A Tale of Two Jacks

[David Eastwood]

I’ve been using Planet Waves (now D’Addario) cables for years. Solid construction and a no-nonsense warranty policy have kept me as a repeat buyer as the need arises.

A new guitar purchase has made me question this. My go-to guitar cable would not stay in the socket. It seemed to latch, but popped out at some inopportune time seconds or minutes later. I even returned the guitar, and found the same thing happening with its replacement.

Poking around in the cable box, I found a no-name cable that is rock solid.

So, after a bit of searching, and some actual measurements, I determined that the jack on the PW cable is actually shorter than one that works. Quite why this guitar should be so finicky, and all my others be just fine is immaterial. A 1/4” jack plug is a 1/4” jack plug, isn’t it?

Apparently not. Anyone else ever come across this? First picture is no-name, second is PW.

IMG_1705537206.059226.jpgIMG_1705537216.593233.jpg

[Rudy4]

It needs to mate appropriately with the JACK it plugs into. What you are picturing is a PLUG.

[Glennwillow]

I have had this problem before. My solution of the past has been to change cables until it stopped being a problem. I think you have just found a reason to account for the problem.

Cool!

- Glenn

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

It needs to mate appropriately with the JACK it plugs into. What you are picturing is a PLUG.

Seriously, is that all you have to offer?

Good grief.

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Glennwillow

I have had this problem before. My solution of the past has been to change cables until it stopped being a problem. I think you have just found a reason to account for the problem.

Thanks, Glenn. This is, seriously, the first time I’ve ever run into this issue in (mumble) decades of plugging JACKS into SOCKETS.

Apparently, I have the naming convention wrong - but at least one person (you) understood what I was talking about.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by David Eastwood

Seriously, is that all you have to offer?

Good grief.

No offense, but you have to ask the right question to get the right answer.

You can find the CORRECT dimension by perusing Switchcraft's information. They are a major manufacturer and you can find the information you seek.

Switchcraft PLUGS and JACKS (no sockets...)

No grief necessary.

Seriously, look at the actual specifications and you can determine if your plug is manufactured to appropriate specifications or if it should be labeled as bargain bin cabling.

That's all I have to offer.

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

Seriously, look at the actual specifications and you can determine if your plug is manufactured to appropriate specifications or if it should be labeled as bargain bin cabling.

Now we've got the nomenclature sorted, I followed your suggestion.

Unfortunately, the specification is incomplete - it shows the overall length of the portion of the plug that is inserted in the jack, and its diameter. It does not specify anything about the tip and its proportions, which is where the problem I encountered is found.

As can be seen in the photos, the Planet Waves plug has a longer tip, thus shortening the sleeve portion of the shaft, and moving the indentation where the jack's tip contact is intended to reside, locking the plug in place. Both it, and the no-name plug are actually the same length, and conform to the Switchcraft spec in that regard.

The PW cable (hardly 'bargain bin') works in every other guitar I own, which is why I assumed it must be an issue with the new guitar.

[YamahaGuy]

Cable issues can be frustrating to diagnose and ironically simple to solve. I was patching an acoustic amp into our band's PA system via the line out on the amp. It was a 1/4" connection. A TRS cable did not work. There was a slight buzz at the snake and very little signal transferred to the mixer and consequently the speaker system. An unbalanced cable worked perfectly. I've never experienced that before, but it happened last week.

My late model Yamaha acoustic-electric guitars occasionally had a bad connection. I tried the best cables money can buy. Nothing helped. That ended up being a faulty battery sled/input jack issue only resolved by replacing the input jack/battery box unit.

[Mandobart]

On a TS or TRS jack (female connection that resides on the instrument) the tip connection is a long "prong" coming off the side. This flexes every time you plug in and unplug a cord. I have seen these wear out to the point they no longer reliably make a good connection. The slightly longer plug can probably make better contact with a worn tip connection.

I have removed, disassembled, straighten, reassembled and reinstalled jacks, but if I'm going to that much effort it's just as easy to replace with a new one.

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Mandobart

On a TS or TRS jack (female connection that resides on the instrument) the tip connection is a long "prong" coming off the side. This flexes every time you plug in and unplug a cord. I have seen these wear out to the point they no longer reliably make a good connection. The slightly longer plug can probably make better contact with a worn tip connection.

I have removed, disassembled, straighten, reassembled and reinstalled jacks, but if I'm going to that much effort it's just as easy to replace with a new one.

I, too, have done that in the past. However, this was a brand-new instrument. When I removed the jack to do just what you suggest, I discovered that the manufacturer, in their infinite wisdom, had chosen to install an enclosed jack. There was very limited access to the contacts through an opening in the end, so I chose not to mess with it, took it back for an exchange.

I ended up with an instrument with exactly the same issue, which is where we came in

[imwjl]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

No offense, but you have to ask the right question to get the right answer.

You can find the CORRECT dimension by perusing Switchcraft's information. They are a major manufacturer and you can find the information you seek.

Switchcraft PLUGS and JACKS (no sockets...)

No grief necessary.

Seriously, look at the actual specifications and you can determine if your plug is manufactured to appropriate specifications or if it should be labeled as bargain bin cabling.

That's all I have to offer.

FWIW on Switchcraft, my FSR Thin Skin Telecaster was poor with all cables, some more than others. I thought maybe carefully bend it to push harder. It and the Guitar Zoo (Guitar Center) near me house brand were very thin metal. A Switchcraft brand installed made all cables work better. The steel is a heavier gauge than the OEM jack.

[Rudy4]

Thanks for the additional notes, David.
This is a most interesting "case study", and it seems the devil is indeed in the details. The rough specifications of both plugs, 1-3/16" shoulder to tip, are close on both plugs, but from your photos it's obvious that the manufacturers take liberties with how they shape the tip portion of the plug.

I do remember reading part of a cable description that even touted their tip end shape as being "easier" to insert and remove. I don't remember what manufacturer and that's been many years ago.

I'm also not a fan of sealed jacks, although it's obviously better for keeping errant stuff such as carpet fuzz away from the connection points.
It sounds to me like you are experiancing the "perfect storm" of having a "unique" tip shape on the plug matched up with a less than ideal spring connection within the jack.

Does this mean you have no problems, as long as you use your secondary cable?

Hopefully this at least remediates the problem if you like the guitar and don't want to change the jack.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by imwjl

FWIW on Switchcraft, my FSR Thin Skin Telecaster was poor with all cables, some more than others. I thought maybe carefully bend it to push harder. It and the Guitar Zoo (Guitar Center) near me house brand were very thin metal. A Switchcraft brand installed made all cables work better. The steel is a heavier gauge than the OEM jack.

I usually purchase K&K Pure Mini pickups to install in my acoustic guitars and decided to give their main competitor a try. I did the install and had difficulties within a few weeks with the jack not "clicking" in reliably when inserting the plug. I replaced the enclosed jack with a Switchcraft replacement and it's been fine every since.

Lesson learned.

The jack reliability issue happens often enough that StewMac and other supply houses now carry the Pure Tone 1/4" jacks that have TWO spring connections that grasp and contact the plug tip from opposite sides.

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

Does this mean you have no problems, as long as you use your secondary cable?

Hopefully this at least remediates the problem if you like the guitar and don't want to change the jack.

Correct - as it turns out, using any other cable I own works just fine. It’s just this one older Planet Waves cable that shows the issue, and it’s only with this guitar - a perfect storm, indeed.

I actually had a Pure Tone jack in my Amazon cart ready to go, before I figured it was actually a plug problem

[Dave Hicks]

I've got a silent-connect cable - it works fine in everything except one guitar and a mandolin where it doesn't connect. Oh, and it doesn't stay in a G&L jack, but neither does any other plug.

D.H.