Taylor V vs X Bracing Questions and Observations

[kriso77]

So I thought I'd post this here. It's a question that I just sent directly to Taylor to get their thoughts and thought I'd get some opinions here.

I currently have 2 Taylor 324e models that I am A/B'ing They are both identical in that they are non cutaway models with mahogany tops and blackwood back and sides. One is a 2016 model (X braced) and the V braced is a 2018.

The tonal difference is vastly different and I am trying to determine if it could be the bracing or a dry guitar issue.

The 2016 X braced has a bassy, woody tone that is really warm. I've had this one for a few months and its been hydrated with the D'Addario Humidipaks.

The 2018, which came in about a week ago has quite a bit less bass response and the high strings sounded a bit tinny. It did seem like the action was fairly low and that has improved a bit with humidification over the last few days, which makes me wonder if the huge difference in fundamental tone could be related to hydration.

I know its a bit of a loaded question, but are there supposed to be vastly different tones between the 324 X and 324 V braced guitar? If not, my guess is that the V braced needs more hydration.

Thoughts?

[cliff_the_stiff]

Strings the same?
Age and playing also certainly opens up a guitar.

[kriso77]

Originally Posted by cliff_the_stiff

Strings the same?
Age and playing also certainly opens up a guitar.

Yep. Strings are the same.

[619TF]

Originally Posted by cliff_the_stiff

Age and playing also certainly opens up a guitar.

^^This but also somewhat the bracing.

[bil40272]

When the v braced guitars first came out, a shop in town had 314ce and 614ce guitars with both x and v bracing represented. To me the difference was huge. The x braced guitars had a much fuller sound, across the board.
It seemed to.me that the v braced had some sound that was trying in vain to get out of the guitar, if that makes sence.
I was really disappointed in the new v braced guitars.
I currently have a 317e, and I love that guitar. I'm just curious what an x braced version of the 317 would sound like.
Sooo, I don't think that all of the difference an be linked to hydration.

[jjrpilot]

I don't think your ears are deceiving you.

I have a non cutaway 2016 324 no electronics. I love it. I took it over to a buddy's house who loved it so much he ordered the exact same thing BUT his came with V bracing whereas mine was X braced.

To my ears...the sustain on his is better...but the bass on mine is a smidgen more pronounced. It seems a smidgen warmer too.

Hope this helps.

[RockerDuck]

Your findings are the same as mine. I have a 414ce v brace, and I have a 314e and 814ce x braced. The x braced guitars are fuller sounding, unplugged and amplified, and the v brace has less bass and not as full sounding. I've own all three long enough to break them in on multiple gigs.

[kriso77]

Thanks for the feedback. The 2 I have are quite a bit more than a smidgen. I have my personal preference but I won't say one is good or bad, just quite different to the point that they sound like totally different guitars.

Originally Posted by jjrpilot

I don't think your ears are deceiving you.

I have a non cutaway 2016 324 no electronics. I love it. I took it over to a buddy's house who loved it so much he ordered the exact same thing BUT his came with V bracing whereas mine was X braced.

To my ears...the sustain on his is better...but the bass on mine is a smidgen more pronounced. It seems a smidgen warmer too.

Hope this helps.

[rpatkin]

Probably not helpful, but I have a 712 12 fret V braced and a 322 12 fret X braced. The 712 is definitely louder and more "precise" in the single notes, 322 is thicker and not as precise. I know, different wood combos, but that's my take (same strings on each, Daddario Nickel Bronze)

[Shades of Blue]

V bracing stiffens the top period. This means less bass. The tradeoff is sustain, fatter trebles and better intonation of the harmonic frequencies. If all a person wants is low end and bass, then they should look at an X braced guitar. I will say that while I do enjoy low end, I vastly prefer the playing experience of my V Braced Grand Pacifics. They have nice fat trebles which are just as audible as the bass notes. Part of my issue with the new Martin Reimagined HD-28 is that the trebles are thin and get lost in everything.

To my ears, there is a woodiness that comes through in the midrange of the Grand Pacifics that I don't hear in guitars with a lot of low end. A lot of times, forward shifted X bracing is all low end and treble and you get a scooped tone that is just overpowering and warbly. I've experienced this and I don't care for it.

Having said all of that, I've been playing strictly V Braced Grand Pacifics since June of last year. I plan to go play a Martin soon and see what I think about them after living with V bracing for so long. My initial expectation is that I am going to be impressed by the low end, but I have a feeling that I am going to perceive a Martin dreadnought as muddy and muffled.

I'm excited to play my first Martin in 7 months.

[vindibona1]

While hydration can affect the guitar's tone and volume, it is definitely the bracing that's making at least 90% of the tonal difference. The V-Bracing is notorious for sucking the bass and warmth out of many models. And while it all comes down to the individual guitar and the individual player, I personally would tend to shy away from the "traditional" Taylor models with V bracing. Taylor Grand Pacifics are another story- but have been designed around V-bracing whereas the other models (designs) have been "retrofitted". There are a few of the older models that do benefit from the V-class bracing, but it has been my experience (and taste) that brings me to my personal opinion is that on most models V bracing was a mistake. Perhaps we'll see Taylor "reimagined" models or some other retreat with a marketing twist in the future. They have to keep changing things up, if only to crow "new and improved" and sell new units.

[Shades of Blue]

Originally Posted by vindibona1

While hydration can affect the guitar's tone and volume, it is definitely the bracing that's making at least 90% of the tonal difference. The V-Bracing is notorious for sucking the bass and warmth out of many models. And while it all comes down to the individual guitar and the individual player, I personally would tend to shy away from the "traditional" Taylor models with V bracing. Taylor Grand Pacifics are another story- but have been designed around V-bracing whereas the other models (designs) have been "retrofitted". There are a few of the older models that do benefit from the V-class bracing, but it has been my experience (and taste) that brings me to my personal opinion is that on most models V bracing was a mistake. Perhaps we'll see Taylor "reimagined" models or some other retreat with a marketing twist in the future. They have to keep changing things up, if only to crow "new and improved" and sell new units.

I have yet to play a traditional Taylor model with V Bracing, but I can't speak highly enough of the Grand Pacifics. I've been one of the biggest fans of them since mid 2019.

I go back and forth on the bass/low end spectrum. On one hand, there is nothing more satisfying that judging a dreadnought by its low end. But, on the other hand, I find it equally satisfying to play an instrument so balanced and woody sounding. I'm enjoying fat trebles and sustain just as much as I love low end with a Martin.

What's the right answer? Well, it is definitely to own both. The more I play the GPs, but more I fall in love with their woody character. They have just the right amount of every frequency.

[Monts]

I'll be able to chime in here soon. I have a 317 Grand Pacific V class. I came across an older 310 in great shape that I'll have soon. I do like my Grand Pacific and agree with Shades of Blue's comments, so it will be interesting. From what I've researched, the V vs X brace does sound quite different.

[Shades of Blue]

Originally Posted by Monts

I'll be able to chime in here soon. I have a 317 Grand Pacific V class. I came across an older 310 in great shape that I'll have soon. I do like my Grand Pacific and agree with Shades of Blue's comments, so it will be interesting. From what I've researched, the V vs X brace does sound quite different.

They do sound different, but I think the question isn't so much about sound as it is the feeling you get when you play it. I will be the first to tell you that I think that Martins are the best guitars out there tonally, but I just really enjoy playing the Grand Pacifics and there is something really satisfying about them.

[MikeBmusic]

I played a bunch of V-braced Taylors recently. If you want bass, you should look at a bigger body size than the GA (x14) series with the V-brace models. Generally, I found all of them had a smooth even tonal characteristic (neither too bassy or too trebley), with plenty of sustain and even intonation up the neck.
The one model I didn't like was the ebony body (Builders Edition?) - it had very little 'body' to its sound, I suppose because ebony is such a hard wood compared to the usual tonewoods used for the body.