How important is getting your arrangements in proper digital tab format

[stuartb]

Let's see if I an ask the question I'm trying to ask.

I'm going back to basics a bit as I push to new levels playing the guitar. I've written a number of instrumentals, and arrangements and often modify songs that I do work on, with penciled edits all over the pages etc.,

From your vantage point, how important is it to get those arrangements, particularly your own songs/instrumentals, into proper tab or standard music notation - with correct timing, and indicators for pull offs etc.,

I have tendency to write out arrangement in tab which ends up being quite sloppy with little thought about timing, generally, on printed tab pages. I end up playing the songs as I wish to play them, but as part of - getting a better handle on timing and what it is I'm actually playing, I was thinking it would make sense to get some of these arrangements more accurately on a page, with the nuances and timing I am trying to achieve. I don't really think about the timing, for instance. I just play.

I do read traditional music notation, not wonderfully, but reasonably, and I'm ok with getting both traditional music notation and tab on paper, but I want to know if going through the process of formally getting your music on paper, with a reasonable degree of accuracy to reflect the underlying musical intent, has helped you as you have worked through the process of learning songs and remembering complex arrangements - and perhaps it has also supported sharing.


Stuart

[rick-slo]

Not sure how important it is unless you compose a mega hit I suppose. Note timing indications can be the most time consuming and difficult part of doing a tab.
For example a moderately timing chore doing a tab of one of mine:
http://www.dcoombsguitar.com/Guitar%...istsOfTime.pdf

[DCCougar]

Originally Posted by stuartb

....I want to know if going through the process of formally getting your music on paper, with a reasonable degree of accuracy to reflect the underlying musical intent, has helped you as you have worked through the process of learning songs and remembering complex arrangements - and perhaps it has also supported sharing.

As an instrumentalist, I've worked on original pieces for probably 50 years or more, but I've never written anything out, I just record. Well, I might jot down the chords at the beginning so I don't forget, but I rarely do that. Most solo parts are just improvised, like in this piece.

[reeve21]

If you are trying to memorize all the little nuances it could be helpful to go through the exercise of writing them down. There are studies showing that note takers retain more information than passive listeners.

[ljguitar]

Originally Posted by stuartb

… I want to know if going through the process of formally getting your music on paper, with a reasonable degree of accuracy to reflect the underlying musical intent, has helped you as you have worked through the process of learning songs and remembering complex arrangements - and perhaps it has also supported sharing.


Stuart

Hi stuartb

It's not important to me at all. Ever…

If I'm handed a chord chart to a song, I break it down to the chord structure and form, and memorize it and never look at the charts again.

For personal use, I don't start with paper, or use paper. I start with songs, or ideas, and if I need to remember things or thoughts, I pull out my Zoom H1n and record bits-n-pieces so I capture them and don't forget them.

If it's a known song, I listen to 5-7 solid arrangements of it for a couple weeks, and then begin roughing in things like melody, key harmony points, verses, refrains, bridges etc.

Then I look for a key and experiment with chord progressions, rhythm, tempo etc.

If it's an original, I share it with my gigging partner and ask them to help me rough in parts by playing along.

By the time I've assembled it, it's memorized. But that's not the end for me. Just because it's performable doesn't mean I won't change it up some more if it can strengthen the arrangement.

I'm not against scores, TAB or paper - I have a degree in music, and 18 years of classical training. But my process is more tactile and auditory, and not tied to paper.

[JERZEY]

I am not a very experienced player myself. I am budding into intermediate fingerstyle. My time playing the guitar is mainly focused on fingerstyle and I dont branch out much.

I find as a new player with no theory knowledge what so ever that having a digital tab I can load into a player is the most important tool I have. I load all my practice routines in the player to start out. I run them through with and without a metronome ect. I often record myself with and without aids. I learn a LOT from doing this about my playing. Learning songs and nailing down the timing is so much easier with a digital tab vs trying to figure it out. Plus being able to add my own notes to the tab is priceless.

As someone who is learning without the aid of a teacher digital tabs are my #1 tool. I have learned more about music by screwing around with Guitar Pro and Tux then I have from any other resource.

[Doug Young]

I don't know about "important", it depends on your goals and needs. Assuming by "digital tab", you just mean nicely formatted using a notation program. I write most of my stuff out, but I publish books, individual songs, teach workshop and lessons using my material, write for magazines, etc, so having music written out is part of the game.

I also find it helpful for my own use - you never know when you'll want to dig out an old tune that I've all but forgotten. I also find it sometimes useful as an arranging/writing tool. I was just talking to a student who was having some timing issues about this. Writing something out is a good way to make sure you really understand how the parts fit together, gives you a different view of what you're doing, helps identify those spots where you're trying to cram in 4 1/2 beats into a measure, and so on. How it sounds by ear is most important, of course, but writing it out is a useful tool, and I never turn down a tool that might help.

[TBman]

Everything I do is instrumental finger style.

I'll tab out (with notation) 99.999% of the music I compose using GuitarPro. Like Derek said, getting the note timing right is the whole deal basically. It's important to me because I will never remember what I composed without writing it down.

I also use GuitarPro as a learning tool for covers that have sticky parts. I'll put the score (or sections of it) into GuitarPro manually so I can play along (like the bouncing ball over the lyrics to those songs in cartoons, )

Some newer instructional videos have the tab within the video and is synchronized with the player. Neat stuff.

[stuartb]

I bet there is a great deal to learn from that piece re timing and how to indicate timing on paper.

The music is very clear and easy to read. Did you use a specific program that I might investigate.

thx Rick,

Stuart

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Not sure how important it is unless you compose a mega hit I suppose. Note timing indications can be the most time consuming and difficult part of doing a tab.
For example a moderately timing chore doing a tab of one of mine:
http://www.dcoombsguitar.com/Guitar%...istsOfTime.pdf

[rick-slo]

Originally Posted by stuartb

I bet there is a great deal to learn from that piece re timing and how to indicate timing on paper.
The music is very clear and easy to read. Did you use a specific program that I might investigate.
thx Rick,
Stuart

I have been using PowerTab: http://www.power-tab.net/guitar.php
Free. Windows only.

[Andyrondack]

I don't write original music but I do my own arrangements of tunes I like and now I have too many to remember how I once played them, result is that I keep changing the arrangements which does not help when playing to an audience as there is a sense of panic when I realise before leaving home that I have forgotten how I used to play such and such and so have to come up with a new arrangement at the last minute, as you can probably tell no one is paying for this unprofesionalism but things would go more smoothly I'm sure if I could tab things out quickly and accurately.

[stuartb]

Originally Posted by DCCougar

As an instrumentalist, I've worked on original pieces for probably 50 years or more, but I've never written anything out, I just record. Well, I might jot down the chords at the beginning so I don't forget, but I rarely do that. Most solo parts are just improvised, like in this piece.

Interesting. I play solo fingerstyle pieces, and do like to write out melodies and more complex instrumental music and arrangements. I'm sure you're simply a more natural musician. Great gifts to have.

Stuart

[stuartb]

Originally Posted by reeve21

If you are trying to memorize all the little nuances it could be helpful to go through the exercise of writing them down. There are studies showing that note takers retain more information than passive listeners.

Well, notes I'm certainly writing out on hard paper now. I'm quite sure they do not reflect the timing of what I'm playing thought and thought i might learn something by getting it in correct digital format.

thanks!

[stuartb]

Appreciate the answer Larry,

I'm certainly not suggesting one's approach be tied to paper. Since I've never properly documented any of my own personal music.

I make note changes on other people's arrangements in pencil, etc., to remember the changes and use that when learning fingerstyle arrangements. I was wondering if others who play and arrange and have found value in writing out an arrangement - where that value is reflected by a better delivery of the song. Does it allow you to own the final product in a more precise way.

It may come down to - methods to support getting to know the fretboard better.

But with your background, your answer makes sense.

i think this is helping me understand what I'm trying to achieve. To understand, what 7th, 9th or 11th chord I'm actually playing, anywhere on the fretboard.

thanks,

Stuart

Originally Posted by ljguitar

Hi stuartb

It's not important to me at all. Ever…

If I'm handed a chord chart to a song, I break it down to the chord structure and form, and memorize it and never look at the charts again.

For personal use, I don't start with paper, or use paper. I start with songs, or ideas, and if I need to remember things or thoughts, I pull out my Zoom H1n and record bits-n-pieces so I capture them and don't forget them.

If it's a known song, I listen to 5-7 solid arrangements of it for a couple weeks, and then begin roughing in things like melody, key harmony points, verses, refrains, bridges etc.

Then I look for a key and experiment with chord progressions, rhythm, tempo etc.

If it's an original, I share it with my gigging partner and ask them to help me rough in parts by playing along.

By the time I've assembled it, it's memorized. But that's not the end for me. Just because it's performable doesn't mean I won't change it up some more if it can strengthen the arrangement.

I'm not against scores, TAB or paper - I have a degree in music, and 18 years of classical training. But my process is more tactile and auditory, and not tied to paper.

[stuartb]

Interesting, thanks Jerzey,

I've primarily learned by discovering songs - being played on utube, that I want to learn, and then one way or the other, getting the music. Sometimes that has meant figuring out what is being played using software to slow down the playing, and watch their utube video simultaneously, other times, musicians have allowed me to have the music, or I've paid for it, then I play, modify, jot down etc,

But I do have a few arrangements that would be nice to get on paper, and I was going to write down my own exercises to better know the fretboard, like developing a short melody, in a particular key, and learning to play it all over the neck of the guitar.


Stuart

Originally Posted by JERZEY

I am not a very experienced player myself. I am budding into intermediate fingerstyle. My time playing the guitar is mainly focused on fingerstyle and I dont branch out much.

I find as a new player with no theory knowledge what so ever that having a digital tab I can load into a player is the most important tool I have. I load all my practice routines in the player to start out. I run them through with and without a metronome ect. I often record myself with and without aids. I learn a LOT from doing this about my playing. Learning songs and nailing down the timing is so much easier with a digital tab vs trying to figure it out. Plus being able to add my own notes to the tab is priceless.

As someone who is learning without the aid of a teacher digital tabs are my #1 tool. I have learned more about music by screwing around with Guitar Pro and Tux then I have from any other resource.