Sophisticated scam attempt across three platforms! Beware!!

[Methos1979]

Hello AGF! Those that know me know I'm a prolific buyer/seller/trader/reviewer here and on other online guitar and gear selling sites. I currently have a nice Froggy Bottom H12 for sale in the AGF, on CL and Reverb. I believe I was the victim of a very sophisticated (yet unsuccessful, thankfully) scam attempt that started right here on AGF. I'm going to share the story so you can see the lengths this person went through to scam someone, somewhere using my guitar ad.

I posted the FB for sale here and on my local craigslist for local sale only. Within a day I had a PM here on AGF from a brand new user (joined that month with no posts) called bluetwinkle. Brand new user, no posts = huge red flag. He initially stated he was from Singapore and was interested in the guitar even though the ad clearly stated local sale only with a possible shipping to CONUS only in the future. I politely declined saying the guitar was for sale locally only. I heard no more from him from AGF.

A few days ago (a solid week after my initial posting) I received an email via the Craigslist relay asking if I 'actually had the guitar' (yes) and then could I please send a photo of the guitar with a piece of paper with Dean (his name, supposedly) printed on it. I figure, great - someone actually making sure I actually own the guitar before bothering to discuss more. I happily provided the photo. After that, nothing.

Yesterday I changed my mind to shipping the guitar to CONUS and also listed the guitar on Reverb. Today I receive a Reverb private message from a user supposedly in the UK named Dean showing me a photo of the guitar with the Dean photo asking me if I was the owner of this guitar and did I have it in my possession. I said yes. They said that someone was trying to sell them this guitar from Germany. I told them they were being scammed.

They thanked me and said they were going to ask for a refund from PayPal. Then they ask me if we could take our conversation over to WhatsApp. I said no, I don't have WhatsApp. They ask for an email or telegram. More red flags. Here's the rub - Reverb wisely adds the actual location of people that message you from are outside of your area. In this case, the person whose profile said UK was from - you guessed it - Singapore. When I asked about the UK thing he stated he was from Indonesia and that it was a 'funny story'.

At this point I ceased all communications with them and alerted Reverb customer support via online chat. They were very helpful and appreciative and said they would block the person and investigate. As one last funny aside to this, I received a short time later a Reverb PM about the guitar written in German that said: "ich werde dich melden ...BETRÜGER" This translates to "I will report you... FRAUD". I thanked them and let them know that I'd already reported them to Reverb. Moron. Nothing since.

Anyway, I just couldn't believe the lengths this person went through to - what? I don't know. Obviously it was the beginning of a way to either get my guitar from me or use my guitar to swindle someone else. Note that I'm pretty good as sussing out this type of thing and figured it out pretty quick but I can see where others might not. Also note that their english was pretty good. Not broken at all. But to work across three separate platforms was dedicated and asking for the photo, genius.

Anyway, I've also alerted AGF of the guy I suspect was at the beginning of this whole thing here but just wanted to share the story with the AGF hivemind as our power lies in our common interests and sharing of information. So beware of these things when you are buying or selling. They are getting more and more sophisticated!

[srick]

Glad you caught that Scott. It is truly amazing (as you say) the lengths that bad guys will go in order to scam someone. One problem coming up is that with the ubiquity of VPNs it is far easier to obscure, or even change, your apparent location as it is even by a website.

Ever vigilant!

[ewalling]

Originally Posted by Methos1979

Today I receive a Reverb private message from a user supposedly in the UK named Dean showing me a photo of the guitar with the Dean photo asking me if I was the owner of this guitar and did I have it in my possession. ...

Note that I'm pretty good as sussing out this type of thing and figured it out pretty quick but I can see where others might not. Also note that their english was pretty good. Not broken at all.

The name is a bit fishy. I don't think I've ever met anyone in the UK called Dean!

[nickv6]

I'm wondering why you would agree to send a photo of your guitar with a paper saying dean on it?
I would have been very suspicious of this.
Am I missing something?

[bfm612]

Originally Posted by nickv6

I'm wondering why you would agree to send a photo of your guitar with a paper saying dean on it?
I would have been very suspicious of this.
Am I missing something?

I knew this was a story of a scam, but I kinda liked that approach if one were very suspicious if the seller actually had the guitar. Unless the 'seller' is particularly good at Photoshop, then the photo would be pretty decent proof that the seller had the guitar, in the same way that a kidnapped person in movies can be shown holding the day's newspaper as proof.

[tbeltrans]

Hi, I am on the International Space Station and really would like a guitar out here with me. I would like to buy your guitar. If you ship it to ..... in Houston, TX, NASA will fly it out to me on the next supply run. The check is already in the mail.

Thank you,

Anonymous Astronaut

[nickv6]

Originally Posted by bfm612

I knew this was a story of a scam, but I kinda liked that approach if one were every suspicious if the seller actually had the guitar. Unless the 'seller' is particularly good at Photoshop, then the photo would be pretty decent proof that the seller had the guitar, in the same way that a kidnapped person in movies can shown holding the day's newspaper as proof.

Oh I see. Thanks very much for explaining.
Nick

[David Eastwood]

Originally Posted by ewalling

The name is a bit fishy. I don't think I've ever met anyone in the UK called Dean!

I went to school in Wellingborough, England in the 1960s with another David Eastwood. His middle name was Dean - so there’s at least one!

[dnf777]

Originally Posted by bfm612

I knew this was a story of a scam, but I kinda liked that approach if one were very suspicious if the seller actually had the guitar. Unless the 'seller' is particularly good at Photoshop, then the photo would be pretty decent proof that the seller had the guitar, in the same way that a kidnapped person in movies can be shown holding the day's newspaper as proof.

Unless a scam-seller just jumps onto a different platform and asks for the buyer’s request from a third party, then relays it to the almost-vigilant-enough buyer!

[ewalling]

Originally Posted by David Eastwood

I went to school in Wellingborough, England in the 1960s with another David Eastwood. His middle name was Dean - so there’s at least one!

I know - I was asking for it to say that. Inevitably, it would set people scouring their pasts for a Dean!

Can we at least say it's an uncommon name? It seems part of the US trend to give children first names that are more traditionally used as last names, like Taylor, Connor, or Hunter.

[Methos1979]

And now I've had an offer for the guitar where the guy lists his address as Portland, OR but it clearly shows he's from Hong Kong. Unreal.

[AX17609]

I'll bet something like 95% of the email I receive is some kind of scam. Most of it is phishing where they send you a receipt for something you didn't buy and give you a number to call if there's a problem. Some of it is quite sophisticated.

[Jeff Scott]

Originally Posted by ewalling

I know - I was asking for it to say that. Inevitably, it would set people scouring their pasts for a Dean!

Can we at least say it's an uncommon name? It seems part of the US trend to give children first names that are more traditionally used as last names, like Taylor, Connor, or Hunter.

Then, we have the British trend to name their kid after two well known guitar companies - Martin Taylor, for one glaring example.

[roberts]

Originally Posted by Methos1979

And now I've had an offer for the guitar where the guy lists his address as Portland, OR but it clearly shows he's from Hong Kong. Unreal.

There's a brisk business on ebay of buyers from Hong Kong and Japan who use space in Portland to warehouse their stuff from the States. I made a number of sales in this way and they all turned out fine. But although it may be legit your guy actually thinks you'd be willing to send your FB off to some unknown suite number in Portland where it may sit in a container until someone gets around to it, then be handled by some unknown third party shipping it overseas, at which point you no longer have tracking or any recourse if it's been damaged. But I guess it's worth a try....

[Methos1979]

Originally Posted by roberts

There's a brisk business on ebay of buyers from Hong Kong and Japan who use space in Portland to warehouse their stuff from the States. I made a number of sales in this way and they all turned out fine. But although it may be legit your guy actually thinks you'd be willing to send your FB off to some unknown suite number in Portland where it may sit in a container until someone gets around to it, then be handled by some unknown third party shipping it overseas, at which point you no longer have tracking or any recourse if it's been damaged. But I guess it's worth a try....

Yeah, got one guy keeps coming at me with messages about this. Not interested.