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  #1  
Old 02-13-2020, 09:38 AM
jjbigfly jjbigfly is offline
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Default In ear monitoring

Thinking about taking the leap into a wired in-ear monitor system. I am going to need something that matches my abilities, so, nothing real spendy.
Looking at a set of decent ear buds (Westone) and a Behringer 4 channel headphone amp. I will need at least 1 extra channel for a band mate and one for myself. Not that I really NEED it, but I would like to try this kind of monitor system. We play more Americana type of music.
This post is actually a request for free advice, not a declaration of intent :-)
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  #2  
Old 02-13-2020, 10:14 AM
buzzardwhiskey buzzardwhiskey is offline
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I'll tell you what I've done. Take from it what you will.

Sennheiser 400 Pro earphones (mine)
Tin Audio T2 earphones (4 other band members)
Zoom L12 mixer (has 5 aux mixes)

I split all the signals so that FOH gets a set and the band's ZOOM L12 gets a set. Then we mix what each of us want.

I also add a condenser mic on stage so that we can get some ambience.
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  #3  
Old 02-13-2020, 11:56 AM
GmanJeff GmanJeff is offline
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I suggest you consider Behringer P2 units, which would give each of you convenient control over your own volume. If your mixer provides at least two auxiliary outs, you can also each have your own mix.

You may find that you end up wanting custom-molded earpieces rather than universal-fit units which may tend not to stay in place as well on stage.
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Old 02-13-2020, 04:51 PM
JWJ915 JWJ915 is offline
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For what it's worth, I've tried the universal fit buds and they just didn't work for me. I'd recommend getting molds made by an audiologist, then sending them off to a reputable company that makes IEMs. There are lots of good ones; just depends on what you want to spend. I'd look into 64 Audio. They make a great product!
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Old 02-13-2020, 10:55 PM
gfirob gfirob is offline
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I have never been able to get used to standard (not custom) in-ears because of the fingers-in-the-ears effect. The instruments sound great, vocals terrible. I have been told your brain will get used to it after a while, but my brain never did. I don't know what the answer is for that since not everybody seems to experience this problem. But it was a killer for me.
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  #6  
Old 02-13-2020, 11:33 PM
AeroUSA AeroUSA is offline
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I like these ones a lot:

https://www.amazon.com/KZ-Earphone-R...language=en_US
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  #7  
Old 02-14-2020, 01:40 PM
Oregon Donor Oregon Donor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gfirob View Post
I have never been able to get used to standard (not custom) in-ears because of the fingers-in-the-ears effect. The instruments sound great, vocals terrible. I have been told your brain will get used to it after a while, but my brain never did. I don't know what the answer is for that since not everybody seems to experience this problem. But it was a killer for me.
Do custom-molded in-ears negate that effect, by virtue of being 'fitted', so to speak? I've never used in-ears at all before.
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Old 02-14-2020, 03:18 PM
cmac cmac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gfirob View Post
I have never been able to get used to standard (not custom) in-ears because of the fingers-in-the-ears effect. The instruments sound great, vocals terrible. I have been told your brain will get used to it after a while, but my brain never did. I don't know what the answer is for that since not everybody seems to experience this problem. But it was a killer for me.
I did some reading on this a while back and the problem, if I remember correctly, is that if you have a good seal on the earpiece then the vocal sound that propagates through your bones can't escape out of the ear, so it is louder than you are used to. It's very much the same as fingers in the ear, assuming your fingers provide a good seal. Search for "iem occlusion effect" for more depth.

One solution is, it is said, to have long tips for the IEMs such that the tips go deep into the ear canal. The solution I went for is to use intentionally badly fitting tips, specifically ones that look like a three-tier white tree.

The purpose there is that the bad seal allows the bone-conducted sound of my singing to leak out so I can hear the mix without having to crank the volume up excessively. The downside is that I don't hear as much bass as I'd like, but hearing the bass is not that important to me. It's a compromise that means I don't need custom moulds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oregon Donor View Post
Do custom-molded in-ears negate that effect, by virtue of being 'fitted', so to speak? I've never used in-ears at all before.
Only if they are moulded to go deep enough. As one site puts it:

The next disadvantage of IEMs is occlusion, the unnatural low frequency sound of our own voice caused by bone conduction that we are all familiar with when we plug our ears and speak. Normally, the sound energy escapes our open ear canal, but with an IEM in the way, it gets reflected back to the eardrum. Although pulling the IEM partially out of the ear canal may alleviate occlusion, it also breaks the seal, destroying bass response and eliminating the majority of hearing protection. Destroying the bass response will also lead the performer to turn their IEM much louder to compensate for the loss of bottom end, so this is not a recommended solution for occlusion. Realistically the only method for dealing with occlusion is to have the impressions taken as deeply as possible, thus minimizing the space between the IEM and the eardrum.
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  #9  
Old 02-14-2020, 03:28 PM
cmac cmac is offline
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To the OP, I use Shure SE-215 IEMs and can recommend them if they are in your budget. I recently got a set of Adorer IM8 IEMs and they are pretty good for the price. Lacking some bass compared to the more balanced SE-215s, but they are much cheaper (and don't use MMCX connectors, which is not a bad thing.)

I'd strongly recommend IEMs that loop over the ear, and that have some way to tighten the cable against the back of the head. Both the SE-215 and IM8 have this. (The IM8 also comes with a second cable that has controls for listening on a phone, which is a nice bonus.)
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Old 02-15-2020, 09:44 AM
jjbigfly jjbigfly is offline
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Thanks for the response’s. I did just get the Shure 215 ear buds. I like the concept of ear buds but I am having difficulty with the “fit” in my ears.
Right off the bat they were horrible! No bass and all the music was almost like only having mid range at boosted volumes. Pushing them for a better seal helped. Fooling with the different tips helped a great deal and I have been able to “normalize” the EQ settings on the mixer. I would say they are on the low end of acceptable:-).
I have an issue with the fit. I think most of the difficulty is that the 215’s may not fit my ears well. add that to my own difficulty of getting them on easily and I thing they are going back. I use ear buds daily (just not for monitoring) and usually have no issues. The store is willing to take them back so that may be the way to go for now. I am simply not satisfied with the way I fit them around and in my ear.
I have been using a set of Bose and Air pods pro that I really like for both sound quality and fit. I simply put them in my ears and they work. And I did try a Bluetooth adaptor and the latency was way out of hand. Might anyone have any recommendations for a better and easier fit? I would really like to find a set that are as easy to use as headphones. Just put them on my head and play...
The shop had a set of Sennheiser ($99.00) but they had no experience with them as yet. They do carry’s Westone models. The ultimate reason I went with the Shure 215 was that they are returnable and had been suggested.

Any help? I realize I may need to up the budget.....have not looked into wireless as I was hoping to avoid the expense and have no clue as to what models are going to sound good. Open to anything, I mean regarding IEM.
Let’s not get out of hand here....😜
Thanks again.
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  #11  
Old 02-15-2020, 10:24 AM
cmac cmac is offline
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I suggest trying the SE215s without any tips on, just to find out if they can fit comfortably in the outer ear. If they can then you can look at Comply tips to find out what might work. I'm lucky in that one pair of the silicone tips that are supplied with the 215s fit me perfectly for general listening.

Best in mind, though, the better the seal then the stronger the occlusion effect (fingers-in-ears) when singing. Earbud tips for listening may not work well for singing.
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  #12  
Old 02-15-2020, 12:58 PM
Akousticplyr Akousticplyr is offline
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https://www.amazon.com/Radians-Custo...1822445&sr=8-2

You can try a custom mold kit at home. I used this for my motorcycle ear buds.
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