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  #16  
Old 07-18-2020, 02:49 PM
lpa53 lpa53 is offline
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Thanks for the advice and the videos. At least I won't feel bad about being a cheat if I modulate using a capo.

I tried the Wilcox technique using the picking hand to move the capo and that works better than using the fretting hand, which is what I'd been doing. I may look into one of the sliding capos, but it would have to work on a flat classical neck. Michael Johnson usually used a Kyser capo as did Wilcox in the video linked to by JonPR.

To show why I can't figure how Michael Johnson is modulating without a capo, I've made a video of the intro riff that he also plays after the modulation. Now it's certainly possible he plays it differently but again, having watched him play and having figured out many of his arrangements, I'm pretty sure this is what's being done. The partial chords with open strings, the dropped D, and the slides, make it pretty hard to modulate capo-free in my opinion. But then, Johnson was probably capable of doing it.

In case I give up on the modulation, I've come up with an melody alteration that gives a lift to the ending similar to what a key change is intended to do.

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Last edited by lpa53; 07-18-2020 at 03:43 PM.
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  #17  
Old 07-18-2020, 06:30 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
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I'm figuring out a new song that has a key change at the end, and while I've been able to do a change on a few songs in my repertoire, this one has left hand fingering that, as far as I can figure from the two audio versions I've been able to find, can only be done with particular left hand fingering, thus not easily lending itself to key change. I could just forget the modulation but it does add something to the song.

The two versions, one a recording and one a live performance, have a gap of silence just before the change and I was thinking of using a capo and shifting it in that gap. Is this a big no-no? I've seen James Taylor do multiple capo moves on "Your Smiling Face", but has anyone seen other good players do this?

If you need to do a capo change to modulate to a new key it souldn't be a major deal.

I capo up at 2:15 in this video of Shenandoah to play in a different "flavor
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  #18  
Old 07-18-2020, 06:32 PM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
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Originally Posted by lpa53 View Post
I'm figuring out a new song that has a key change at the end, and while I've been able to do a change on a few songs in my repertoire, this one has left hand fingering that, as far as I can figure from the two audio versions I've been able to find, can only be done with particular left hand fingering, thus not easily lending itself to key change. I could just forget the modulation but it does add something to the song.

The two versions, one a recording and one a live performance, have a gap of silence just before the change and I was thinking of using a capo and shifting it in that gap. Is this a big no-no? I've seen James Taylor do multiple capo moves on "Your Smiling Face", but has anyone seen other good players do this?

If you need to do a capo change to modulate to a new key it souldn't be a major deal.

I capo up at 2:15 in this video of Shenandoah to play in different chord shapes, but key change would be no different.

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  #19  
Old 07-18-2020, 07:47 PM
lpa53 lpa53 is offline
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Originally Posted by Rudy4 View Post
If you need to do a capo change to modulate to a new key it souldn't be a major deal.

I capo up at 2:15 in this video of Shenandoah to play in different chord shapes, but key change would be no different.

Nice job. But I don't use a looper so I'll have to manage a quick change with not too big a gap of silence. Luckily, the song I'm doing this on does have a gap. I'm practicing the change and it's coming along. My main issue is getting over the idea that I'm "cheating" by doing this.
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  #20  
Old 07-19-2020, 06:33 AM
PHJim PHJim is offline
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Tommy Emmanuel throws the capo off rather than moving it part way through this Beatles' Medley.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsLGgeK3qCg
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  #21  
Old 07-19-2020, 07:53 AM
Rudy4 Rudy4 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lpa53 View Post
Nice job. But I don't use a looper so I'll have to manage a quick change with not too big a gap of silence. Luckily, the song I'm doing this on does have a gap. I'm practicing the change and it's coming along. My main issue is getting over the idea that I'm "cheating" by doing this.
The point isn't about using a looper, but that you can throw a capo on without too much fuss to either play in a different chord structure or to change key. I took my time in the video, but it can be done quicker than that if you practice. I've also done key changes live, but started with a capo on and then it can be quickly removed for your second key. It does depend on what you want to accomplish, though.
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  #22  
Old 07-20-2020, 12:37 PM
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UncleJesse UncleJesse is offline
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Dan Romano changes capo position several times in his song "Workin For the Music Man", albeit a studio album.

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  #23  
Old 07-23-2020, 02:49 PM
lpa53 lpa53 is offline
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Well I have the guitar work down and I recorded two versions of the ending. One modulates a half step as Michael Johnson performed it (I'm using a capo shift) and the other stays in the same key and simply alters the melody. I'm trying to decide if the key change is really that much different in effect.

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  #24  
Old 08-04-2020, 02:45 PM
EZYPIKINS EZYPIKINS is offline
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Used to do He Stopped Loving Her Today. G C D Started with capo on the nut. after first verse, moved capo to first fret.
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