Any Multi-instrumentalists Using ToneDexter? Thoughts?

[jimfog]

Hey,

I have a ToneDexter on the way. In addition to acoustic guitar (Taylor 710ce w/Fishman Blender.....Martin OM18V w/K&K mini), live I also play dobro, mandolin, nylon string guitar and even occasional uke, all with pickups.

The best setup I've come up with to handle this is a Fishman Jerry Douglas Aura for the dobro (essential, IMO).......a Source Audio Programmable EQ to handle the eq and volume differences......maybe some ambience from a reverb or delay.......into a Baggs Venue DI. It works, sounds good and all fits on a Pedaltrain Mini board, with a power supply underneath. Plus, short of having to change eq if there's a problem, I can do everything without having to reach down and turn knobs

So, assuming I like the sound of the ToneDexter on all the instruments, and feel it can replace the JD Aura for dobro.........will I be able to load Wavemaps for all my instruments, mute my signal and choose the proper Wavemap for the instrument I want to play, have the levels and eq all be even, and do it all via footswitch?

If not, what would be the best way to do all that?

Any multi-instrument live musicians using the TD? How's it working out? Plusses? Minuses? Advice?

BTW, this is anywhere from solo in small bar venues, to duos and (mostly drummerless) bands at large festivals.

Thanks!

- Jim

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by jimfog

So, assuming I like the sound of the ToneDexter on all the instruments, and feel it can replace the JD Aura for dobro.........will I be able to load Wavemaps for all my instruments, mute my signal and choose the proper Wavemap for the instrument I want to play, have the levels and eq all be even, and do it all via footswitch?

Sure, you can do that. You have 22 patches you can store (in two banks). So just store the setting for each instrument. One challenge is that TD only has numbered patches, so you'll need to remember that #1 is the guitar, #2 is mandolin, whatever. Many of us have a strip of paper with the key taped on top to help remember. Levels can be another issue, sometimes Wavemaps turn out to have different levels, and of course your different pickups may output different levels. Volume is not stored as part of the patch, so you may need to adjust for that, tho you'd probably learn quickly what volume adjustment is needed.

I don't use all those different instruments, but I usually have multiple guitars on a gig, and switch ToneDexter accordingly.

[jimfog]

Originally Posted by Doug Young

Volume is not stored as part of the patch, so you may need to adjust for that,......

Ah......bummer. That would help a LOT if you could adjust the volume of each Wavemap, to match.

Wonder how I can make that work, with 4-5 different instruments.

Thanks!

[guitarwebguy]

Well ... I switch between 3 guitars and a banjo and have no problem .... most of the time I’ve figured out ahead of time what the settings need to be on the pickup for whichever instrument I’m playing (amp or mixer, tonedexter, pickup vol/tone) and, as already mentioned, keep a list of those settings, because my memory isn’t what it used too be, and then build song lists that allow for the flexibility to make needed adjustments when I switch instruments

[phcorrigan]

I have two acoustic guitars and an autoharp. No problem switching between them. If you're concerned about volume, get a volume pedal.

[guitarman68]

I play guitar, mandolin, bouzouki, squareneck dobro, weissenborn, National, banjo, sometimes octave mandolin - the TD does a great job on each of them.
As said before: Keep a list with the numbers and learn to adjust the right input level when switching instruments .

[shufflebeat]

I'm a happy TD user. At the minute I use an old Takamine and a passive K&K equipped mandola (small body, long neck). Over the last year I've used other guitars and the TD with other players on fiddle, guitar, mandolin.

My current practice is to set the TD and PA using the mandola which has no controls then use the controls on the Tak to match the mandola. Each instrument has it's own wavemap so swapping requires switching. I also have a Boss GE-7 EQ in-line for on the fly adjustment.

If you are a bit technically minded it's possible to control the TD training process to some extent by using recordings rather than real-time performance. Play guitar, record both pickup and mic signals and play them back into the TD in the usual way.

By processing the mic signal with EQ and varying volume you can create wavemaps with different profiles or, in your case, a set of w/ms which match up the different instruments.

It would be easier if the instruments had the same pickup but results should still be useful.

[Doug Young]

Originally Posted by jimfog

Ah......bummer. That would help a LOT if you could adjust the volume of each Wavemap, to match.

Wonder how I can make that work, with 4-5 different instruments.

Thanks!

It would be a nice feature, but I don't think it's much different than using a more normal preamp/DI (PADI, Venue, Felix,...) that don't have any stored patches at all. Every instrument's going to have slightly different output levels, so I've always had to adjust levels when switching instruments. You just get to know your instrument and make the adjustment.

[guitarman68]

Today I started working on a vid demonstrating the TD on guitar, mandolin, bouzouki, octave mandolin, banjo, squareneck dobro, National Duolian and weissenborn. I hope to have it ready during the next two or three days .

[sam.spoons]

I have had an email discussion about this exact issue with James May of Audio Sprockets. I had asked about some way of altering the volume of individual wavemaps and he pointed out that storing the input volume/gain in the tone map is impossible as out is purely analogue. I also asked about an app that would allow you to tweak wavemaps after the fact and he did say they were looking into it but it's not high on the list of priorities. If they were to include a digital trim it would be limited as the analogue preamp inevitably generates noise and you'd be boosting that along with the wanted signal.

I manage it by simply having a mark on the volume control of my Emerald X7 to match my passive fisherman equipped mandolin which works fine.

[jimfog]

Thanks guys.......

So, what about tone settings (T, M, B)? Does the Wavemap store that info also.........or not, like volume?

[Gordon Currie]

Originally Posted by jimfog

Thanks guys.......

So, what about tone settings (T, M, B)? Does the Wavemap store that info also.........or not, like volume?

Not, like volume.

[James May]

Well, as it turns out, and by popular request: we are working on implementing a gain offset adjustment into the stored WaveMap.

We are thinking of a optional +/- 6dB adjustment range that can be dialed in before storing the WaveMap after training. It will be alterable such that you can edit-copy the WaveMap and change the gain offset to something else later on. The newly adjusted gain offset WaveMap can then be pasted in place back into place, or into a different slot.

Since it doesn't alter the underlying WaveMap, it's non destructive.

[jimfog]

Originally Posted by James May

Well, as it turns out, and by popular request: we are working on implementing a gain offset adjustment into the stored WaveMap.

We are thinking of a optional +/- 6dB adjustment range that can be dialed in before storing the WaveMap after training. It will be alterable such that you can edit-copy the WaveMap and change the gain offset to something else later on. The newly adjusted gain offset WaveMap can then be pasted in place back into place, or into a different slot.

Since it doesn't alter the underlying WaveMap, it's non destructive.

Excellent. Will that be a firmware update?

Thanks!

[tadol]

Jeff White - playing with Lyle Lovetts Acoustic Band on tour -



Thats James May and Jeff doing a sound check after making some new wavemaps before the show -