Is lighter weight desirable?

[Mattface]

I'm currently window shopping for a purchase in Mid-December. If I find a good example of the guitar I want locally at that time, I'll likely go with the one I can play, but when shopping online I really appreciate the sites that show pictures of the actual instrument, and I REALLY like it when they have more than one to choose from so I can actually choose the one with the prettiest woods (in my estimation). Some of these sites actually list the weights of the individual guitars, and I'm wondering if there is any common correlation between weight and tone within guitars of the same exact model and specs.

I've heard folks make appreciative comments about a lightweight guitar, and I know reducing weight if hardware is supposed to help volume and resonance, but when the guitars are otherwise identical I assume the weight difference primarily comes dow to the variability of the woods. So assuming everything else is identical is lighter weight desirable? Even if-so I'm assuming this is a generalization, and not a hard rule.

[Tony Burns]

Actually thats not the whole of it . depends on construction and the build of the instrument.
My Charles Fox sloped dread is not what Id consider a light acoustic , yet it projects well
and has a very loud sound -but its unlike other guitars- it has its own sound.
I use to think light was better - but its just different . judge a guitar by if its sound, is to
your liking- not in general terms .



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[eljay]

For this shuffleboard champion, light is a most desirable trait. On the rare occasions that I pick up any of my electrics anymore, I'm immediately put off by how heavy they are compared with acoustics. Most of my acoustics are mahogany, which is light. Hope this helps.

[Mattface]

I will admit to being turned off when I pick up a particularly heavy acoustic, but that's not what this question is about. I'm talking about a guitar model which weighs approximately 4 pounds, but when comparing five of them, the difference between the lightest and the heaviest is only about 3 ounces. Does that difference in weight tell us anything constructive about the tone of the guitar? I know there are other variables which maybe can't be measured so easily, but if you can't hear them in person, I'm wondering if this data point can be useful, or if it means anything at all.

My L-1 is as light as a potato chip. My J-45 feels like it is nailed to the floor. The rest fall in between. All of them sound spectacular.

[Twin Six]

None of my instruments are light. They are also gloriously resonant, to the extent that the tone continuously delights me. Hardwoods are dense and therefore heavy. That said, I haven't observed that weight correlates to quality in musical instruments, because of differences in construction & materials.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by Mattface

…Some of these sites actually list the weights of the individual guitars, and I'm wondering if there is any common correlation between weight and tone within guitars of the same exact model and specs.

Hi Mattface

It's easy to confuse lightly-built with light-weight. Totally different things, which may or may-not be true. In other words not all lightly built guitars are light, nor are all overbuilt guitars heavy.

Solo builders shave braces, sand the tops/sides/backs thinner than conventional factory built guitars. This doesn't necessarily make them lighter (in pounds-ounces, kilograms etc), but makes them more responsive.

One of the heaviest solo built guitars I ever played was one with Ebony back and sides, yet it sang like a bird! Glorious guitar built by Michael Bashkin.

My Olson Dreadnought is both lightly built and light, but my Bashkin OM is with a few ounces of the same weight (smaller, and lightly built). Often a difference in how much guitars vary in pounds/ounces is the woods they are built from, and the specific pieces from each species.

Wood (even sequentially cut from the same log) varies greatly in weight and flexibility.

[Mattface]

Maybe I wasn't clear enough in my question. I'm not asking about the difference in weight between a Gibson J45 and a Martin 00-18. I'm asking about the difference in weight between otherwise identical guitars. In this case several new 000-28MDs.

My question is: if you have two brand new guitars that are the same model, built on the same assembly line in the same year, is there anything useful that can be gleaned from knowing the weight difference between the two?

The reason I'm asking is because some online sellers actually include this information, so I assume it might mean something, but I'm not sure what. If I were A/Bing them in the shop, a few ounces one way or another would mean nothing to me, and neither would prettier grain. I'd close my eyes and play them and decide based soley on the way they sound and feel, but since I can't feel or hear them, I'm wondering what if anything this one data point might suggest about any differences in otherwise identical guitars.

[The Bard Rocks]

A word of caution. They could be talking about shipping weight, which is not the same as the actual weight of the guitar. Did they weigh the guitar with strings, with a pickup... You usually don't really know. I've learned to watch such things but not to put too much trust in them.

And as he said, light build is not the same as lightweight. In general, folks tend to favor a light build, but there are so many other factors and so many exceptions that you can easily be led astray. Pay attention to it but don't put too much stock in it. Two identical appearing guitars of the same model and woods should be very close to the same weight.

[KevinH]

Someone raised this question several months back (in particular, see Alan Carruth's comment in this thread). The general consensus then, which makes sense to me, is that the part of the guitar which could be most sensitive to weight is the top, but it accounts for a minor part of the total weight. Given that many guitars (except those built by small shops) are precisely machined with CNC these days, it's much more likely that weight variations are due to say, the density of the neck, which won't affect the tonal properties noticeably. So the answer to your question would be no, the total weight isn't likely to be a good indicator.

Originally Posted by Mattface

I will admit to being turned off when I pick up a particularly heavy acoustic, but that's not what this question is about. I'm talking about a guitar model which weighs approximately 4 pounds, but when comparing five of them, the difference between the lightest and the heaviest is only about 3 ounces. Does that difference in weight tell us anything constructive about the tone of the guitar? I know there are other variables which maybe can't be measured so easily, but if you can't hear them in person, I'm wondering if this data point can be useful, or if it means anything at all.

[rick-slo]

Lots of variables.

Let's reduce those:
Say you have one specific guitar and focus on just the top of that guitar. In someway you lighten its weight - thinned the top and/or its braces. Also posit there has been no change in humidity. I would expect the tone balance to shift towards the lower frequencies and the sustain to lessen. That could be a good thing or bad thing depending on how the guitar sounded initially.

[BadWithNames]

I’ve wondered the same - Sweetwater (among others) will show you pics and actual weights of all of the samples of a model of guitar they have in stock. Usually the difference is a few ounces. I’ve heard people claim that it mattered for electrics (a light tele sounds better than a heavy one, according to legend), but no idea about acoustics. Me, I’d pick the lightest, unless another one looked better .

Cheers!

[Brucebubs]

My Huss & Dalton is very light and extremely responsive and loud.

My Guild F-412 weighs a ton and is responsive and extremely loud.

[Scotso]

Generally lighter is better yielding a more responsive guitar. BUT...it can go too far. There are some boutique guitars that have taken light too far in my mind. I have seen bellying, in a bad way, in some of these brands in new to newish guitars. Where that line is drawn is hard to know for a non luthier like myself.

[Mattface]

Originally Posted by The Bard Rocks

A word of caution. They could be talking about shipping weight, which is not the same as the actual weight of the guitar. Did they weigh the guitar with strings, with a pickup... You usually don't really know. I've learned to watch such things but not to put too much trust in them.

And as he said, light build is not the same as lightweight. In general, folks tend to favor a light build, but there are so many other factors and so many exceptions that you can easily be led astray. Pay attention to it but don't put too much stock in it. Two identical appearing guitars of the same model and woods should be very close to the same weight.

In this case since they are giving weight for specific serial numbered guitars, I'm assuming they are weighed with strings on, ready to play. The difference in weight is within 3 ounces between the lightest and heaviest example, so you're right that the difference is minimal

Originally Posted by KevinH

Someone raised this question several months back. The general consensus then, which makes sense to me, is that the part of the guitar which could be most sensitive to weight is the top, but it accounts for a minor part of the total weight. Given that many guitars (except those built by small shops) are precisely machined with CNC these days, it's much more likely that weight variations are due to say, the density of the neck, which won't affect the tonal properties noticeably. So the answer to your question would be no, the total weight isn't likely to be a good indicator.

That makes sense. if we're talking about an ounce difference in the entire guitar, we can't know if that difference is primarily in the top, bracing, finish, etc. or even if it was weighed at a higher humidity level. So even if it does mean something, it's impossible to guess what. Even if I played all five and perceived a difference, would I be able to correlate that to weight? I Just don't know, but I find it interesting that they go to the trouble to weigh them all and list the weight if it's meaningless.