Toneless TAYLORS? All of them. I don´t think so.

[markvc1]

I think Taylor is a unique company in that they not only care enough to work on their guitar building in order to pursue their vision, but also are a very large company with a thoroughly modern approach to quality, meaning reproducibility and precision. Notice that they take a year to 're-voice' particular models. That's a year of experimentation and documentation, folks, and it ain't easy. If a smaller luthier decided to make a change, he or she would just make the next guitar differently. Also, notice that these re-voicings are happening with some regularity - I think Taylor hears the complaints about their tone and wants to respond, but they are committed to doing it in a way that is consistent with THEIR taste and also consistent with their quality system. Needless to say, they have a right to pursue the sound they want, and they're to be congratulated, I think, for having such high quality, meaning reproducibility and full reliance on the most modern techniques. Hey, it's an approach, and one that they have pursued very effectively. Let's give them credit.

[Dwight]

Originally Posted by Roger G Lewis

I´d explain a few things I had learned in a bit more depth.

Good luck trying to get your ideas and thoughts across.

[GutFiddler]

Roger,
Thank you for your efforts and time in this. I was somewhat excited to see how ovangkol fared on your first video (I own a Taylor 412ce). Most people will say the GC's don't have any bottom end or volume. I disagree, mine has plenty of low end and volume, perhaps I have a little cannon, of course its nothing like a GS size..of course why would it? However I'll put up against a GA model any day. (matter of fact one of the other guitarists in my praise band has a 414ce and well...Mine competes just fine against his.(not that its a competition..no no) Just trying to debunk some of the myths about the smaller bodied guitars particular the Taylor GC's.

Anyway I wanted to Thank You for your time... great effort here and I tip my hat to you sir.

Also, I came across these guys doing sort of the same thing. Check them out you mind find their work/study interesting as well.

http://youtu.be/ej-2_p83mWg

Quote: "In this, the pilot episode of Acoustic Addicts, you'll listen to and compare controlled recordings of a 1993 Taylor K20 (all Koa), a 2012 Taylor 714ce (Rosewood back/sides, Engelmann Spruce top) a 2011 Santa Cruz Roy Southerner (Mahogany back/sides, Sitka Spruce top), and a 2010 McPherson 4.5 (Beeswing Mahogany back/sides, Adirondack Spruce top). They show real-time spectrum analysis, and even go so far as to analyze the frequency spectrum of each guitar playing a E chord using Adobe Audition's spectral view. Great stuff for any serious acoustic guitar player or collector."

In their 2nd episode, they go into Martin's
http://youtu.be/UHbXJ69K8b0
".... test five Martin dreadnought guitars (2011 D18, 2011 D28, 2011 D35, 1968 D35, 1997 HD35) and a 2011 Yamaha Gigmaker. The focus of this show was to compare the Mahogany D18 and Rosewood D28 which are identical except for the tone wood."

[pallec]

The single biggest impact on tone - regardless of guitar brand - is the person playing it...


(BTW: K.Yairi's are the best sounding guitars in the world )

[Roger G Lewis]

Originally Posted by bjsfolly

Do you think tone and responsiveness are related? I have a Goodall where the sound "jumps" out of the guitar but I guess one would have to describe it as "modern" voiced (but I like it). I have a Martin and Leach that don't "jump" but are more normally responsive (quite responsive as they are both mahogany and spruce) but have more of the old time tone. I would enjoy seeing charts of those 3 sound waves.

Hi BJSFOLLY,

If you put some sound clips up on sound cloud or sound click I´ll happily do some for you its a five minute job a Mic ( the better the mic the better an AKG 1000 s is great and Sm57 type Mic would also be fine even the internal mic on a lap top is OK but not as accurate, Mics colour sound as well which is why some are prized for either their transparency or colour same with mixing desks and studio monitors or speakers. Valves or transistors and so forth.
I´d be only to pleased to do that for you, other folk here mat be interested in this Plug in Bodiliser. Again it was doing what the Fishman Aura Spectrum does ahead of their curve you might say its a wonderful plugin.

http://74.125.47.132/search?q=cache:...&ct=clnk&gl=us

Recording acoustic guitars or playing in an amplified setting all this information is invaluable to doing your instrument what ever it is Justice.

[Roger G Lewis]

Originally Posted by pallec

The single biggest impact on tone - regardless of guitar brand - is the person playing it...


(BTW: K.Yairi's are the best sounding guitars in the world )

I couldn´t agree more on the Player as they say , ´´Its not the Size of the Nail but the Educated Hammer´´ , that makes it hit the G Spot , If you know what I´m Saying.

[GibbyPrague]

Taylors definitely have a clear tone, and its quite unique and specific. The only question is whether its the tone one is after.

[Roger G Lewis]

Originally Posted by GutFiddler

Roger,
Thank you for your efforts and time in this. I was somewhat excited to see how ovangkol fared on your first video (I own a Taylor 412ce). Most people will say the GC's don't have any bottom end or volume. I disagree, mine has plenty of low end and volume, perhaps I have a little cannon, of course its nothing like a GS size..of course why would it? However I'll put up against a GA model any day. (matter of fact one of the other guitarists in my praise band has a 414ce and well...Mine competes just fine against his.(not that its a competition..no no) Just trying to debunk some of the myths about the smaller bodied guitars particular the Taylor GC's.

Anyway I wanted to Thank You for your time... great effort here and I tip my hat to you sir.

Also, I came across these guys doing sort of the same thing. Check them out you mind find their work/study interesting as well.

http://youtu.be/ej-2_p83mWg

Quote: "In this, the pilot episode of Acoustic Addicts, you'll listen to and compare controlled recordings of a 1993 Taylor K20 (all Koa), a 2012 Taylor 714ce (Rosewood back/sides, Engelmann Spruce top) a 2011 Santa Cruz Roy Southerner (Mahogany back/sides, Sitka Spruce top), and a 2010 McPherson 4.5 (Beeswing Mahogany back/sides, Adirondack Spruce top). They show real-time spectrum analysis, and even go so far as to analyze the frequency spectrum of each guitar playing a E chord using Adobe Audition's spectral view. Great stuff for any serious acoustic guitar player or collector."

In their 2nd episode, they go into Martin's
http://youtu.be/UHbXJ69K8b0
".... test five Martin dreadnought guitars (2011 D18, 2011 D28, 2011 D35, 1968 D35, 1997 HD35) and a 2011 Yamaha Gigmaker. The focus of this show was to compare the Mahogany D18 and Rosewood D28 which are identical except for the tone wood."

Hi Git Fiddler I had not seen the second episode of Acoustic addicts thanks for posting it,

I have gone into some depth on Guitar pickups, the Gret writer for me on this is Helmuth Lemme from Germany who has a Pick up analyser unit . I am also very taken with the Bill Lawrence Pickupology stuff´´Batteries belong in Flash Lights´´to quote the great mad of the wound bobbins.


Heres some PAF stuff on my 1968 Gibson Byrdland from October 2011.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0CVSnzeKsY&feature=plcp

[Black Beauty]

Originally Posted by rmyAddison

I do find it mildly interesting that Talyor folks, way out of proportion in my experience, seem to have a complex about their instruments, and are always comparing to Martins, or Gibsons, or posting justifications like this thread, a prefect example.

You don't need to convice me you like your Taylor(s), I really don't care, that's your business not mine, I'm happy you're happy! But don't try to convice me I need to like them or am missing something, I've played tons of Taylors and owned an 814ce, they don't work for me, period.

I don't need you to like what I prefer, Martins, and you shouldn't need me to like what you prefer, be it Taylors, or Gibsons or folks that prefer owning different brands.

Enjoy your journey and allow others to do the same............

If anything, I've found the opposite to be true. Just look up any YouTube video reviewing a Taylor and look at all the comments bashing them and saying they don't stand up to traditional guitars etc.

[FrankHS]

Originally Posted by Roger G Lewis

I couldn´t agree more on the Player as they say , ´´Its not the Size of the Nail but the Educated Hammer´´ , that makes it hit the G Spot , If you know what I´m Saying.

I'm wondering if the inner issue is a focus on the guitar as an personal identifying accessory, rather than guitars to make MUSIC. Maybe many average Taylor player just can't play very well (yet) so they seek affirmation about their tools at this point in their journey.

[Roger G Lewis]

Originally Posted by FrankHS

I'm wondering if the inner issue is a focus on the guitar as an personal identifying accessory, rather than guitars to make MUSIC. Maybe many average Taylor player just can't play very well (yet) so they seek affirmation about their tools at this point in their journey.

I am sure you are right but the identifier to any particular Brand loyalty or even tribalism is not restricted to either less advanced players or players of any particular brand of guitar. At the consumer level the tribalism is very evident not least on Guitar Fora, it is just another example of our increasingly Binary societal trends.


"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe. If you try it, you will be lonely often, and sometimes frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Friedrich Nietzsche

[Master_Choi]

Taylors are fantastic guitars. I've played many and they all sound very solid. I like the crisp to it.

[Howard Emerson]

Roger,
After going over to the linkedin link you provided, and just reading the first 4 posts, I have to ask you: Why would you indulge in that sort of tripe?

Why would you lower yourself to that point?

Seriously.

It's more about personal insecurities than anything else.

Walk away and be the bigger person.

HE

[DavidinGA]

Originally Posted by Black Beauty

If anything, I've found the opposite to be true. Just look up any YouTube video reviewing a Taylor and look at all the comments bashing them and saying they don't stand up to traditional guitars etc.

That's true they don't sound like traditional guitars (ie Martin vintage tone) because they ARE NOT SUPPOSE TO. Taylor created their own voice instead of trying to mimic some other brands tone. I'm not really a fan of the Taylor sound myself (as hard as I have tried to like them) but you know what - their are hundreds of other brands to pick from so no big deal.

[steveyam]

The best, most toneful sounding guitar is the one that sounds best to the player (or listener), not the one that says 'so-and-so' on the headstock.