Microphone vs interface: Which is more important?

[BoneDigger]

In the grand scheme, which has the biggest effect on recording quality? In other words, would you be better suited investing more money into a great interface or a great mic setup?

This is assuming the room is great and all other variables are off the table.

Todd

[ukejon]

Keep in mind that the interface may well also include the mic preamps, which are hugely important. My move from an M-Box to an Apogee Duet 2 was a giant step forward in terms of tone .

[philjs]

Originally Posted by ukejon

Keep in mind that the interface may well also include the mic preamps, which are hugely important. My move from an M-Box to an Apogee Duet 2 was a giant step forward in terms of tone .

I agree wholeheartedly! The difference between my early recordings with a Steinberg Ci2+ and my current ones with a Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 are like night and day...with the same microphones and the same resolution. My guess is that it's about 65%/35% for the preamps vs. the AD/DA converters but both have a huge impact on the resulting recordings.

Phil

[RedJoker]

You're killing me, Todd... Every question you ask, I think, "Yeah!! That's a great question!"

And then I want to spend more money....

[rick-slo]

Depends on how cheap everything is. Once you get up to at least the good quality level the mikes make more of a difference. Below that level a bad interface could be a real issue. I would probably look for a quality interface first (for reasons already mentioned). Pretty good mikes can be purchased at a fairly low price, not so much an interface. Interfaces may also include software (plus drivers, etc.).

[sdelsolray]

Originally Posted by BoneDigger

In the grand scheme, which has the biggest effect on recording quality? In other words, would you be better suited investing more money into a great interface or a great mic setup?

This is assuming the room is great and all other variables are off the table.

Todd

If all other variables are sanguine, including recording engineering skills, I believe that the best approach is to use (i) mics and an (ii) interface (i.e., preamps, AD/DA converters, monitor stereo bus, etc.) that are of equal quality, more or less. So, for example, for solo fingerstyle recording, with a $2,000 budget, a pair of used Neumann KM184 mics and an Apogee Duet 2 balances the respective quality of each. That doesn't necessarily mean each will cost the same, as the example demonstrates.

Most folks say the mics are more important than the preamps or converters (or the preamps and converters taken together). Some say each component is important and that it is the complete signal chain that should be looked at as a whole.

Rick makes an interesting point - that within the least and less expensive budgets, interfaces cost more than the mics for equivalent quality.

[RRuskin]

Originally Posted by BoneDigger

In the grand scheme, which has the biggest effect on recording quality? In other words, would you be better suited investing more money into a great interface or a great mic setup?

This is assuming the room is great and all other variables are off the table.

Todd

Your signal is only as good as the weakest link in the chain but it all starts with the microphone. Garbage in = Garbage out. Clean in going to tinker toy preamp = tinker toy sound. No amount of processing will make things better - only different.

[Bob Womack]

Originally Posted by RRuskin

Your signal is only as good as the weakest link in the chain but it all starts with the microphone. Garbage in = Garbage out. Clean in going to tinker toy preamp = tinker toy sound. No amount of processing will make things better - only different.

I'm with Rick here. A good mic through a good preamp through a good A/D converter gives you a good sound. Chintz on any one and it with show. There is one piece of weighing advice to go into the mix. Here is an old engineer's saying: "The transducers are the hardest thing to get right." From there, the mic/preamp interface is a picky, fickle thing that you need to pay attention to. Once you've got a good signal, any old excellent A/D will do.

Bob

[Rudy4]

Microphone.

All of the electronics in all but the cheapest interfaces will be more or less comparable.

The microphone is the crucial first element in the food chain, and the conversion from the mechanical world to creating a suitable electrical signal is of the utmost importance, and it's much more difficult to manufacture a really good transducer at a given price point then it is to assemble a good pre-amp or A/D converter at a good cost vs. quality point.

[Raggamuffin]

I find this example from Doug Young to be very compelling. In it, we listen to ~$4,000 worth of microphones (new retail price) captured with a relatively inexpensive $399 Zoom H6 A/D converter recorder. Even through YouTube, I'm pretty darn impressed by the sound quality. (Of course, it all starts with Doug's wonderful playing.) I imagine some nice post-processing was done on this track too, but I think it supports what others here have said about the relative importance of good transducers.

[Doug Young]

Thanks, Ragamuffin. My video's are also shot in a small untreated room, so other than the mics, it's kind of home recording at it's most basic. I think once you get beyond a certain point, the differences start getting pretty tiny, and with electronics, even the cheap stuff is pretty good these days. I don't know how to quantify the difference, but I'll just throw out something like "5X the money buys you a 1% improvement", once you get past some baseline (which seems to be getting cheaper all the time). So it's a question of how much you care about those last percentage points. To some people it makes all the difference, to others, its in the noise, if it's even audible.

The same tends to be true for mics as well, tho. I've posted a comparison before of AT2020s ($100 each) vs Brauner VM1s ($5K each), and I know some people don't accept the demo, but it's pretty hard to decide which one is "better", even tho they do sound different. Given a choice, I like good mics and good preamps (and A/Ds, etc), but it ends up being about chasing that last 0.1% that almost no one really notices anyway. But it makes me feel better.

Given the original question, I'd probably say "mics before preamp", once the baseline quality of each is good enough. But that baseline can be pretty cheap. Lots of people post nice recording here with inexpensive mics (a few hundred $$), and something like the Zoom is plenty good enough for home recording, as is the Duet that sdelsolrey mentioned, and many others. Mics can be interesting tho, due to the differences, different patterns, different ways they react to placement, and so on. They're a little like guitars in that they can all be good, but maybe different ones give you something unique to work with, however subtle. I haven't found that to be as true of preamps, but maybe I just don't have enough of them to get it.

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

Given the original question, I'd probably say "mics before preamp", once the baseline quality of each is good enough. But that baseline can be pretty cheap. Lots of people post nice recording here with inexpensive mics (a few hundred $$), and something like the Zoom is plenty good enough for home recording, as is the Duet that sdelsolrey mentioned, and many others. Mics can be interesting tho, due to the differences, different patterns, different ways they react to placement, and so on. They're a little like guitars in that they can all be good, but maybe different ones give you something unique to work with, however subtle. I haven't found that to be as true of preamps, but maybe I just don't have enough of them to get it.

I do believe that once you are at a level of decent gear or above the greater differences in sound are to be found in mikes than in preamps or A/D converters. Whatever mikes you have a good interface (preamp - A/D) will likely make those mikes sound at their best. Since microphones do vary more I am frequently tempted to buy more microphones, not so much more preamp- A/D units. Having a good interface I feel that I am giving any mike I might try out a good shake. That's one reason I feel that in upgrading gear the interface should be one step ahead of (or at least equivalent to) the quality of the microphones.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

That's one reason I feel that in upgrading gear the interface should be one step ahead of (or at least equivalent to) the quality of the microphones.

yeah, it all comes down to people's budgets, but I look at preamps as that I bought a high quality one many years ago (the same one as you, amazingly :-), and I've never really had to think about that aspect of the recording chain again. Maybe there are better ones, maybe I could be fine with a cheaper one, but it's at least on a par with any mic I want to use, so I never have to worry about it. And as a solid piece of analog gear, I should have it the rest of my life. I've already owned it 11 or 12 years now, so it's cost me under $200 a year, and will get cheaper over the next 10, 20, whatever years. I could have spent far more money by cycling thru cheaper ones, and always wondered if my recordings would be better. So instead, I get to spend money on mics :-) (oh, and guitars....)

[DesolationAngel]

I've slowly worked up, over the years, through various interfaces and now have the Apogee Quartet which is quite a wonderful piece of kit. I also have an AT4041 mic that I plug into it to record my acoustic bits acoustically (rather than taking the pickup 'n' DI route).

And yet some of my nicest sounding acoustic recordings are often made while I'm sitting on the sofa using an Apogee Mic, sitting on the coffee table, plugged straight into my Mac with no interface...

So, I guess that means... well, I'm not sure what it means... I'll get my coat...

[philjs]

Originally Posted by rick-slo

I do believe that once you are at a level of decent gear or above the greater differences in sound are to be found in mikes than in preamps or A/D converters. Whatever mikes you have a good interface (preamp - A/D) will likely make those mikes sound at their best. Since microphones do vary more I am frequently tempted to buy more microphones, not so much more preamp- A/D units. Having a good interface I feel that I am giving any mike I might try out a good shake. That's one reason I feel that in upgrading gear the interface should be one step ahead of (or at least equivalent to) the quality of the microphones.

The difference that I can see and hear -- using a pair of Peluso CEMC6s (with cardioid capsules), in the exact same setup, between my 2-year old Steinberg Ci2+ (which, as I recall, was about $200 but purchased mostly because I need a remote transport controller) and a new Focusrite Scarlett 18i8 (purchased 2 months ago, but still only $300) -- especially in the bass response but also noticeable in the clear, crisp highs, is palpable. I can hear similar differences with a new matched pair of Advanced Audio CM414 3-pattern LDCs...the main reason I upgraded to a 4 mic pre interface was for adding this pair of very decent, certainly equivalent to or better than the Pelusos, mics.

So, yeah, I now realize that the interface portion of the Steinberg was giving my mics a bad rap! I'm still using it as a MIDI remote transport controller but realizing how much of an improvement the Focusrite has made (as I wrote earlier, how much is due to decent mic pres and how much is due to a better AD conversion is a bit up in the air but my feeling is that the major part of the improvement is much better preamps) has been an eye-opener. My take-away here is that, yes, mics are important, but don't scrimp on what you plug them into, even though it may cost much less than a mic!

Phil