So how long does it take to get really "good" at guitar?

[biotechmgr]

Playing with amateur band after 2 years made me work harder, capable after 3.5 years (friend feedback), fluid at strumming and flatpicking combinations nearing 5 years now. Finger strength and dexterity much better. I can learn songs more quickly.

Good is in the future I hope.

[fazool]

Read the book Zen Guitar - it will answer your question.

"your whole life. As short as that."

[macmanmatty]

it takes X hours to get good at guitar where x is a positive number.

[Nymuso]

Being able to play what you want.

There are things I can't play but I have no desire to play them. When I have advanced over the years it was because there was something new I wanted to do that was just outside my grasp, and I corrected that.

So, for me the final answer is it depends upon your goals. When you've achieved them, you're good.

[leew3]

50+ years so far...I'll let you know when I get really good.

[mcmars]

"really good" is very subjective term. I taught kayaking, canoeing, ski and snowboarding for many years. I found the people who were focused on the end point got more frustrated with the learning process, but people who could enjoy making small improvements through time got more from it and enjoyed the learning process.

I would suggest to find joy in simple songs, chords, riffs at the ability you have now and challenge yourself with more complex styles to keep things moving along. One of my teaching styles was doing this, pushing students with terrain or rivers that were challenging, but not to the point of failure. Then going back to easier less challenging terrain/rivers and most people can see that they have improved and it helps to keep them feeling good about themselves and inspires them to keep it up.

Think and focus day to day and enjoying the small steps in improvement so as not be disappointed by thinking you got 97873 more hours of playing before you are "good enough".

And remember, some people just are fast learners and become very good very fast, but most do not. Not everyone can be a "musical savant" most people who are pro's have been at it for a while and are good at focusing their practice time.

Remember many really good guitar legends, like John Prine, Bob Dylan, did not play complex and difficult guitar, but they stayed simple and were good songwriters. And fast players are not always the best, think BB King, slow and tasteful wins in my book.

[nickv6]

Ok so no-one laughed at my joke reply... I'll live with it I suppose.....

[TheGITM]

11 years, 3 months, 2 days, 14 hours, 22 minutes, and 9 seconds.

Give or take a decade.

[Glennwillow]

Originally Posted by Cecil6243

Of course "good" is a very relative term. I've heard a lot of theories like the 10,000 hour one, which is supposed to apply to a lot of things from musicians to athletes. Obviously there is more involved than just time, as in constantly learning and goals in those 10,000 hours, and a mentor or coach doesn't hurt. I am retiring from an artistic profession where I know others that never got better in decades due to not challenging themselves, or too lazy to learn new things

I was lamenting a while back about my 30 year hiatus from playing and all the time I lost. But then I thought of something: There are plenty of examples of accomplished musicians (as in recording artists and bands) where they started playing in their teens and by their late teens and 20's was quite "good." Good enough to be playing in front of audiences or recording.

So maybe a 10 year span of really working at it will put me where I want to be? I am already up to or past my skills I had when I played in my 20's after only resuming after a year.

Thoughts?

Hi Cecil,

I have looked at your original post a number of times and considered responding and then decided not to. Finally, I just can't seem to help myself.

I guess my trepidation stems from the fact that some people get good enough to perform on stage in one or two years and many if not most players can play for 50 years and never get very far. Maybe they have gone as far as they wanted to and they are fine right where they are. Obviously, we don't all want the same things out of life. For me, I wanted to learn to make music very badly.

Also, I don't think anyone knows how to assess the value of innate talent, and it can certainly help. There is no doubt that it exists, but people have written a book on the idea that Talent Is Overrated.

I remember Eric Skye commenting in one of the AGF threads that, and I'm paraphrasing here, he had to work at not being offended when someone referred to him as "talented." He knew how much work he had put in over the years. Talent is something you're born with. It takes work to turn that into musical ability.

I started playing at age 16 and by age 18 I was playing on stage for money. But I was a whole lot better 10 years later.

I know a very good, pro-level pianist who is also a teacher. When she was asked how long does it take to get good, she commented, "Eight years. It will take you about eight years of dedicated work and lessons to be able to play Beethoven's "Moonlight Sonata."

It's easy to play easy stuff on the guitar. That takes about 2-3 weeks of a little effort and some calluses. But I'd suggest that to play harder, instrumental stuff on the guitar, it's just as hard as learning to play the piano.

An awful lot of what makes a good musician is dedication, motivation, desire, discipline. If you want it badly enough and are willing to allow yourself to be taken over by this obsession, then you can advance. But most people just dabble and never advance very far.

I will say that I was playing guitar a couple of hours per day, at least, sometimes 3-4 hours/day, when I was young because I was totally obsessed. (And still, I was a very good student in school and college.) Back about 15 years ago when I was really working at becoming a better instrumental guitar player, I was playing at least 2 hours per day, many times longer. I don't play that much now at age 73 because I just can't physically do it without a lot of pain.

I think obsession is what is needed if a person is ever going to be really good at something. People on a public forum like this almost universally balk at the term "obsession" or "obsessive", as if it relates to mental illness. I'm not suggesting that any of us should dive into an obsessive compulsive disorder. But total immersion -- or as much immersion as you can make room for in your life -- is really needed if you are going to get good. We all know that's how you really learn a language.

That's my take on it, at any rate. YMMV.

- Glenn

[KevWind]

A lifetime perhaps more ,,,all depends

But I will say that (depending on how coordinated you actually are, and how good your ear is ) From 14 to 18 months of focused practicing 2 hours (virtually every day),,, you will notice a quantum leap in your playing .

One more thought (posed as a rhetorical question) How many songs can you play fluidly with virtually no mistakes in a completely dark room ?

[Nymuso]

Originally Posted by nickv6

Ok so no-one laughed at my joke reply... I'll live with it I suppose.....

Out of curiosity I went and found your post. I found it funny; I would have countered that there's no way you're better than me. But don't expect a huge positive reaction to that line of humor here.

[Nama Ensou]

Originally Posted by Cecil6243

So how long does it take to get really "good" at guitar?

Some key factors to how long it will take are a person's natural aptitude, how they practice, their general mindset on practicing and making progress, and of course the hours.

Put in the hours get really serious about it and you'll make huge progress.

[reeve21]

Originally Posted by Glennwillow

Hi Cecil,

An awful lot of what makes a good musician is dedication, motivation, desire, discipline. If you want it badly enough and are willing to allow yourself to be taken over by this obsession, then you can advance. But most people just dabble and never advance very far.


I think obsession is what is needed if a person is ever going to be really good at something. People on a public forum like this almost universally balk at the term "obsession" or "obsessive", as if it relates to mental illness. I'm not suggesting that any of us should dive into an obsessive compulsive disorder. But total immersion -- or as much immersion as you can make room for in your life -- is really needed if you are going to get good. We all know that's how you really learn a language.

That's my take on it, at any rate. YMMV.

- Glenn

This^^^^^really sums up what many of us have been trying to say, Glenn!

I can do a few different things at an OK level, probably better than some folks. But in each case I had a real love for the activity, and immersed myself in it for quite a while in order to get anywhere, to the point where people consider me to be a bit obsessed with it. Any natural talents I have are not in the recreational arts, lol. Look at the Olympians--they gave up any semblance of a "normal" life to do what they loved. It's not "normal" to be that way. It is obsessive, for sure.

[Glennwillow]

Thank you Bob! I hope all is well for you!

- Glenn

[Bushleague]

Originally Posted by Cecil6243

Of course "good" is a very relative term. I've heard a lot of theories like the 10,000 hour one, which is supposed to apply to a lot of things from musicians to athletes. Obviously there is more involved than just time, as in constantly learning and goals in those 10,000 hours, and a mentor or coach doesn't hurt. I am retiring from an artistic profession where I know others that never got better in decades due to not challenging themselves, or too lazy to learn new things

I was lamenting a while back about my 30 year hiatus from playing and all the time I lost. But then I thought of something: There are plenty of examples of accomplished musicians (as in recording artists and bands) where they started playing in their teens and by their late teens and 20's was quite "good." Good enough to be playing in front of audiences or recording.

So maybe a 10 year span of really working at it will put me where I want to be? I am already up to or past my skills I had when I played in my 20's after only resuming after a year.

Thoughts?

IMO good is a subjective thing, there are a good many highly technical players that lack creativity and cant write decent songs, there are hacks out there that are the exact opposite.

Personally, all the guitarists that most of us like best have their own sound. So IMO whenever you hit that point where you find your own style and instead of trying to sound like all the guitarists that are way more talented than you will ever be, you just work at your own style... thats when you are well on your way to becoming "good". Just think of how stupid it would have been if John Frusciante had just spent his whole life working his bag off to sound like Eddy Van Halen, or Brian Setzer had just started a blues band and tried to sound like Jimi Hendrix.

I've never really thought of myself as a terribly good guitarist, but I developed my own style pretty quick and even back in high school people thought I was good. At some point I realized I'd never be a blazing shredder, but I remember reading something that Les Paul said: "Its not about playing lots of notes, but playing the right notes" I ran with the concept of just concentrating on putting interesting notes in interesting places and eventually even guitar players that I knew were way better than me started giving me more respect than I felt I actually deserved. Now I just try to transition that old energy and creativity onto the acoustic guitar which has changed my style immensely, but once again people seem to dig it and give me way more credit than I deserve.

There are many paths to becoming a good guitarist but I feel that the most enjoyable is just finding your niche, a sound you are good at, enjoy, and that inspires you, and you invest a good percentage of your practice time into simply developing in that direction. One more Les Paul quote... "And lastly, remember, you dont WORK your guitar, you PLAY it. If your not having fun your missing the whole point."