Buying a Custom Guitar

[Sadie-f]

Originally Posted by rounder

Beautiful post Sadie-f. I do not want to buy a new custom guitar. I would not know what to get. I have two Martins that I like...an HD-28 that I have had for about 25 years and a D-18 sinker mahogany that I got a few months ago. I do not know what I would change if I wanted to buy a custom.

I have two Serottas and two Kelly Bedford bikes. I bought all of them when I thought that I knew bikes and could get what I want. Going custom was worth it for me in bikes.

I love this thread and appreciate everyone's comments. I do not want or need a custom guitar right now. But, if I ever decided that I wanted one or needed one, I would definitely take everyone here's opinions into account.

So kind of you to say��

For me the custom bike was this epitome of excellent design and execution of build. My Santa Cruz is just like that - I don't need (and remain astounded with the utter perfection they achieved in fit and finish (*). I appreciate the one small wobble I cannot see, but feel in the side where the lower bout taper towards the waist. Most of all, I love the clarity of tone. I've said in other posts recently, the only guitar I've played that I'd like to own more was a 1934 OOO-28 that sold for considerably more than I paid for the SCGC OM.

I expect when she's 90 yo, my Santa Cruz OM will sound better than that Martin (by then, the tone woods will be over 180 years old). And I hope to come somewhere close to that in my own builds. The bug to own "better than Martin" to me is a less severe addiction than the desire to build your own ;-).

For a decade+ I worked in glass art,.learning everything I could, pursuing advanced techniques. Glass is an art that goes back millennia, it took the Romans and availability of manufactured pipes to get blown glass to a factory scale which then concentrated in Venice around the 7th century. Venice worked hard to keep its methods secret, and while the wall of secrecy eventually fell, the highest quality glass still came from Murano.

Around the 1970s a few upcoming masters of Venetian glass began sharing technique (notably, they are still a bit closed on their color recipes). I think it's the same in luthiery. Many of today's strongest builders are glad to share their knowledge, and have trained plenty of luthiers who've started their own solo shops.

I'm sure I couldn't do this today without luthiers like Richard Hoover, Michael Millard, Dana Bourgeois and many others having paved the way (around the same time I was beginning a career that started in a machine shop and proceeded into tech / science). I'm beyond grateful.

* I committed about 5% of the cost of the custom in decoration e.g. paua in the rosette and a custom inlay in the headstock (a feature I put in my own builds). This guitar mostly lives in an A/R case on the wall, and I do enjoy this customization. When I'm playing the visual I'm often mesmerized by is the figured walnut binding; that was a good choice :-).

[Malcolm Kindnes]

I have had five custom built guitars over the years, because I am very fussy about neck shape, string spacing etc. and it can be a great experience. However, it doesn't always work out and of those five, I have only kept two.

In my experience, unless you have a specific problem about neck shape etc. there is nothing better than trying lots of guitars until you find what you want at a price you are happy to pay. You may not feel the joy of having the perfect, unique instrument of your dreams, but you won't be disappointed either.

[joeld]

Hah, everyone should have a Serotta and a Santa Cruz!

[Dwight]

On a good day I'm only a mediocre player and I bought guitars as an investment as much as playing enjoyment (it's a longer story).

I chose mostly off the rack and commonly appointed guitars that others will like as well. I have Santa Cruz's, Collings's, Bourgeois, R Taylor and many others that I bought, enjoyed and sold without loosing money.

I've seen enough cringe worthy BTO Taylors to realize guitar customization isn't something I should experiment with.

Others might have the opposite experience.

[Br1ck]

If you had to pass a test to buy, there would be no independent luthiers.


Someone should make family trees of luthiers and their apprentices. Heck Santa Cruz alone would be quite a list. Thing is, if you can sell all you make, why advertise far and wide?

[Sadie-f]

Originally Posted by joeld

Hah, everyone should have a Serotta and a Santa Cruz!

You're not wrong, noting that I don't own a car or house.

[RADJJD]

this is my humble experience with a "Custom Build";

back in the day, large guitar manufacturers also had a "Custom" shop out back that would build to your specs; this is a good example:

1932 Regal Archtop Custom Built Chicago

Western Red Cedar top with 4"round sound hole & elevated pick guard, Honduran Mahogany back, sides, neck & slotted headstock with Rosewood inlay, ebony fretboard & bridge, 20 frets (14 frets to body) Tusq nut (1 3/4") & bridge, completely stripped, restored, refinished, & rebraced in 2011 by myself, 8 coats of super blonde shellac (French Polish) , 25.5" scale. Lower bout is 4 1/4" deep so big bass response, high E intonates perfectly at 12th fret. All of the tone woods are as hard as a stone, so humidification & other repairs are always a work in process.

Inherited from my father in 1972, I play this sweetheart almost every day, mostly Finger style or Flat picking. Plays well with D' Adarrio lites phosphour bronze or Nylons, also trying La Bella 830 Folk singers. Good enough for Willie, good enough for me.

Some body cracks (repaired) but otherwise solid & straight.

Not bad for 92 YEARS OLD!

Image at:

https://www.instagram.com/p/C4wP3BIvugw/

[RADJJD]

Bikes & guitars, huh?

Best bike was a Custom built Marinoni 12 speed; frame was Aircraft quality aluminum 6061-T6, light & strong. Wheels were alloy with 18mm Conti racing tires, elliptical chain ring & alloy cranks. Went straight down the road like a rocket.

Best guitar is my current Custom built 1932 Archtop with Western Red Cedar soundboard, Honduran Mahogany back, sides, arm, & ebony fretboard.

I completely dismantled, repaired, restored & refinished this sweetheart in 2011 & played almost every day since.

Played lots of Dreads & not a fan; mostly loud but not very complex nor articulate.

My musical ear is not that good, so I probably wouldn't be able to appreciate the real value in a now very pricey Custom build, although I tip my hat to the luthiers' expertise, especially since I am a player, not a collector.

So, until I play & hear something better I'll be content with the amazing old instrument that I inherited from my father. If it breaks, I fix it.

Bikes & Guitars, huh? Good choices.

[The Bard Rocks]

I've had 7 builds from individual guitar luthiers and two more with autoharp makers. With a single exception the builds have worked out well. The exception was one I bought with my eyes, ignoring the strong possibility that the wood might not make as an exceptional guitar as I hoped for. My bad. But it sure was purty. I have moved on 2 others: one was outstanding, one I kept for17 years until my fingers changed from arthritis and I began to have difficulty playing it as cleanly as I used to. The builder produced a guitar there that was exactly as I'd hoped for. The other? It had nothing to do with final guitar I received. That one would be one of the very best in anyone's herd. For personal reasons, I never came close to bonding with it, though I tried for 15 years. It now belongs to a full time professional who loves it so much, in his words, "there ought to be law against it."

Think about it: 7 guitars (9 instruments total), owned from 17 to 3 years and 4 guitars (6 instruments total) are still here with no plans to move them, not while I am still able to play. There are a lot of folks who go through a lot more guitars than that, searching for "the one". And I still have 2/3s of them.

I take pleasure in knowing that no one has ever seen much less owned a guitar like any of my custom-made ones and that every little thing I wished for was done. Sure, that may not be as important to many folks as it is to me. But even more important to me as a very involved buyer, was the relationships I built with the luthiers. These experiences gave me the utmost respect for those in the profession. I wish I was younger so I could do it again and again every few years.

[rounder]

Originally Posted by The Bard Rocks

I've had 7 builds from individual guitar luthiers and two more with autoharp makers. With a single exception they builds have worked out well. The exception was one I bought with my eyes, ignoring the strong possibility that the wood might not make as an exceptional guitar as I hoped for. My bad. But it sure was purty. I have moved on 2 others: one was outstanding, one I kept for17 years until my fingers changed from arthritis and I began to have difficulty playing it as cleanly as I used to. The builder produced a guitar there that was exactly as I'd hoped for. The other? It had nothing to do with final guitar I received. That one would be one of the very best in anyone's herd. For personal reasons, I never came close to bonding with it, though I tried for 15 years. It now belongs to a full time professional who loves it so much, in his words, "there ought to be law against it."

Think about it: 7 guitars (9 instruments), owned from 17 to 1 years and 4 guitars (6 instruments) are still here with no plans to move them while I am still able to play. There are a lot of folks who go through a lot more guitars than that, searching for "the one". And I still have 2/3s of them.

I take pleasure in knowing that no one has ever seen much less owned a guitar like any of my custom-made ones and that every little thing I wished for was done. Sure, that may not be as important to many folks as it is to me. But more important to me as a very involved buyer, was the relationships I built with the luthiers. These experiences gave me the utmost respect for those in the profession. I wish I was younger so I could do it again and again every few years.

That sounds sort of like my experience in buying a custom bike. The North American Handmade Bicycle Show (NAHBS) goes to a different city every year. Top bike builders go there every year to show their latest stuff. It was held in Richmond years ago, and I drove down there to see what was going on. I had no intention of buying a bike. I met most of the builders there that I was interested in and drooled over their bikes on display. There was one guy, Kelly Bedford who was a long time chief designer for Serotta, and whose bikes I liked the best.

Spoke with him and decided I wanted him to build a bike. Met with him and his partner, who was a bike fitter, and agreed to buy a bike. Got measured and the specs were sent to Kelly. A few days later, I received design specs by email. The specs were based on trigonometric functions.

A few months later. I began receiving pictures of the frame after different phases of welding. I started ordering component parts from a company in England, which started arriving daily after a few weeks. About a month later, the frame arrived and a friend and I built it up with the new parts. It turned out great. Everything worked out great.

I know that is not the same process you go through when buying a new custom guitar. But I imagine a lot of it is similar, and I can see why buying a custom guitar can be a great experience.

[Bill Kraus]

Originally Posted by The Bard Rocks

I've had 7 builds from individual guitar luthiers and two more with autoharp makers. With a single exception they builds have worked out well. The exception was one I bought with my eyes, ignoring the strong possibility that the wood might not make as an exceptional guitar as I hoped for. My bad. But it sure was purty. I have moved on 2 others: one was outstanding, one I kept for17 years until my fingers changed from arthritis and I began to have difficulty playing it as cleanly as I used to. The builder produced a guitar there that was exactly as I'd hoped for. The other? It had nothing to do with final guitar I received. That one would be one of the very best in anyone's herd. For personal reasons, I never came close to bonding with it, though I tried for 15 years. It now belongs to a full time professional who loves it so much, in his words, "there ought to be law against it."

Think about it: 7 guitars (9 instruments), owned from 17 to 1 years and 4 guitars (6 instruments) are still here with no plans to move them while I am still able to play. There are a lot of folks who go through a lot more guitars than that, searching for "the one". And I still have 2/3s of them.

I take pleasure in knowing that no one has ever seen much less owned a guitar like any of my custom-made ones and that every little thing I wished for was done. Sure, that may not be as important to many folks as it is to me. But more important to me as a very involved buyer, was the relationships I built with the luthiers. These experiences gave me the utmost respect for those in the profession. I wish I was younger so I could do it again and again every few years.

It's all right here folks, in a cookie cutter guitar world, here's a person that values individuality and originality in guitar making, and it has rewarded him with a selection of instruments that are unique, great sounding, and inspiring to him. We all have one go around in this life, and life is short and is to be enjoyed. Spend the time, money, and effort, to find the instruments that make you happy. The cost is secondary

[gfirob]

I had a very poor custom build experience, a major disappointment and I can only say it confirmed my now unshakable view of guitars: each one is an individual and you can only know what you have when you play it and listen to it. Boutique builders are always going to be better than the factory builders, except when the individual factory guitar hits a home run, and that happens.

I would never buy any guitar without playing it now, and for all the seductive appeal of carefully selected wood, or a special builder or whatever, it is always a roll of the dice. There are a sh*tpile of guitars out there in the world and it is more fun and more realistic to go out and try them out and prospect for some special gold nugget of a guitar than to talk yourself into the idea that one genius builder or another will strike gold for you based on their reputation or rare wood. A guitar is a guitar, and you can find pre-war Martins that are duds, and high end builders who make duds too. You have to play them and feel how the neck feels in your hand and how it sounds to you and you will almost always do better with a used guitar you select with your own desires and expectations than to just throw money at a name brand that is supposed to be fabulous.

[Malcolm Kindnes]

Originally Posted by gfirob

I had a very poor custom build experience, a major disappointment and I can only say it confirmed my now unshakable view of guitars: each one is an individual and you can only know what you have when you play it and listen to it. Boutique builders are always going to be better than the factory builders, except when the individual factory guitar hits a home run, and that happens.

I would never buy any guitar without playing it now, and for all the seductive appeal of carefully selected wood, or a special builder or whatever, it is always a roll of the dice. There are a sh*tpile of guitars out there in the world and it is more fun and more realistic to go out and try them out and prospect for some special gold nugget of a guitar than to talk yourself into the idea that one genius builder or another will strike gold for you based on their reputation or rare wood. A guitar is a guitar, and you can find pre-war Martins that are duds, and high end builders who make duds too. You have to play them and feel how the neck feels in your hand and how it sounds to you and you will almost always do better with a used guitar you select with your own desires and expectations than to just throw money at a name brand that is supposed to be fabulous.

100% agree with this, it's more or less what I said earlier in the thread.