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  #46  
Old 03-13-2019, 09:49 AM
Jim Jim is offline
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Martins are fine guitars and would be a great choice if you have your ears set on the "Martin" sound. But, if on the other hand you are interested in the deep bass tone plus something extra then I would urge you to at A/B a Martin with a Collings OM2H and then with a Taylor Grand Pacific. Collings is much smaller maker than Martin and in my opinion that translates into more care and attention going into each of their guitars resulting in a more pleasing sounding and playing guitar than a Martin while being in that same family of emphasis on the bass side of tones. The Taylor Grand Pacific is like no other Taylor ever built and it does not sound like the typical Taylor. It is in that family of heavy bass tonal profiles but like the Collings it has something extra. Larrivees are exceptional guitars but they are not designed to be in the heavy bass family of tones - they are instead designed to be balanced across the bass, mid, and treble tones making them a different animal. They have more clarity to their tones compared to the more muddy Martin tones. Try them all and buy whichever your ears and hands like the best.
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  #47  
Old 03-13-2019, 10:06 AM
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The closest sponsor to the OP ( that i know of) would be Muary's Music, which is about a 2 hour drive from NYC. A few years back I picked up an HD 28 from Muary. He had a few to sample.
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  #48  
Old 03-13-2019, 10:16 AM
highvibrational highvibrational is offline
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Originally Posted by Steadfastly View Post
There is a panel on the right hand side of the General Acoustic Guitar Discussion page with a list of them. Simply click on the name.
Hi, I saw a list of moderators. Is that the same as a sponsor? Thank you.
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  #49  
Old 03-13-2019, 10:31 AM
mcduffnw mcduffnw is offline
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Originally Posted by EverettWilliams View Post
It’s well out of the price range, but if we’re talking about the best modern OM-28 trying to achieve the glory of the really exceptional prewar OM-28s, I don’t think Martin makes anything that touched what Julius Borges or TJ Thompson can do. The platonic ideal here is in the past. Martin isn’t the same as it was 90 years ago. They make some really good reissues, but so do others. Just because Martin owns the name, doesn’t mean they have a monopoly on the legacy.

I’d second the suggestions to look used and in this price range, a used Marquis, as has been suggested, could be a really great choice!

Yeah...but...we ain't really talkin bout that here now are we?

Julius and TJ make stellar guitars...but...Julius will set you back what $10-15K plus, and TJ last I heard , would set you back $25-30K plus...and TJ was only building a small handful a year so his wait time would be prohibitive.

Also...Julius and TJ build in the vintage 30's Golden Era style, and as great sounding as those vintage guitars were/are...their lightness of build certainly leads to longevity issues without very likely serious $$$$ repair/restoration intervention at some point in their lives. That is in fact how TJ makes most of his living...doing that repair and restoration on those vintage instruments...and...building in that very light vintage style new...even now...still poses the chance that some of the same issues that befell the vintage Martins could occur with new guitars made in the same fashion. Which is why Martin does build a small percentage of their guitars...their Authentic and Golden Era lines...pretty close to that vintage edge, but only a small small percentage. Because in reality, the number of folks who demand that ultimate level of accuracy to the vintage 30's instruments is a very small percentage of Martin's business. For the vast majority of buyers, the modern...non vintage replica...instruments are plenty more that good enough.

So, sure, the modern Martin guitars don't sound quite like their Golden Era grandparents, but they still have the basic DNA of that famed Martin voice in the tone of their guitars today, and still no one out there, building in the more affordable price range that Martin aims most of their production these days, is doing a better job of giving folks that basic classic Martin tone and timbre.

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  #50  
Old 03-13-2019, 10:38 AM
TJNies TJNies is offline
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Originally Posted by Arch Stanton View Post
I tend to agree with hifivic. Brand new, untouched from the factory, out of the box, inspected, tuned, repacked and shipped, no interest, no tax, free shipping for $2280? Plus free return ship if it came to that???
Want it all, eh? Well, yes to most of that: Martin Standard OM-28 for $2280 (or close), brand new, unopened besides inspection, shipped free. Maybe not all dealers but many.

Due to some states' requirements, you may or may not be charged sales tax. That's not the dealer's call.

Returns will cost you shipping both ways. I think that is very reasonable. This isn't Amazon.

For the record, before I knew these things I purchased a Martin GPCPA1+ from a brick and mortar shop. MSRP of $4000, MAP of $3000. Dealer refused to budge from MAP. I relented.
After the honeymoon I realized I didn't really care for the guitar sound unplugged and I didn't need the electronics. Decided to sell, and asked Jon Garon @ My Favorite Guitars his opinion about the price I intended to list. I thought perhaps $2400.

He said that is about what he would price a brand new one for. My heart sunk, realizing I'd been duped. Luckily I listed it on Ebay, and someone bought it, similarly unaware. Lessons learned.
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  #51  
Old 03-13-2019, 10:42 AM
TJNies TJNies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by highvibrational View Post
Hi, I saw a list of moderators. Is that the same as a sponsor? Thank you.
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=369815

For the record, there are any number of other Martin dealers who can and will give you 40% off MSRP for asking. They are not allowed to advertised anything below MAP (approximately 20-25% below MSRP).
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  #52  
Old 03-13-2019, 11:02 AM
EverettWilliams EverettWilliams is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcduffnw View Post
So, sure, the modern Martin guitars don't sound quite like their Golden Era grandparents, but they still have the basic DNA of that famed Martin voice in the tone of their guitars today, and still no one out there, building in the more affordable price range that Martin aims most of their production these days, is doing a better job of giving folks that basic classic Martin tone and timbre.

duff
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That’s a lot more nuanced than your previous statement - and I agree that Martin gives the flavor for a palatable price. And, at one point, OP asked “who makes a better Martin than Martin” - hence the mention of TJ and Julius (who, in deviation from the old OM-28s categorically insists on using a tongue brace and truss rod - so not a slavish recreation).

Companies like Martin and Gibson retain the name and the trade dress, but are, for the most part, just competing with their past. We shouldn’t assume that they have the special sauce of their halcyon days just because they own the IP.
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  #53  
Old 03-13-2019, 11:45 AM
hifivic hifivic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJNies View Post
https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=369815

For the record, there are any number of other Martin dealers who can and will give you 40% off MSRP for asking. They are not allowed to advertised anything below MAP (approximately 20-25% below MSRP).
I was in high end consumer electronics retail for 36 years and 12 years in high end bicycle & fitness gear retail. I witnessed the demise of both brands AND dealers for near nearly 5 decades. Two points of interest I thought might be valuable.

1) When a vendor gets too large too often they reach a point where over distribution takes over and because of that dealers with very little "business sense" decide they have to compete on price of said product. Pricing as low as 10 or 20% over actual cost. In the long run vendors lose reputation and dealers go out of business.
2) The best more conscientious vendors CONTROL their distribution AND pricing policies....ever hear of a Bourgeois, Goodall, Lowden or Collings at 10-20% over cost? In the end the consumer gets what they paid for and the best will always cost more.
I thought this might help explain wild discounts reported in this thread. The other point of interest that has irked me for many years is when vendors list a ridiculously high "suggested or retail price" and then list a MAP of say 20% less, the bottom line is consumers really think they got a bigger discount when in reality the product never sold at that higher suggested price to begin with..........witness cheesy mall jewelry stores ........."Save 70%".........lol. Interesting that we also never hear of Taylors at 40% off, the difference is corporate philosophy. Sadly once a vendor goes down that price erosion path it cannot be reversed ever.
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Last edited by hifivic; 03-13-2019 at 12:06 PM.
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  #54  
Old 03-13-2019, 12:04 PM
Glennwillow Glennwillow is offline
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Originally Posted by leew3 View Post
by way of affirmation, I can't think what might compare to the OM-28 in that price range.
I agree. The Martin's latest incarnation of the OM-28 is a really nice guitar. The closest I can think of is the Santa Cruz OM/PW that I have, but it will cost more money, even if you can find one used. So I'd say that OM-28 is the way to go! Great choice!

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  #55  
Old 03-13-2019, 12:13 PM
hifivic hifivic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Glennwillow View Post
I agree. The Martin's latest incarnation of the OM-28 is a really nice guitar. The closest I can think of is the Santa Cruz OM/PW that I have, but it will cost more money, even if you can find one used. So I'd say that OM-28 is the way to go! Great choice!

- Glenn

Cosmetically the OM-28 is simply classic also!
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  #56  
Old 03-13-2019, 12:41 PM
TJNies TJNies is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hifivic View Post
I was in high end consumer electronics retail for 36 years and 12 years in high end bicycle & fitness gear retail. I witnessed the demise of both brands AND dealers for near nearly 5 decades. Two points of interest I thought might be valuable.

1) When a vendor gets too large too often they reach a point where over distribution takes over and because of that dealers with very little "business sense" decide they have to compete on price of said product. Pricing as low as 10 or 20% over actual cost. In the long run vendors lose reputation and dealers go out of business.
2) The best more conscientious vendors CONTROL their distribution AND pricing policies....ever hear of a Bourgeois, Goodall, Lowden or Collings at 10-20% over cost? In the end the consumer gets what they paid for and the best will always cost more.
I thought this might help explain wild discounts reported in this thread. The other point of interest that has irked me for many years is when vendors list a ridiculously high "suggested or retail price" and then list a MAP of say 20% less, the bottom line is consumers really think they got a bigger discount when in reality the product never sold at that higher suggested price to begin with..........witness cheesy mall jewelry stores ........."Save 70%".........lol. Interesting that we also never hear of Taylors at 40% off, the difference is corporate philosophy. Sadly once a vendor goes down that price erosion path it cannot be reversed ever.
Point is well taken, but Martin dealers have actually been doing this for some time. I now recall an older brother who received catalogs from Elderly Instruments in the 70s. They actually printed that they would sell Martins at 40% off MSRP.

It must have been some point after then that Martin pushed the MAP price.
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  #57  
Old 03-13-2019, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by highvibrational View Post
Hi, I saw a list of moderators. Is that the same as a sponsor? Thank you.
No. A sponsor is someone who is a manufacturer or a vendor who helps support the forum. Moderators are elite rabble.
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  #58  
Old 03-13-2019, 01:37 PM
Arch Stanton Arch Stanton is offline
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Originally Posted by mercy View Post
Martin is a huge factory that produces guitars to spec so some are good and some are not. Small factories and small builders usually test the wood for targeted profiles so you get a good one each time but a good Martin is a wonderful sound.
Well,,,glad I gotta good one then!!
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  #59  
Old 03-13-2019, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by EverettWilliams View Post
I should add a “why” on the Marquis - while the new OM-28 has the 1 3/4” nut (which didn’t used to be the case), it has a Sitka rather than Adirondack top and I vastly prefer Adirondack on Martins (not true for me on all brands) because the House tone veers warm and I find that Adirondack lends a power, clarity, and sparkle that really complements the OM-28 design.

Also, I don’t know how much experience you’ve got with all of the variants and at the risk of getting hammered with “he asked about the OM-28,” the OM body shape is quite capable and, if you haven’t played around with different woods and scale lengths, I’d consider that. You may well find the long scale rosewood to be your jam, but it would be worthwhile to consider the range of possibilities. Others have suggested other makers too and, used, a number of the boutique makers would be in the price range. Not saying that any are better or worse (although I’ve got views), but there are a diverse range of takes on the OM-28 and you may find you like a different maker’s house sound. I suggest this because the search can be a joy and when you find the one, you will know it. This is a significant purchase, so it’s worth enjoying the hunt!

Good luck!
Well stated Everett. I hunted for months and it abruptly ended with the OM-28. It was "the one".
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  #60  
Old 03-13-2019, 01:58 PM
Arch Stanton Arch Stanton is offline
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Originally Posted by hifivic View Post
Cosmetically the OM-28 is simply classic also!
I agree with you both!!

Boy, we've really hijacked hivibrational's post. Lol. But that's good, he must be learning quite a bit on this thread. Great discussions..

Ps. Of course i'm partial to the OM-28, I own one! But, I played a nice V-class 414 Taylor today, there could be one in my future. Gotta pay off the Martin first.
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