Vox AC15C1 or Vox AC4TV ?????

[bozz_2006]

Hi all, thanks to your suggestions in the threads I started several days ago, y'all pointed me in the direction of some great sounding amps for home use.

Via waaaaaaaay too many hours over the past few days, scouring online reviews and youtube vids, I've decided that the tone I hear in my head is "Vox". I know I initially asked for a "quiet bedroom amp that I could use for church." So, the natural amp for me would be the AC4TV. It sounds nice.

HOWEVER, the AC15C1 sounds nice too. Nicer. Much nicer. And it's capable of generating much more in the tone department; very versatile. And it's still within my budget: $599 at Guitar Center. And I can even get $100 off right now; nice!

So, my question is, do you think I can achieve nice fat crunch tones and full sparkly clean tones at bedroom volume levels with this amp? I mean, it has a master volume, right? I should be able to, right? Hoping so.

[moon]

You get the best overdriven tube tone with everything cranked. This is why it's good to buy a separate head.

At home, you can hook it up to a soundproofed cabinet (which contains a speaker and a mic) and then blast away without annoying the neighbours. The mic feeds into your home studio setup as normal.

Another option is to get something like a Palmer power attenuator. This works as a power soak so you can crank an amp and reduce the volume sent to the speaker cabinet, and as a load box which will completely mute the cab, giving you a line level signal out from the Palmer.

The cool thing about this is that it gives you an option to do away with a cab altogether: a load box can feed straight into the DAW at home, or into a PA live. A Night Train and a Palmer would make a very portable setup.

Part of the electric guitar tone comes from the speaker & cab though, so try it out before you buy and see what you think.

[muscmp]

get the ac4 and mic it thru the pa at church. or, run the direct out to a larger speaker cabinet. it also depends upon how loud and crunchy you need to be at church.

the ac15 is a great amp but you would need to crank it to get the sound/tone you want.

play music!

[royd]

Originally Posted by muscmp

get the ac4 and mic it thru the pa at church. or, run the direct out to a larger speaker cabinet. it also depends upon how loud and crunchy you need to be at church.

the ac15 is a great amp but you would need to crank it to get the sound/tone you want.

+1

I think that tube amps run very low even with a master volume tend to sound a bit more thin than when they're allowed to breathe.

You can always add a mic and run that through the PA at church if you need it.

[stevecuss]

Wow - tough choice here. The tone you love verses the tone you can live with.

Technically the master volume won't sizzle the power amp tubes which is that incredible cranked sound you're after, so yeah, Royd is right about master volume amps sounding a bit thinner when dialed quiet. Power soaks are also an option, but they are an added expense and they cut the highs out of your sound which is key to the vox magic.

My advice: play them both quietly at bedroom volumes. Which one puts a bigger smile on your face? Buy that one.

I went through a phase of figuring out "technical this and tone wood that." It has its place, but now my decision making process is much more visceral. When playing a guitar, amp, pedal etc, I ask myself, "does it make me want to play it more." That's the piece I want.

good luck - two fine amp choices there, but my money goes with the AC15. Bigger speaker, more options and one of the finest budget amps money can buy.

[Steely Glen]

Have you considered the Vox AC4C1? It's a 4-watt bedroom amp that's voiced to have a different top boost, similar to the AC15/30. It seems to me that this amp would give you both of what you want.

I have one of these amps and it's stellar. I can get the chimey Vox cleans and the creamy crunch. The low end leaves a little to be desired, but I've heard great reviews about running the AC4C1 to a Vox 112NT cab.

Check out the specs: http://www.voxamps.com/us/ac4/ac4c1-bl/

[bozz_2006]

Hmmm... hadn't considered that option Glenn. In fact, didn't know about it! I see Guitar Center has the AC4C1BL that you linked, and a green AC4C. Would you be willing to speak to the difference in these two, and also how they differ from the AC4TV?

I really am an electric am newbie, but I really dig that Vox tone. For now, it may come down to which sounds best at in-home volume level. If it is the AC15C1, I could buy it and be done. If it is any one of the 4-wafters, I could conceivably get one of those now, and eventually add a 15 down the road.... Man....

GC has used examples of the AC4TV for $150, which is a pretty attractive price. The AC4C1 and AC4C1BL are both at $300. While GC has used examples of the AC15C1 for $400. Boy, tough choices.

So, any input would be great here. Thanks, all.

Edit: I'm really struggling here! They all sound good.... but... I am realizing that I probably can't have my cake and eat it, too. I'm worried that the AC15C1 won't sound the way I want it to when I need to keep it low (which probably wouldn't be all that often. I will need to keep it low when my kids are around/sleeping, but only like ~5% of my playing time occurs then. I mostly practice during my lunch break. When I'd be able to crank an AC15 as loud as I'd want!). And the AC4's will sound pretty good when cranked, but will be strictly bedroom amps and are seriously *neutered* compared to the AC15C1; likely not worth the savings when you boil it down....

[mjz]

If the AC15C1 is THE tone for you, I would buy that amp and consider one of these for those times you just can't crank it for practice at home

http://www.voxamps.com/us/amphone/

max

[clintj]

To touch on an earlier post, tube amps have three 'flavors' of distortion or breakup. Preamp tube overdrive is the easiest to get, and accessible with a master volume amp. Crank up the gain, turn down the master volume. Power tube breakup can only be gotten by pushing the output level of the power tubes up. The classic Marshall roar for example is a set of KT66 power tubes pushed hard. You have to turn the master volume up and really drive the amp to get that sound. A power soak will let you do that and keep the volume reasonable. The third flavor is speaker distortion, and that comes from driving the speaker hard to the point where it starts to become non-linear in response. The early Marshall amps when turned up to 11 had all three of these going at once. Eric Clapton recorded a couple of albums with that setup. The guitarist in my band has a 15 watt Gibson Goldtone amp, and it is quite reasonable for rehearsals even turned up to the point of distortion. Kind of loud, but not obnoxiously so. It is perfect miked on stage. Loud enough for the band to hear, while not so loud that every microphone on stage picks it up. The website for Eurotubes has a good info section on amps and tubes, and very good service. They went several rounds of Q&A with me by email to help me decide which tube set to get for my Fender earlier this year. No affiliation, just a satisfied customer.

[Steely Glen]

Originally Posted by bozz_2006

Hmmm... hadn't considered that option Glenn. In fact, didn't know about it! I see Guitar Center has the AC4C1BL that you linked, and a green AC4C. Would you be willing to speak to the difference in these two, and also how they differ from the AC4TV?

I really am an electric am newbie, but I really dig that Vox tone. For now, it may come down to which sounds best at in-home volume level. If it is the AC15C1, I could buy it and be done. If it is any one of the 4-wafters, I could conceivably get one of those now, and eventually add a 15 down the road.... Man....

GC has used examples of the AC4TV for $150, which is a pretty attractive price. The AC4C1 and AC4C1BL are both at $300. While GC has used examples of the AC15C1 for $400. Boy, tough choices.

So, any input would be great here. Thanks, all.

Edit: I'm really struggling here! They all sound good.... but... I am realizing that I probably can't have my cake and eat it, too. I'm worried that the AC15C1 won't sound the way I want it to when I need to keep it low (which probably wouldn't be all that often. I will need to keep it low when my kids are around/sleeping, but only like ~5% of my playing time occurs then. I mostly practice during my lunch break. When I'd be able to crank an AC15 as loud as I'd want!). And the AC4's will sound pretty good when cranked, but will be strictly bedroom amps and are seriously *neutered* compared to the AC15C1; likely not worth the savings when you boil it down....

The difference b/t the AC4TV and the AC4C1 is, I believe, the preamp tubes. The AC4TV has 1 12AX7 in the pre stage and 1 EL84 in the power stage whereas the AC4C1 has 2 12AX7 preamp tubes and 1 EL84 power tube. The the extra 12AX7 in the AC4C1 helps drives the top boost more so than the AC4TV. I really like my AC4C1 and get some great Vox tones, both clean and dirty. It is surprisingly loud for such a small amp. There's no way my neighbors would allow me to run it wide open. But if you're looking for an amp that will produce a huge amount of stage volume without being mic'd, the 4 watt options are likely not for you. Best to go with the AC15.

[bozz_2006]

But that's the thing. I don't need huge stage volume. At all. I play mostly at home, and church is acoustic territory. I can play at home basically as loudly as I like. I just don't want to have to melt my eardrums to get the tone I want. And the tone I want is what I've heard in the AC15. However, the AC4 looks like a winner. Leaning toward going for it. Hoping I can get a few bucks off from GC... Just traded in my Line 6 amp and put the trade-in money down on a Mexican made Tele. If I could pick up an AC4 for $250, I'd make the purchase.

[stevecuss]

Bozz,

You're starting to spiral into amp hell. Many of us have trodden this path set before you Amps are subjective and personal, but you keep mentioning how you prefer the tone of the AC15.

If budget isn't the first constraint, then keep it simple. Buy the amp you enjoy playing and figure out volume later. You'll never regret it.

Good luck!

[bozz_2006]

Originally Posted by stevecuss

Bozz,

You're starting to spiral into amp hell. Many of us have trodden this path set before you Amps are subjective and personal, but you keep mentioning how you prefer the tone of the AC15.

If budget isn't the first constraint, then keep it simple. Buy the amp you enjoy playing and figure out volume later. You'll never regret it.

Good luck!

lol. man oh man...

[Steely Glen]

Originally Posted by bozz_2006

But that's the thing. I don't need huge stage volume. At all. I play mostly at home, and church is acoustic territory. I can play at home basically as loudly as I like. I just don't want to have to melt my eardrums to get the tone I want. And the tone I want is what I've heard in the AC15. However, the AC4 looks like a winner. Leaning toward going for it. Hoping I can get a few bucks off from GC... Just traded in my Line 6 amp and put the trade-in money down on a Mexican made Tele. If I could pick up an AC4 for $250, I'd make the purchase.

On my AC4C1, with the Master volume at 12 o'clock and the gain at 12 o'clock, the amp is as loud as I would want it in a practice setting in my 12x12' music room. Plus, the tubes are really in a nice sweet spot and there's still quite a bit of headroom left too.

[bozz_2006]

Thanks Glen. I appreciate your input so much. I'm just struggling.

Is the tone I hear in my head "AC15C1 tone"

OR

Is it "Vox CRANKED" tone?

I've seen the videos and while the AC4 sounds great, it's not an AC15. BUT, at the levels I'll be playing at (medium-loud. not "bedroom". not "LOUD") will I get what I love from the AC15C1 or will my volume sound better out of an AC4C1-BL? I just don't know....