In ear monitor advice

[YamahaGuy]

Originally Posted by shufflebeat

Just checking, have you explored the different sizes of Comply foam tips. I've been using se215s for a while (Jumbo tips) and found it difficult to believe anyone could fit the little ones.

To the OP - in my experience a useable sound can be coaxed from all but the crappiest of crappy earbuds. How much control do you have over gain staging, EQ and dynamics. Given the right idiot it's possible to make fantastically expensive 3 driver IEMs into eardrum destroyers - it would be handy to identify the problem properly before spending on a solution.

On the other hand it's always nice to have a decent set of buds, whatever the justification

The tips are not my issue. It's the plastic chassis. It hurts my ear, and it seems larger than the MEE Pro6 which is more comfortable.

Also, I agree about the mix, and whether it's eq'd or not. Out of the same buds, I've gotten horrible mixes from the house, and I've gotten terrific mixes.

[shufflebeat]

Got it.

That's a pain.

[mattbn73]

Originally Posted by jay7347

Hey Larry, been way to long brother. I've talked to our worship leader about headphones as I had one pair of Bose that weren't too big. We both are kind of kicking around the idea of that making us seem "disconnected" so to speak with the congregation. And we both realized that yeah, we're kind of disconnected with ear buds also. So that issue balances against the issue of monitor stage noise which we're trying to cut down. Its different for him because he has more interaction. Me, I just stay in back and try to play the right notes.

The bottom line for me though is the fidelity. With monitors, I had no control and frequently couldn't hear myself. With IEM's, I have control but the fidelity causes me to subconsciously back off on my playing. What sounds great in the house or to the sound booth sounds like crap to me in really cheap IEM's through an iPad.

-jay

I could never get past the "disconnected" thing and went back to stage monitors. Definitely not a cool kid .

Anyway, I talked to a buddy, and he told me that at his church they set up mics specifically for the room and congregation. I have yet to try this, but it's actually a genius idea.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by YamahaGuy

The tips are not my issue. It's the plastic chassis. It hurts my ear, and it seems larger than the MEE Pro6 which is more comfortable.

Also, I agree about the mix, and whether it's eq'd or not. Out of the same buds, I've gotten horrible mixes from the house, and I've gotten terrific mixes.

Hi YG

You may not have the option, but the new digital boards & stage monitors send every channel from the board to each headphone/monitor preamp on stage. Every person on stage sets his/her mix and tone controls (and stereo placement if you desire to mess with it).

Those provide great flexibility, and generally clean/good fidelity.

As a 70 year old, my ear canals are not the same size as they were in my youth. Even when I wore in-ear earbuds, and found ones where the plastic fits my ear canal, my right ear requires a smaller tip than the left one.

My anomaly was a primary factor in why I returned to cans for stage monitors instead of in-ear (that and the better fidelity of headphones versus buds). That and when I need to sing, I can reach up and quickly remove the can off one ear, then return it to cover that ear as soon as I'm done singing.

[jay7347]

That's pretty much the setup I have for my IEM's. Every channel the board has I've got on my iPad which I can control for the kind of mix I want. Need more bass, hit "draw" and bring it up. Want to turn down that singer that has a tough time singing on key, just a touch of the pad. That's why I like the in ears, level control over a blaring monitor approach. I had a reasonable mix going yesterday, but that fidelity. Seriously, it was like AM radio. When I can save up the money, I think its going to be a set of Shure 315's. Hopefully inserts won't be an issue.

-jay

[cmac]

I use SE-215s and the silicone buds that it comes with are a perfect fit for listening to music.

On stage, though, I found that the fit was too good. Because I got a really good seal around the ear canal, my singing (which is fairly loud) tended to swamp the rest of the mix because of bone conduction, where the sound reaches the eardrum via the skull rather than via the air. This meant I had to turn up the rest of the mix to slightly unpleasant levels.

(This is the same effect as you get when you talk with fingers in your ears. Normally the conducted sound dissipates out of the ear and into the air, but when the ear is sealed then it can only go one place and that's to the eardrum.)

So I got some cheap buds for my 215s off Ebay and I use a triple-flange set (looks like a small white Christmas tree) on stage. They don't seal the ear very well, which is intentional, since they let the worst of the bone-conducted sound escape and means I can turn the mix down to tolerable levels. I lose some bass, but that's no real problem and as a bonus, I also get some of the room ambience as well without depending on ambient microphones. If I want to just listen to music then it takes a few seconds to swap back to the buds that fit nicely.

[Johnny K]

Hey OP, what did you get?

[HotRodx14]

Originally Posted by jay7347

...When I can save up the money, I think its going to be a set of Shure 315's. Hopefully inserts won't be an issue.

FWIW - I personally prefer the 215's to the 315's. It definitely wasn't an $80 improvement anyway.

Another one to consider is the Westone AM series. I have a set of AM30s that are just fantastic, and they have an ambient port to let a little bit of "normal" sound in. The sound stage they have is nice and wide though too and they don't give you the isolated feeling as much as others I have used. They have cheaper options with single or dual drivers too that all seem to get good reviews.

I found mine used for substantially less than new. That's always a good option since you can change out tips to new ones anyway.

[dcopper]

That is why I like the BOSE. They let in just enough ambient sound.

[jay7347]

Thanks Copper and Hot Rod, I think I'll take a look at the Westone and the Boss. I've got a good deal on the the Shure's waiting for me. Its a timing thing for the money. I'm still recovering from buying my last guitar and a bunch of pedals. Thankfully, our "mom and pop store" is doing well in this economy so I don't have to throw money in that direction.

-jay

ps. And I see Westone is a Colorado company... points for that! tnx.

[jay7347]

Originally Posted by HotRodx14

FWIW - I personally prefer the 215's to the 315's. It definitely wasn't an $80 improvement anyway.

Another one to consider is the Westone AM series. I have a set of AM30s that are just fantastic, and they have an ambient port to let a little bit of "normal" sound in. The sound stage they have is nice and wide though too and they don't give you the isolated feeling as much as others I have used. They have cheaper options with single or dual drivers too that all seem to get good reviews.

I found mine used for substantially less than new. That's always a good option since you can change out tips to new ones anyway.

Hi HotRod, now that you got me on this line of thought, ;-) , do you like the Shure's or the Westone's better? I'm looking at the AM series, 20's or 30's with more saving.

tnx,
-jay