To memorize finger board or not..that is the question

[BeerHunter]

I've been sorta playing off and on for a number of years..mainly just plunking around a campfire chording , playing some rudimentary classical pieces that seldom took me past the 5th position or some more contemporary pieces by ear.(ie Titanic theme , Wind Under my Wings , Theme from Exodus). Simple but recognizable.Mainly built around chord progressions and scales.

Now I'm semi-retired , have NO ambition whatsoever to go on a "concert tour" and really don't care whether or not that second voice 1/2 note is held for the full two beats. I just want to play.Want to delve into some of the more challenging pieces simply because I like the sound of them.

My old classical guitar teacher (from many years ago) said not to bother memorizing the fingerboard because as you come into complex pieces in the higher positions , just use a chart , figure out the fingering /notes and you will remember it then. Some tutorials say exactly the same thing. Seemed to work while I was studying.

Scales were more of a pattern and finger exercise rather than a note by note study.

Yet others say memorizing the fingerboard is one of the first things you should do to advance.

Neither is right..and neither is wrong...but what is your opinion?

[stanron]

I'm inclined to agree with your old classical guitar teacher. Detailed knowledge of the fretboard is useful for improvising but not always essential. Learn stuff when you need it. If you know how to work stuff out you will eventually remember stuff you repeat. If you are not going to use stuff why bother to learn it? Enjoy.

[mr. beaumont]

Really knowing the fretboard was one of the best things I ever did for my playing.

It allows me to "just play"-- with anybody, any chord, any song, and never have to just double another guitar...it freed me up to improvise over thye whole neck...which is great for "serious" guitar playing but also great for somebody who just wants to "make it up as they go along."

[815C]

When I was a theology student I had an old school professor - one of those rare old scholars whose brilliance inspired you to study and study hard. One time I recall having over 80 pages of notes to study for a test and I went to his office and asked him what I should focus on in my study time to best prepare for the test.

He drew a long dramatic breath and said, "Don't ask me how little you should learn - learn all that you can."

At the time I wasn't amused at his answer, however as the years have gone by, I've grown to appreciate it more and more.

Being able to look at the fretboard and see every note - like it was written on the neck - is a great foundation for learning music and will make memorization of new tunes more efficient, and will enhance your ability to communicate with other musicians.

Learning the fretboard will not hurt you - it will help. So in the words of Dr. Floyd, "Don't ask how little you should learn - learn all that you can."

[Bikewer]

I think it's a matter of degree... And what you mean by "memorize". If you mean being able to sight-read music and to be able to more-or-less simultaneously name each note as you play it all over the fretboard...That's one thing.
Useful for some folks, not so much for others.

For many, like myself, It's more a matter of memorizing positions and applying scale patterns that I can then improvise out of.
Years ago, I learned 4-5 pentatonic/blues scale patterns and figured out where the tonic, dominant, and subdominant notes fall out in each one.

So if the tune is in "G", I can quickly start playing "G" (or Em) patterns and fit in quite nicely.
This without being able to sight-read or being able to name all the notes I'm playing.

[JonPR]

IMO, you don't need to work on memorizing it in advance, as a special exercise. You can build up the knowledge slowly, as you learn other stuff. I agree with your classical teacher in that sense; it can be a gradual process.
But what's of little concern to a classical guitarist - improvisation - is of much more importance in most popular styles, from jazz on down.

For that reason, I do think it's really important to know all the notes, not just the patterns. (I agree with mr beaumont there.) An improviser needs to know what's going on in a piece of music, not just how to play what's written. That means theory (to some extent), which begins with knowing the notes.

Learning the notes is actually a whole lot easier than memorizing patterns anyway. The notes are always the same, that's the thing; they don't move (unless you retune your guitar). Patterns shift around, get applied here and there, according to other abstract systems you need to memorize. (I know all my notes, but ****ed if I could learn all those scale patterns and that process of application... I don't need to because I know the notes, and how scales and chords are constructed. I make my own patterns, if and when I need them.)

So, learn the notes, and learn a little scale, key and chord theory to help back it up (you don't need to read whole books, just the basics will do). That's all you really need. But don't sweat about doing it all at once, or instead of anything else (especially anything that's more fun).
Just keep part of your brain alert when you start playing something in an area of the neck you're not familiar with. What are those notes? How do they fit these chords, or this key I'm in? In what ways does this tune resemble others I already know?
IOW, you should be interested and curious about that side of it, putting the pieces together. If you just learn to play something via patterns, by rote, from tab or whatever, it might sound OK, but you're just being a robot, a functionary. Knowing the notes, and a little theory, seeing the underlying form, etc, puts you in charge. You become a musician, not just the composer's slave.

[j3ffr0]

One can never learn the fretboard too well. I always feel like I could be quicker to certain things -- one more way to play a certain chord and so forth; it's all useful. You will never stop learning.

[jackcooper]

Some people need that knowledge to make the best music they can. Others (including some well known songwriters) prefer to flounder (maybe not the best word) about discovering things by accident. Sometimes beautiful things can be discovered by accident.

I think it all depends on your approach to music and how your brain is wired up.

[AirWolf]

Worth it if you have the ambition.

[Blueser100]

I am learning the fretboard now. Never realized til now how much not knowing the notes has held me back.

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by BeerHunter

I just want to play.Want to delve into some of the more challenging pieces simply because I like the sound of them.

Shortest route to that (and having fun along the way) is just learn to play those songs.

Too much concentration on scales and theory will just slow you down.

Do more of the latter if you have the time and you get more interested in improvisation.

[Bikewer]

We had a friend (since deceased) who was one of those talented self-taught guys... He could come up with clever arrangements for the songs he wrote and throw in nifty instrumental breaks...
But he couldn't even name most of the standard chords he was using.

"What's this?", He'd ask. "B minor". "Oh. Cool."

I read that jazz-god Tal Farlow learned to play complex chords by listening to big-band recordings on his record player.
When he finally started jamming with other players, they all were mystified by his odd-ball fingerings... But they sounded good.

[soma5]

Do you like to improvise? Or do you play mostly set arrangements? If you like to improvise, how could it hurt you to learn the fretboard? That gives you more tools to use. I suggest 5-10 minutes spent on learning the fretboard per practice session. You will be surprised at the results.

[bbrown]

Really great post!

Originally Posted by 815C

When I was a theology student I had an old school professor - one of those rare old scholars whose brilliance inspired you to study and study hard. One time I recall having over 80 pages of notes to study for a test and I went to his office and asked him what I should focus on in my study time to best prepare for the test.

He drew a long dramatic breath and said, "Don't ask me how little you should learn - learn all that you can."

At the time I wasn't amused at his answer, however as the years have gone by, I've grown to appreciate it more and more.

Being able to look at the fretboard and see every note - like it was written on the neck - is a great foundation for learning music and will make memorization of new tunes more efficient, and will enhance your ability to communicate with other musicians.

Learning the fretboard will not hurt you - it will help. So in the words of Dr. Floyd, "Don't ask how little you should learn - learn all that you can."

[Toby Walker]

Originally Posted by 815C

When I was a theology student I had an old school professor - one of those rare old scholars whose brilliance inspired you to study and study hard. One time I recall having over 80 pages of notes to study for a test and I went to his office and asked him what I should focus on in my study time to best prepare for the test.

He drew a long dramatic breath and said, "Don't ask me how little you should learn - learn all that you can."

At the time I wasn't amused at his answer, however as the years have gone by, I've grown to appreciate it more and more.

Being able to look at the fretboard and see every note - like it was written on the neck - is a great foundation for learning music and will make memorization of new tunes more efficient, and will enhance your ability to communicate with other musicians.

Learning the fretboard will not hurt you - it will help. So in the words of Dr. Floyd, "Don't ask how little you should learn - learn all that you can."

One of the best pieces of advice I've seen in a long time!!!!!