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  #31  
Old 05-28-2019, 01:34 PM
zoopeda zoopeda is offline
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In my experience, casein is extremely clicky compared to just about anything.
Technique plays a huge role (and tonal preference is subjective), but I can't figure out, for the life of me, how you manage to get less click out of a BlueChip than Casein. The big casein complaint you hear from BC & plastic pick enthusiasts is that casein is too warm and not crisp enough. I thought a big reason people like BC is for that crisp attack--in part, made possible by a little extra "click."

Tonal preferences are totally subjective, but I definitely hear more click noise with BC than casein.
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  #32  
Old 05-28-2019, 01:53 PM
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Originally Posted by zoopeda View Post
Technique plays a huge role (and tonal preference is subjective), but I can't figure out, for the life of me, how you manage to get less click out of a BlueChip than Casein. The big casein complaint you hear from BC & plastic pick enthusiasts is that casein is too warm and not crisp enough. I thought a big reason people like BC is for that crisp attack--in part, made possible by a little extra "click."

Tonal preferences are totally subjective, but I definitely hear more click noise with BC than casein.
I’m another player that isn’t fond of casein. While I don’t have much pick click with Casein, I don’t have any at all with BC. Warmth/Clarity is controlled by bevel and thickness.
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  #33  
Old 05-28-2019, 01:59 PM
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I’ve been thru the pick craze. Landed unequivocally on Blue Chip. They really are beautifully designed with a prefect bevel and feel. I’ve had tortoise picks and bought and made casein picks and to me it’s not even close. Tortoise is rightfully unattainable. In my experience, casein is extremely clicky compared to just about anything. Tone-wise it is ok, but just ok. Def not worth the premium some sellers put on it. Fast turtles are the best I’ve tried and priced right!

Buy one BC and your done so long as you don’t lose it!
Unless you try something else you like better. Which you didn't but you're you. I had an experience similar to zoopeda, below...

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Originally Posted by zoopeda View Post
Technique plays a huge role (and tonal preference is subjective), but I can't figure out, for the life of me, how you manage to get less click out of a BlueChip than Casein. The big casein complaint you hear from BC & plastic pick enthusiasts is that casein is too warm and not crisp enough. I thought a big reason people like BC is for that crisp attack--in part, made possible by a little extra "click."

Tonal preferences are totally subjective, but I definitely hear more click noise with BC than casein.
I do too. I tried a few Vespel picks, both from Blue Chip and Charmed Life, but also tried some casein picks from Charmed Life at about the same time. My initial reaction was that I loved the Vespel picks and couldn't stand the casein picks. Over time, that flipped completely. Now I play casein picks from Charmed Life and Red Bear - I also have one EML and may order a couple more.

I occasionally pick up one of the Vespel picks thinking I might like it again, and I like them, but then I play one of the casein picks again and I have such an overwhelming preference for casein it's not even a little bit close. And it seems like the longer I play them, the stronger that preference grows.

I think in terms of clicky-ness, the bevel has a lot to do with it. I'm mostly a strummer when I'm playing with a pick and I find that speed-beveled picks sound clicky when I'm strumming, but those with a standard even bevel don't. The speed bevel is made mostly for flat-pickers for, obviously, speed. That's got nothing to do with my playing. Blue Chip offers a right handed and left handed speed bevel and a "round" bevel - Red Bear just calls that one a "standard" bevel.

I've also found the more pronounced the point at the end of the pick, the more clicky it sounds. I've done my share of filing picks down to a somewhat rounded point without a speed-bevel. Dave from Red Bear sent me a "pick maintenance kit" with two coursenesses of files and two buffing pads and I've gotten pretty good with them if I say so myself. Scott at Charmed Life doesn't put a speed bevel on his picks and they're not overly pointy either, so I've never had to do anything to his picks, but I've done work on the Red Bears and the EML I have.

But regardless of bevel or the point on the pick, I'm completely down with casein, which leaves Blue Chips and other Vespel picks in a distant second place. Oddly, Taylor now has some picks they call the Thermex Pro at 1.5mm and it's a really dark sounding pick. Sometimes if I capo up around the 3rd or 5th fret when things start sounding a little "zingy" for lack of a better term, one of those Taylors brings it down a few notches and evens things out. I have a pack of those - they're $2 apiece, so a different universe from the boutique picks we're talking about but that do that one job REALLY well for me at least.

-Ray
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  #34  
Old 05-28-2019, 03:34 PM
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Originally Posted by raysachs View Post
Unless you try something else you like better. Which you didn't but you're you. I had an experience similar to zoopeda, below...



I do too. I tried a few Vespel picks, both from Blue Chip and Charmed Life, but also tried some casein picks from Charmed Life at about the same time. My initial reaction was that I loved the Vespel picks and couldn't stand the casein picks. Over time, that flipped completely. Now I play casein picks from Charmed Life and Red Bear - I also have one EML and may order a couple more.

I occasionally pick up one of the Vespel picks thinking I might like it again, and I like them, but then I play one of the casein picks again and I have such an overwhelming preference for casein it's not even a little bit close. And it seems like the longer I play them, the stronger that preference grows.

I think in terms of clicky-ness, the bevel has a lot to do with it. I'm mostly a strummer when I'm playing with a pick and I find that speed-beveled picks sound clicky when I'm strumming, but those with a standard even bevel don't. The speed bevel is made mostly for flat-pickers for, obviously, speed. That's got nothing to do with my playing. Blue Chip offers a right handed and left handed speed bevel and a "round" bevel - Red Bear just calls that one a "standard" bevel.

I've also found the more pronounced the point at the end of the pick, the more clicky it sounds. I've done my share of filing picks down to a somewhat rounded point without a speed-bevel. Dave from Red Bear sent me a "pick maintenance kit" with two coursenesses of files and two buffing pads and I've gotten pretty good with them if I say so myself. Scott at Charmed Life doesn't put a speed bevel on his picks and they're not overly pointy either, so I've never had to do anything to his picks, but I've done work on the Red Bears and the EML I have.

But regardless of bevel or the point on the pick, I'm completely down with casein, which leaves Blue Chips and other Vespel picks in a distant second place. Oddly, Taylor now has some picks they call the Thermex Pro at 1.5mm and it's a really dark sounding pick. Sometimes if I capo up around the 3rd or 5th fret when things start sounding a little "zingy" for lack of a better term, one of those Taylors brings it down a few notches and evens things out. I have a pack of those - they're $2 apiece, so a different universe from the boutique picks we're talking about but that do that one job REALLY well for me at least.

-Ray
Perhaps the only thing we can say here, Ray, that seems to be a common theme, is that various players are going to experience a wide range of tonalities. I think it's safe to say that I know these materials, and others on the market, as well as anyone I know. But I've learned to rarely, if ever, predict someone's experience in playing any one material. I know this strikes some people as odd, but as noted by many posters in this thread, there are a host of playing variables that affect tone -- strings, string gauges, setup, guitar, capo, tonewoods, playing style, bevels, non-bevels, etc.

A players experience is a player's experience. Some people report casein to be a little "clicky." Many report it as the quietest they've ever played.

The most important thing: before buying, find out what the company's return and refund policy is. The best ones have the most flexible options, which is one of the reasons BC has done so well. Being easy to do business with is what most people look for, coupled with great pick materials.

scott memmer

Last edited by Charmed Life Picks; 05-28-2019 at 04:48 PM.
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  #35  
Old 05-28-2019, 04:13 PM
ALBD ALBD is offline
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Originally Posted by zoopeda View Post
Technique plays a huge role (and tonal preference is subjective), but I can't figure out, for the life of me, how you manage to get less click out of a BlueChip than Casein. The big casein complaint you hear from BC & plastic pick enthusiasts is that casein is too warm and not crisp enough. I thought a big reason people like BC is for that crisp attack--in part, made possible by a little extra "click."

Tonal preferences are totally subjective, but I definitely hear more click noise with BC than casein.
Interesting. I prefer fingers and the thing I love about BC is that it feels completely seamless to me with virtually no pick click. And it glides effortlessly across the string with plenty of warmth. I’m not sure who likes BC for “extra click” but that’s the opposite of my experience.
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  #36  
Old 05-28-2019, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by ALBD View Post
Interesting. I prefer fingers and the thing I love about BC is that it feels completely seamless to me with virtually no pick click. And it glides effortlessly across the string with plenty of warmth. I’m not sure who likes BC for “extra click” but that’s the opposite of my experience.
A lot of great choices out there. Some likes vanilla, some chocolate, some strawberry.

BTW, a hot tip. If you haven't played the Gravity Gold Series models, you folks should check them out. I tested the material for a long time and passed only because my plate is too full. Great stuff, and priced too cheaply. It's another industrial engineering plastic, but with some different tonal properties from the Vespel. A lot of good reviews out there on Gravity Gold, including mine. And I hear the owner is a heckuva nice guy.

No vested interest, no connection, just like helping great people and products.

scott memmer
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