The Fermi Paradox

[Dru Edwards]

"The Fermi paradox, named after Italian-American physicist Enrico Fermi, is the apparent contradiction between the lack of evidence for extraterrestrial life and various high estimates for their probability " (source: Wikipedia).

There are lots of reasons presented attempting to solve this paradox, such as perhaps civilizations never achieve interstellar exploration because some "great filter" prohibits civilizations from advancing after they split the atom, such as nuclear war.

Your thoughts on the Fermi Paradox? How about the Drake Equation, which attempts to provide the number of civilizations that may exist.?

[RP]

In my mind, there's no contradiction. The less evidence that refutes the claim, the greater possibility that the claim is true.

[Gitfiddlemann]

"The Fermi paradox, named after Italian-American physicist Enrico Fermi, is the apparent contradiction between the lack of evidence for extraterrestrial life and various high estimates for their probability "

I believe there is a high probability of extraterrestrial life. I think the lack of evidence may largely be due to our limited abilities to detect it.
As technology develops, we'll be able to chip away at those limitations.
I'm very excited about the new James Webb telescope from NASA to this effect.
So, stay tuned! I think this piece of hardware may help us move the needle quite a bit forward with respect to our detection capabilities.
Space is so vast. It's quite a task.

[hubcapsc]

.....................

[bfm612]

I happened upon this 'explanation' to the paradox while reading The Dark Forest by Cixin Liu, and it's compelling. I've linked to an article that more intelligently discusses it, but the Dark Forest explanation says that it's not in our interest to make contact with other lifeforms out in the universe because we can really only assume an adversarial stance and that contact will lead to conflict with each side trying to destroy the other. If you're in a dark forest, for your own self-preservation, you assume that anything you encounter is a threat and the only move is to destroy it. Best not to make your presence known.

https://medium.com/@ChemAndCode/the-...x-c576fc0a7307

[H165]

Your thoughts on the Fermi Paradox?

The "great filter" is probably distance. If civilization develops strictly due to evolution over time, then the idea that there are no other civilizations is ludicrous.

How about the Drake Equation, which attempts to provide the number of civilizations that may exist.?

The Drake Equation is just an attempt to add mathematical support to the idea of common sense.

As for why they haven't visited (or at least not often), I'd guess it comes under the heading of "why bother?". There are probably zillions of unoccupied planets able to support alien life. Why go to an occupied planet when you know all you'll find there is a less advanced or less motivated civilization? It would be like inviting a Neanderthal to a Phi Beta Kappa function.

The new virus strikes me as an extraterrestrial visitation looking for lunch.

[posternutbag]

I think there are two possibilities, which are not actually mutually exclusive.

1. The universe is unimaginably large and old. It’s entire possible that intelligent species rise and fall regularly, but they are separated by so much space and/or time that they never detect one another.

2. Intelligent life in the universe might be fairly common, but the majority of intelligent species don’t build the complex technology needed to contact or explore space. It could be that the development of math is rare, or it could be that most intelligent species are aquatic. No matter how smart a cephalopod is, it will have trouble building circuitboards without opposable digits and under water.

[Photojeep]

I've often wondered why we always expect OTHER civilizations to gain interstellar travel BEFORE us. I mean, who's to say WE aren't the most advanced civilization and thereby the leading technology of the galaxy (or universe). The argument is always made that we are far behind others, but why is that always the assumption?

While we're at it, why can't humans be the first civilization in the galaxy/universe period? Just as it's possible there are others, it should also be possible we are the only ones at our current level of technology. Someone has to be first.

Another thing I wonder about is, if other civilizations exist and have interstellar travel capabilities, why would they bother coming to visit us? Don't get me wrong, I think humans are generally pretty awesome, but why would another civilization bother with us?

Just sayin'

Best,
PJ

(Sorry to take this a bit beyond the original topic, but these are the things I wonder about and they seem similar.)

[Dirk Hofman]

Originally Posted by Photojeep

I've often wondered why we always expect OTHER civilizations to gain interstellar travel BEFORE us. I mean, who's to say WE aren't the most advanced civilization and thereby the leading technology of the galaxy (or universe). The argument is always made that we are far behind others, but why is that always the assumption?

While we're at it, why can't humans be the first civilization in the galaxy/universe period? Just as it's possible there are others, it should also be possible we are the only ones at our current level of technology. Someone has to be first.

Another thing I wonder about is, if other civilizations exist and have interstellar travel capabilities, why would they bother coming to visit us? Don't get me wrong, I think humans are generally pretty awesome, but why would another civilization bother with us?

Just sayin'

Best,
PJ

(Sorry to take this a bit beyond the original topic, but these are the things I wonder about and they seem similar.)

I mean it's possible, but given the age of the universe, it seems incredibly unlikely that we've been the first to get to this point, if there are others. Which just seems likely given the unimaginable number of stellar systems which could support life.

[Andromeda]

Originally Posted by Photojeep

I've often wondered why we always expect OTHER civilizations to gain interstellar travel BEFORE us. I mean, who's to say WE aren't the most advanced civilization and thereby the leading technology of the galaxy (or universe). The argument is always made that we are far behind others, but why is that always the assumption?

While we're at it, why can't humans be the first civilization in the galaxy/universe period? Just as it's possible there are others, it should also be possible we are the only ones at our current level of technology. Someone has to be first.

Another thing I wonder about is, if other civilizations exist and have interstellar travel capabilities, why would they bother coming to visit us? Don't get me wrong, I think humans are generally pretty awesome, but why would another civilization bother with us?

Just sayin'

Best,
PJ

(Sorry to take this a bit beyond the original topic, but these are the things I wonder about and they seem similar.)

That's pretty much what I think. It's possible that intelligent life that exists elsewhere may be on the same technological level that we are, making the distance too far for any contact.

There could be life in other galaxies, millions if not billions of light-years away and too far to contact.

Also, given the age of the universe other civilizations could have come and gone.

[Chipotle]

Originally Posted by Andromeda

There could be life in other galaxies, millions if not billions of light-years away and too far to contact.

Also, given the age of the universe other civilizations could have come and gone.

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away....

[Steve DeRosa]

Originally Posted by Dru Edwards

...Your thoughts on the Fermi Paradox? How about the Drake Equation, which attempts to provide the number of civilizations that may exist?

[Andromeda]

Originally Posted by Chipotle

A long time ago, in a galaxy far, far away....

I'm not sure we can count ourselves as intelligent. We are gouging the earth beyond sustainability, we are polluting our selves to death, and our biggest technological breakthrough seems to be nuclear weaponry capable of blowing the earth to smithereens.