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When the dogs aren't causing a ruckus it's a super show! |
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D.H. |
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Thanks I would guess given Heider is given credit as the engineer owner in the late 60's early 70 it is likely him ?
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 |
#19
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It appears that it takes many engineers to keep Van the Man happy. D.H. |
#20
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wally_...early%201970s.
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 |
#21
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You guys are involved in the coolest threads....
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So when we hear two voices and a single guitar and it sounds like LDCs, it makes sense. Bob * We've got a ~1970 AKG C450 body from that period at our studio. We've got a total of three of the 450 bodies including two from the mid-70s. We also got a couple of 452s and a boatload of 460s. We also have a matched pair of the modern C451Bs. Of course, we support three studios with all that poop. I've wondered why we had the AKGs instead of the Neumann KM84s and then it occurred to me: We were an all-Neve facility with an 8024 (1073s) and a pair of 8058s (33102s). Old Neves have rounder sounding preamps. There's something about the Neve/451 relationship that mellows the mic and makes it sound really nice. Some of the best hi-hat and ride cymbal bell "ping!" sounds I've ever gotten came out of that pairing.
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"It is said, 'Go not to the elves for counsel for they will say both no and yes.' " Frodo Baggins to Gildor Inglorion, The Fellowship of the Ring THE MUSICIAN'S ROOM (my website) |
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This is one of the most interesting threads that I have seen in long awhile. In the early 70s, I was very involved in our college radio station. Countless hours behind the board were spent studying the liner notes, including where the recording was made, who produced the album, and of course the backup performers.
Of course, back then, everything had an analog solution: you want echo? Open the door to the stairwell. Guitar too loud? Move the mic back a few inches. etc. etc. And then of course there was always the magic of multiple takes until you got it right! Let’s not forget one other thing. These years defined the acoustic guitar genre for the next sixty years. All of us discussing this thread have that analog, acoustic base line (no pun) firmly implanted in our memory. Thanks again for starting this thread and as always, Bob Womack for your voluminous knowledge. Best, Rick
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My case in point, I have a pretty nice A Designs MP2A 2 channel "hybrid tube" mic pre and had been using it almost exclusively as my mic pre running through the previous Avid Omni interface I had . BUT now with the new Avid Carbon interface and it's mic pre's, I am now finding I kinda prefer it for both my pair of AEA Ribbons for guitar, and my ADK Z Mod 251 Tube mic for voice, into the Carbons mic pre's .
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 Last edited by KevWind; 03-20-2021 at 08:21 AM. |
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I am also finding this discussion and information fascinating!
- Glenn
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Here's What I Remember About late-'60's, early-'70's Sound -'
Aloha Knives & Guitars,
I'm late to respond to this thread, but have been lurking & enjoying from the sidelines. Great perspectives K&G, Bob (incredible inside information & histories), Eric, Kevwind, etc. about the music, recording elements, artists & how the music was made. Great Flashbacks! Ha! There WERE some great examples of nice acoustic analog sound from that era - name your hero. We just couldn't replicate them exactly at home back then with the gear that was available & affordable to us in late '60's - early 70's. It was still studio time for most if you had a group of songs worth recording. However, as a gigger thrown out on a stage stool typically with a pair of ancient, beat-up Shure 57's or 58's, & some teenaged punk wannabe engineer at the board, this is what I remember most about the "sound" of that era. PLEASE TURN SOME OF THESE UP HIGH TO HEAR THEM: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FINnXz06qic And this... https://freesound.org/people/Natha1308/sounds/261343/ This Too... https://freesound.org/people/randomr.../sounds/24306/ This ad nauseum: https://freesound.org/people/ipears1/sounds/118076/ The multitude of unexpected & unwanted Live "effects" is what I remember more about that uncontrollable live sound era than the music I played. Sad Huh? Well, like most Boomers, that whole era is kinda (VERY) murky & purple-hazy. And the doses were uncontrollable. And Effing Fun! For Recording, fighting analog Tape Hiss without killing the sound of a guitar is by far what I remember most. That was my biggest challenge on that analog tape gear. In '79, when I got my then-very-expensive, first Sony F-1 digital recorder, I almost cried on the first playback. After years of terrible noise, there was Absolutely No Tape Hiss or sound at all. There was Less warmth & depth, but no noise & clearer & more detailed! THAT was more than a strong revelation for me! And again, that was more memorable than the music I was recording on that gear back then. Ha! Here is the Tape Hiss from a blank ferous oxide analog tape. Turn it way up to hear! https://freesound.org/people/kijjaz/sounds/430973/ And it's very difficult to explain in words how "affordable" noise reduction units would kill the natural dynamics, feel & sounds of an acoustic guitar but they did. Their compression was brutal. That is, until I got into 1-2" Studer decks in the mid-70's with the best NR available in studios then - still my favorite recorded acoustic guitar results. In 1970, we all tried to copy the sounds of our acoustic heros' recordings on "very sparse & terrible quality" gear, without all the cool stuff we have at home today to have the potential to match that pro sound. But we couldn't replicate them it at home affordably then. Example: A fifteen-minute long pancake of 1" quality ferrous oxide tape cost $46 bucks in the mid-70's! Nuff sed. So most players I knew saved for studio time on demos. Today, with some knowledge & experience, & trained EARS, we don't need a studio to achieve pro-level quality on our tracks at home. I still think we should use ME's at studio's for mastering our tracks for release. That's what gives us a "Neil Young," or JT, or Paul Simon, or Richie Havens, or Bonnie Raitt, or Cat Stevens, or Leo Kottke quality "sound" from that VERY CREATIVE Golden Era for music from us then-kids. The ME's experience is worth it! Two last thoughts: 1) Seeing that McMurtry picture, In realize that I hated Ovation guitars then & now - too many reasons to list. And #2? - I can't remember it aymore! HA! Oh yeah, - 2) Few acoustic players of that era recorded their vocals separately, without their HUGE DREADNAUGHT OR JUMBO guitars ever on the verge of feeding back. I didn't even ever consider any other way on my pathetic little cassette recordings. Dylan won that battle with his engineers & every other acoustic player followed suit. Once I understood the many available options, for the last 40+ years, I always recorded vocals separately. Oh, the wisdom! I'm really glad that the Dreadnaught-only era from back then is over, although you could find vintage small 20's & 30's Martin's in pawn shops for under $100 because of no demand. I had several 0's & 00 1920's Koa Martin's in the late 60's for under $100 each. Sheesh! Of course, Smaller guitars just work better for live or recording. They sound MUCH more balanced & are just all around "better" too, IMO. If you don't believe me, build some small 00 guitars for yourself. Right Eric! Ha! 12-Fret, Deeper 00 is Da Bess Kine acoustic guitar shape! Been playing them since I built my first deeper OO sized guitar in 1974! No dreads in my house since then, even for when I rarely played with bluegrass bands! But for the late 60's & early 70's, Martin Dreadnaughts were the only way to get that real "Old Man" sound. I would go back to those days - even with those terrible mic's & worst home recording gear - in a heartbeat! Now, WE ARE THE 'Old Man.' "74 and there's not much more." Nice topic K&G! alohachris Last edited by alohachris; 03-25-2021 at 10:32 PM. |