Guitars that complement each other

[bufflehead]

This is a diversion from the "In the end it's how well you play" thread, posted here as a new thread because I didn't want to hijack the original.

For many years I played a with someone who played a Martin D-18. It was a wonderful guitar, a far better sound to my ears than my Guild D-25, and at one point I decided to sell my guitar and purchase a D-18. My partner talked me out of this madness, convincing me that two D-18s would not sound as good together as our two different guitars.

Similarly, I used to play with an old-time group that much preferred the sound of my 000-15m to my Custom D. Part of this is that the other guitarist in the group, who usually played lead to my rhythm, played an 000-18, and she felt that it was hard for her guitar to be heard over the dreadnought.

I suppose I'm asking this as a rhythm player: are there some guitars that work better backing up other guitars? For example, would a D-18 be a better backup for someone playing a D-28 than vice versa? Likewise, are there some guitars that complement each other perfectly?

Please share your experience in this regard.

[buddyhu]

I will say it, because if I don’t, someone else will.

A very important element that pertains to a lead standing out is HOW the rhythm player plays. Players that continue to play full volume strumming clutter the sonic palette; players who back off on volume, and play small portions of a chord (an example would be playing two or three bass strings), or who do chops (mute the chord soon after striking it) leave lots of space for the lead to be heard.

But to answer your question, it seems that it works best when two guitars have different voices, which can result from the guitars being different sizes (but perhaps the same woods; a more nasal quality from a smaller body can contrast well with a dread), being made of different woods, being made by different makers (e.g. a Collings in EIR and a Martin in EIR), or even guitars that are different models, but otherwise are similar (a D35 and a D28).

An excellent example of what can work is found in the playing and guitars of David Rawlings and Gillian Welch.

[TwangGang]

I don't have specific recommendations for you but I always liked two different sounding guitars playing together as opposed to two very similar guitars. While a D28 may sound great, two of them doesn't sound twice as good. I like different tone woods as well to get some separation between the two. i.e. a maple body with a rosewood or a mahogany.

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by bufflehead

...For many years I played a with someone who played a Martin D-18. It was a wonderful guitar, a far better sound to my ears than my Guild D-25, and at one point I decided to sell my guitar and purchase a D-18. My partner talked me out of this madness, convincing me that two D-18s would not sound as good together as our two different guitars.

Similarly, I used to play with an old-time group that much preferred the sound of my 000-15m to my Custom D. Part of this is that the other guitarist in the group, who usually played lead to my rhythm, played an 000-18, and she felt that it was hard for her guitar to be heard over the dreadnought.

I suppose I'm asking this as a rhythm player: are there some guitars that work better backing up other guitars?...

Sounds like you've pretty much answered your own question - IME hog-tops work with just about anything, and you've got two good ones there that'll cover any situation...

[J Patrick]

My mates and I mix and match a dozen or so guitars when we work out our tunes….especially useful when we’re recording to mix up our sound from song to song….there are no hard fast rules and two identical guitars could work as long as they are being played with contrasting parts….

….generally speaking though two guitars with distinct voices give more interest space and depth to a composition….and as Rich pointed out…player mindfulness is the key…

[woodbox]

Ah yes,
variety is good.

I was in an acoustic trio for many years as 2nd guitar/lead vocals,
and usually played a Taylor 714CE made of Rosewood/WR Cedar, behind the lead players 614CE which was Maple/Sitka.

Then there was the acoustic duo where we had quite the collection between us .. usually close to 50 guitars to pick from at any given time.

At gigs we usually paired one of his Rosewood Martin’s ..000-21, OM-28, HD28V..
with one of my Mahogany Martin’s ..usually my 000-18GE -either the 12 fret or 14 fret.

But another frequent coupling was my Gibson J45 with his HD28V.

When we had a couple outdoor gigs we didn’t want to take higher end guitars to,
he used his big old laminated Takamine, that was simply great plugged in, and I took a Voyage Air with a Fishman RareEarth.

So yes, I’m a big fan of diversity in guitars playing together.
Varying tonal texture can be very nice.

[Bob from Brooklyn]

Dickie & Duane both played Les Pauls

[R22]

I mostly write and record now. Recordists often compare the need for differently voiced mics, to a painter having a palette of colors. Same with instruments. I have a Gibson and a Martin acoustic. A Tele with single coils and a Reverend with P90's. It just make things more interesting. Easier to mix also, although arrangement is everything. Regardless of the instrument, the parts need to work together.

Roger

[JKA]

Any two guitars will complement each other regardless of make or how they're manufactured providing the guitarists are competent in playing them. As Segovia said...The only thing that sounds better than a guitar is two guitars...

[Mandobart]

You know orchestras aren't made up entirely of violins. Concert bands aren't just trumpets. Bluegrass bands have 4 to 5 different voices. Same with jazz bands.

To me, it sounds way better to have a duo featuring a guitar and something else that's not a guitar - fiddle, mandolin, ukulele, etc. Lacking that you should have one guitar in standard tuning and one in an alternate tuning or capoed up.

Two different guitars playing the same chords in the same positions? Never sounds as good to me. I don't care how "different" the two guitars are, if they're both playing the same thing it's a lot less interesting and less professional sounding.

[Coler]

Two acoustic guitars played together can be amazing. It totally depends on how they are played and the skill of the players. What kind of body shape and what they are built of does not signify at all, relative to how they are played.

[YeOldRocker]

Some thoughts...

Whether playing live, or recording, it's usually good to have two very different guitar voices (meaning different tonal palettes, woods, body size, whatever). So, yes, a mahogany-backed guitar and a rosewood probably will sound more interesting together than, say, two close-to-identical guitars.

That said, where you play on your guitar neck, a capo, barred or higher fret voicing will sound better against open chords played by the other guitarist. For leads, this is less of an issue, so I agree with a previous post that mentions volume; unless you're dealing with pickups and PAs, a loud strummer will obliterate a single note lead.

Ultimately, you need to arrange your guitars to complement one another in your arrangement(s) regardless of wood selection or body size.

[woodbox]

To play off what both Mandobart and YeOldRocker posted-

Yes, good points.
In both the duo and trio, we would play different inversions.
One playing open while the other barre for example.

The trio lead player used slide quite often to change things up.
The duo lead player liked dropped D, so sometimes I’d capo on 2 and play in C shapes.

Playing with those guys, who were both waaay more accomplished than I,
taught me to learn at least 3 different ways to play a chord, and use them for texturing a song.

I like to think the general audience liked what we did,
and not just the other guitar players in the room.

[Coler]

If somebody who I was playing with, and who I regarded as an accomplished player, told me I was playing too loud, I would certainly evaluate my approach with a view to adjusting it. Especially if they were playing something intricate and I was strumming along.

As a general comment, you have to remember that unplugged you are behind the sound source of your own guitar (assuming o sound port). What the person directly across or in front of you hears is far louder and projects way more.

[Silly Moustache]

Tools for the Job!
When Martin changed their designs from 12 fret necks with wider fretboards they changed the 000 and later the dreadnought into rhythm guitars, mainly for tenor banjo players.

However they were intended for rhythm in dance bands and were unsuccessful in that capacity as the archtop designs were better suited, but the dreads did find a home in string bands and folk combos.

The so called "Martin sound" was bass biased so a smaller guitar with a more neutral, or even treble bias might well stand out better.

Of course the prominence of bass or treble of a guitar can be altered , albeit subtle, by picking hand placement (you tone control) and the choice of picks used on both guitars.