Build Baritone Guitar from existing pieces??

[dfvxc]

Hi all,

I've got a piece of garbage, offshore made guitar room that was destined for the dumpster and decided to try to adapt it into a cheap baritone guitar. The sides back and top are all laminate (plywood) and the neck and truss rod are both GARBAGE. I took it to luthier John LaCroix, who wanted $500 to make a baritone neck for it. The neck he would have built would have been definitely worth $500, but the guitar itself wouldn’t have been, even when the neck was done. I was about to throw the guitar out, when my friend convinced me to try to build a neck for it. So right now the plan is do some of the adaptation myself and to enlist John for some of the trickier parts. The neck is already attached via a French dovetail. I’m also going to replace the top as that is a relatively cheap way of making the guitar sound MUCH better.

The plan is to buy a top blank from John, make braces and attach the top as a non-radiused top. Probably not do a rosette, but we’ll see. I’ll probably use a mahogany binding to match the neck. Then, with some mahogany I have left over, make a neck. Strip-laminate the neck to avoid warping. Then cut the headstock off at 15 degrees, route out the truss rod channel and let John install a truss rod(the more I think about the truss rod, I might just do it myself). Buy some ebony from John for the finger board and head plate and attach a heal block. I’ve always been scared at the thought of carving a guitar neck (and doing it well), but I’m also looking forward to the challenge. I definitely want to do an Inlay on the guitar neck and head plate. Then I will have John cut the frets and I’m not sure which one of us will make and attach a bridge.

I've asked John to coach me in building a guitar, but he doesn't have time. My hope is that this way I can learn from him, and have his help, without taking too much of his time. I'm figuring on a 27" scale length.

I know that the neck heal to heal block joint is usually adjusted after the neck bridge is on. But to compensate for string tension bending the neck, I assume that the angle between the neck face (even before the fingerboard goes on) and the heal, needs to be less than 90 degrees. My big question is HOW MUCH LESS?????

So any input you may have would be greatly appreciated. I'm curious both on the angle of the neck face to heal, and if you think this is a good, or bad idea?

Thanks

[Kitchen Guitars]

I haven't pondered a Baritone so I can't comment. French Dovetail? What's that? Is the Hide Glue set in Heavy Cream and butter?

[dfvxc]

Hey Kitchen Guitars,

French dovetail...just a the dovetail neck attachment, as opposed to a bolt on. I loved the thread on your first build. The butterfly on the sycamore one looks sweet too. Did you leave the neck heal square (ninety degrees) for these guitars, or did you compensate? Maybe the compensation I'm talking about isn't necessary. I've done lots of woodworking, but never a guitar. Thoughts?

[Kitchen Guitars]

Oh my did I compensate on the first one! I had no idea I had built the body backward until I went to attach the premade MT neck! I thought I was screwed, Tim McKnight saved my butt. He knew the angle compensation in his head but said don't ask how he knew lol.
I spent 30 hours finding the neck angle.
Number 2 I have made the short scale neck from scratch. We will see what it takes!
To find the neck angle without the fret board attached, you find the bridge location and tape a sliver of wood 1/16" high. The straight edge rests on that compensation when your neck angle is right.

[dfvxc]

Ok, thanks Kitchen Guitars,

So I can't figure the neck angle until the top is attached, that makes sense really. 1/16" up from the sitka top, where the bridge will be. I will make a note.

I'm expecting this to be more of a learning experience than a masterpiece. I want to do a good job, but it's not worth spending a fortune on, as it's still going to be a Chinese made, laminate body. I've had a couple more questions pop into my head overnight.

Is there any major problem using yellow wood glue for attaching bracing, the top to the sides and the bridge? I know a lot of people swear by hide glue, is it necessity, or preference?

Do the ebony fingerboard, head plate and bridge need to be sprayed when it's all done, or is the guitar usually sprayed before they are attached (or the head plate and fingerboard taped and bridge attached after it is sprayed)? I'm pretty sure that ebony pieces are usually left unsprayed.

Thanks,

[Kitchen Guitars]

See the current post here on glues. Hide glue requires perfect fits. I look foward to using it. Especially on attaching the bridge.
You don't spray the fingerboard. It gets taped. Most spray with the bridge off then clean up the mounting area.
I did an undersized tapemark, french polished, then scraped the finish off to fit.

[naccoachbob]

Here's some advice on neck angle: http://www.kennethmichaelguitars.com/neckangle.html
And I bet there are other resources on the internet.
You might see if you can determine the angle of the current neck some way.
For bracing and gluing the top to the sides, and the binding, etc., Titebond should work pretty good. Real hot hide glue (I've never been around it, but from what I've read here) might be a challenge for someone just starting. More experienced people might chime in on that.
CA would be used when you have different type materials bonding together, like abalone to wood. If you inlay abalone to the top, consider laying a coat of lacquer in the channel so the CA doesn't wick into the top.
Installing the truss rod is pretty straightforward; just make a tight fit so it doesn't rattle. I don't think people usually glue it in though.
Good luck,
Bob

[dfvxc]

Excellent info. Thanks both. Excellent lacquering the inlay channel on the top before using CA glue. That website answers a lot of questions. I think I'm ready to do this. Now I just need the snow to leave so I can pick up some wood. Going back to work might be necessary in there somewhere too...
Thanks