru-mic placement before. Like Petty1818 said, it's not picky at all. I had it behind the bridge plate and even on the bottom of the guitar at one point. So long as it's inside the guitar body it will be fine. Unlike an SBT, it doesn't need togo on the bridge plate. The Schatten certainly won't benefit from the tru-mic as say the k&k would, but I too am curious how they will blend together. I will post the results here when I get to it.
Looking forward to the Anthem/HFN experiment results.

With respect to TruMic positioning, I suppose I should try repositioning the Lyric Mic in one of my guitars before pulling it out. ToneDexter has made it a moot point (I also have a UST in that guitar), but I've long been frustrated by how much EQ correction it takes to get a halfway satisfying tone from that Lyric setup. Maybe the directly-under-the-saddle location on the bridgeplate of that particular guitar is just a bad place for it. As a soundman, I've heard Lyric rigs which sounded better without any EQ tweaks.
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  #162  
Old 01-17-2019, 01:01 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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Originally Posted by guitaniac View Post
Looking forward to the Anthem/HFN experiment results.

With respect to TruMic positioning, I suppose I should try repositioning the Lyric Mic in one of my guitars before pulling it out. ToneDexter has made it a moot point (I also have a UST in that guitar), but I've long been frustrated by how much EQ correction it takes to get a halfway satisfying tone from that Lyric setup. Maybe the directly-under-the-saddle location on the bridgeplate of that particular guitar is just a bad place for it. As a soundman, I've heard Lyric rigs which sounded better without any EQ tweaks.
Yeah I would imagine the lyric would be the same as the anthem tru-mic in that regard. Having that offset soundhole really gives me easy experimentation.
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  #163  
Old 01-17-2019, 08:26 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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So I did the experiment and the results were interesting. The main reason for me bothering with it was to see if the Schatten HFN would overdrive the anthem preamp In case I decide to convert the passive to active in the future.

The Schatten did not overdrive the preamp at all which I was happy about. Putting the anthem tone control full towards the neck (which is full Schatten in this case) it was a little muddier than when it was passive. That is most likely due to the way the anthem preamp is set up so I started playing around with the crossover and all the adjustments bla bla bla and ended up with about a 50% blend, tru-mic was mounted on the bottom of the guitar which took away some of the harshness from it. I must say I ended up with a really nice sound. The Schatten and tru-mic blend really well together. The output was hotter than normal of course but not much. Probably due to the low output that the anthem preamp is known for.

All in all if you have the passive version and wanted to convert to active I'm willing to bet any fishman, baggs or other preamp that you might have kicking around would work just fine.
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  #164  
Old 01-17-2019, 08:43 PM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Neat test! I sometimes kick myself for selling my Lyric. I remember when I first installed it, I was blown away by how good my guitar sounded plugged in. It's still the only pickup where my playing dynamics didn't really change due to the plugged in tone. It just felt like I was playing acoustic/unplugged. The downside was that the bass was just gone. I did use it at a few shows and missed the bass but the recordings of those shows produced some of the best live guitar that I have ever had.

I would love to have it around now just to throw in my Taylor as a back up or blending option for my HFN. The Lyric was oddly enough very feedback resistant so it would be nice to have the option to use it when the HFN was feeding back. Still, I am pretty sold on the HFN so I think I will most likely work my rig around it.
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  #165  
Old 01-17-2019, 09:37 PM
GuitarLuva GuitarLuva is offline
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Originally Posted by Petty1818 View Post
Neat test! I sometimes kick myself for selling my Lyric. I remember when I first installed it, I was blown away by how good my guitar sounded plugged in. It's still the only pickup where my playing dynamics didn't really change due to the plugged in tone. It just felt like I was playing acoustic/unplugged. The downside was that the bass was just gone. I did use it at a few shows and missed the bass but the recordings of those shows produced some of the best live guitar that I have ever had.

I would love to have it around now just to throw in my Taylor as a back up or blending option for my HFN. The Lyric was oddly enough very feedback resistant so it would be nice to have the option to use it when the HFN was feeding back. Still, I am pretty sold on the HFN so I think I will most likely work my rig around it.
I hear ya. The lyric was one of the few pickups that I never tried because most of the reviews on it was as you described, missing the low end. Like you i'm sold on the HFN, most natural sounding pickup I've tried and I tried lot's.
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