Questions about the Schatten HFN (Artist Plus 2....

[Mbroady]

First question: Did you make the switch from another set up? If yes, what did switch from, and was it an improvment?


Second question: For those that have the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2, what is your second source? The info states that both channels have phantom power, either from an external source or from a battery. So should I assume that a on board condenser mic can be used as the second source. If yes, would a K&K mic work (Have one that I removed from another guitar)? I’m not stuck on a mic as a second source but I’m just trying to get a handle on my options.

Third question, which is a bit out of the box: I did a quick search and could not find any information on the resistance/ohms for the Schatten HFN pick up. If I got the passive version would it be compatible with a K&K dual source Pre-amp. (Also removed from a guitar but left the mini in) So, perhaps I can use the Trinity pre to combine a schatten with the Trinity mic?

Might just wind up selling the Trinity Pre-amp and mic, but figured I asked before I list it.

[jonfields45]

Originally Posted by Mbroady

Third question, which is a bit out of the box: I did a quick search and could not find any information on the resistance/ohms for the Schatten HFN pick up. If I got the passive version would it be compatible with a K&K dual source Pre-amp.

I've got several 500K and 1M input impedance pedals and they all work well with my HFNs. Schatten sells a passive volume control for the HFN (and other pickups) and it uses a 500K pot. The HFN should be a good match to K&K's preamp but a passive HFN is maybe 3-6 dB lower output than a K&K PM.

[SpruceTop]

Originally Posted by Mbroady

First question: Did you make the switch from another set up? If yes, what did switch from, and was it an improvment?


Second question: For those that have the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2, what is your second source? The info states that both channels have phantom power, either from an external source or from a battery. So should I assume that a on board condenser mic can be used as the second source. If yes, would a K&K mic work (Have one that I removed from another guitar)? I’m not stuck on a mic as a second source but I’m just trying to get a handle on my options.

Third question, which is a bit out of the box: I did a quick search and could not find any information on the resistance/ohms for the Schatten HFN pick up. If I got the passive version would it be compatible with a K&K dual source Pre-amp. (Also removed from a guitar but left the mini in) So, perhaps I can use the Trinity pre to combine a schatten with the Trinity mic?

Might just wind up selling the Trinity Pre-amp and mic, but figured I asked before I list it.

I've tried the 2012 and 2019 Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 systems. I've been debating what second source to use with my 2019 Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2/Martin D-18 installation as it needs some 6th-string enhancement to balance out the rest of the strings. I've thought of adding the Shadow Nano Mag to the second channel but haven't yet done so.

[Mbroady]

Originally Posted by SpruceTop

I've tried the 2012 and 2019 Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 systems. I've been debating what second source to use with my 2019 Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2/Martin D-18 installation as it needs some 6th-string enhancement to balance out the rest of the strings. I've thought of adding the Shadow Nano Mag to the second channel but haven't yet done so.

I'm on the fence about a Mic as a second source, mostly because the HFN in the vids and audio samples I checked out already sound Mic like. By blending in a bit of mag my guess is it would enhance the low end, especially if you can separately Eq the mag. This would require a stereo out which is not a major issue, but it does take it one step away from the perfect plug and play option.

[GuitarLuva]

I have a few passive HFN's but have one Artist plus 2 dual source setup. I originally had a Fishman Matrix UST as a 2nd source, not to dual source per say just to have as a backup in high volume scenarios. It turns out that the feedback rejection of the HFN is not far off the Matrix IME which was a bit surprising to me. I ended up wrecking the Matrix (by accident) and replaced it with Schatten's UST.

I really wouldn't bother with a mic as a 2nd source it's not really needed as the HFN sounds enough like a mic on it's own. For what it's worth I originally contacted Les (maker of the pickup) about this topic and he recommended for me not to use a UST but a magnetic pickup instead. To be honest i'm not a fan of UST'S but I despise magnetic pickups on acoustic guitars so I chose the UST. I never had to use it yet but it's there as a backup for emergencies.

I forgot to mention that I've tried most pickup systems over the years but most recently switched from the Anthem to the HFN in my guitars and like it much better.

[Mbroady]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

.............. For what it's worth I originally contacted Les (maker of the pickup) about this topic and he recommended for me not to use a UST but a magnetic pickup instead. To be honest i'm not a fan of UST'S but I despise magnetic pickups on acoustic guitars so I chose the UST. I never had to use it yet but it's there as a backup for emergencies.

I forgot to mention that I've tried most pickup systems over the years but most recently switched from the Anthem to the HFN in my guitars and like it much better.

Thanks for the info. Not a fan of USTs as well, which is why I am hesitant about getting an Anthem installed. Is this the initial reason why you switched from the anthem to the HFN

Also, did less elaborate on which MAG he likes best?

I currently have 1 guitar with the K&K dual source on board preamp (mini-mic) and, despite all the gear inside the guitar, it does sound great, acoustically and plugged in. I’m Just looking for a different plug and play option for another guitar.

[GuitarLuva]

Originally Posted by Mbroady

Thanks for the info. Not a fan of USTs as well, which is why I am hesitant about getting an Anthem installed. Is this the initial reason why you switched from the anthem to the HFN

Also, did less elaborate on which MAG he likes best?

I currently have 1 guitar with the K&K dual source on board preamp (mini-mic) and, despite all the gear inside the guitar, it does sound great, acoustically and plugged in. I’m Just looking for a different plug and play option for another guitar.

I'm not a fan of how the Anthem sounds plugged in. People report that it sounds like the "guitar only louder" but I never had that experience. I tried it in several guitars with the same result. I find the mic to be very trebly and it took me some serious EQ to get it to sound the way I wanted. It also had a pretty dramatic impact on the unplugged tone of the guitars I had it in. That's a short version!

I stumbled upon the HFN just by fluke and it turned out to be everything I needed in a pickup. Les did not mention a specific magnetic pickup to try but I'm willing to bet either one would be fine.

[Ken Carr]

Originally Posted by Mbroady

I'm on the fence about a Mic as a second source, mostly because the HFN in the vids and audio samples I checked out already sound Mic like. By blending in a bit of mag my guess is it would enhance the low end, especially if you can separately Eq the mag. This would require a stereo out which is not a major issue, but it does take it one step away from the perfect plug and play option.

I am thinking about getting the Shatten hfn artist plus 2 to replace the Lyric mic in my Huss and Dalton TOM-R. If you use the second signal, with this jack, preamp setup, is a TRS 3-wire cable necessary to split the two signals? Aren't the two signals mixed onboard with the preamp volume wheel controls? I was hoping I could use it to blend the two sources and use my wireless system (tip/sleeve).

[guitaniac]

Originally Posted by GuitarLuva

I have a few passive HFN's but have one Artist plus 2 dual source setup. I originally had a Fishman Matrix UST as a 2nd source, not to dual source per say just to have as a backup in high volume scenarios. It turns out that the feedback rejection of the HFN is not far off the Matrix IME which was a bit surprising to me. I ended up wrecking the Matrix (by accident) and replaced it with Schatten's UST.

I really wouldn't bother with a mic as a 2nd source it's not really needed as the HFN sounds enough like a mic on it's own. For what it's worth I originally contacted Les (maker of the pickup) about this topic and he recommended for me not to use a UST but a magnetic pickup instead. To be honest i'm not a fan of UST'S but I despise magnetic pickups on acoustic guitars so I chose the UST. I never had to use it yet but it's there as a backup for emergencies.

I forgot to mention that I've tried most pickup systems over the years but most recently switched from the Anthem to the HFN in my guitars and like it much better.

Good info Shawn. I've finally become a mag fan and have been wondering what mic or SBT would best compliment the DiMarzio Black Angel. The HFN is sounding like a good possibility.

[Cuki79]

Originally Posted by Ken Carr

If you use the second signal, with this jack, preamp setup, is a TRS 3-wire cable necessary to split the two signals?
Aren't the two signals mixed onboard with the preamp volume wheel controls?

It's unclear to me if you want to use the Schatten Artist +2 preamp or the Lyric?

The schatten Artist +2 can accomodate 2 pickups with gain stage for each pickup. However it will not provide the power a Lyric needs. The Lyric is an electret condeser mic. I needs to be powered by the preamp.

The Lyric preamp provides such power but does not accomodate 2 pickups actively. It only provides the possibility to wire a 2nd pickup signal passively to the ring of a TRS jack. It would not be the best configuration for the HFN that is known to work best with active onboard electronics.

The only way to make it right, is to use the Schatten Artist +2, wire a decoupling capacitor to the Lyric on the second channel to bring the 9V power it needs between the capacitor and the Lyric wire. (I modded my Lyric so I can confirm it is powered with 9V).

Attention has to be made where the 9V power is taken (especially the grounding) in order to avoid battery draining while not in use.

I suggest you find a professional luthier skilled in electronics to do that.

[Ken Carr]

Thanks Cuki. I actually was thinking to remove the Lyric altogether and to install the HFN Artist plus 2, so I could have the option to add a second source in the future if I wanted to. I realize that I can't use both the Lyric and the HFN together. I was also thinking about just getting the HFN active vt instead of the artist plus 2. I'm still on the fence about it. Do I really need either? No. But the more I hang out on the forum, I am turning into a tonechaser. I really can't justify spending more on gear, because what I have (Lyric and Tech 21 Q-Strip) sounds good. I would like to have better feedback rejection than I can get with the Lyric. That said, all the glowing reviews of the Schatten HFN are enticing.