Old strings and saddle adjustment question

[rodmbds]

Hi everybody. Wondering if any of you has ever experienced this.

First of all, it's a nylon string guitar. I decided to lower the saddle a bit, so the action got more comfortable. I lowered it a tad below 1mm.

When I put it back on, I noticed two things:

1) while the action was lower, the strings felt stiffer, as if the tension was higher (it wasn't, same strings I previously had on it)

2) the wound strings sounded "kind of new", not like coming out of the pack but much brighter than before loosing them up to put the new saddle

So why would that be? Maybe the tension thing is just my impression, lower action wouldn't result in higher tension, quite the opposite, right?

[Spyder man]

Originally Posted by rodmbds

Hi everybody. Wondering if any of you has ever experienced this.

First of all, it's a nylon string guitar. I decided to lower the saddle a bit, so the action got more comfortable. I lowered it a tad below 1mm.

When I put it back on, I noticed two things:

1) while the action was lower, the strings felt stiffer, as if the tension was higher (it wasn't, same strings I previously had on it)

2) the wound strings sounded "kind of new", not like coming out of the pack but much brighter than before loosing them up to put the new saddle

So why would that be? Maybe the tension thing is just my impression, lower action wouldn't result in higher tension, quite the opposite, right?

Hi. I have noticed whenever I reduce the action of a classl, the treble strings will seem quieter than the wound strings, is that what you mean? They still need the space to vibrate. Would suggest you look at the space between the strings and top of the 5th-7th frets. Classical guitars often have this 'dip' built in to stop the strings choking, but seldom have a truss rod adjustment as steel strings do. Therefore your action will appear low at either end, but the gap in the middle will still make playing in that area feel stiff. Hope this helps.

[ChalkLitIScream]

Originally Posted by rodmbds

2) the wound strings sounded "kind of new", not like coming out of the pack but much brighter than before loosing them up to put the new saddle

I too have noticed this phenomenon. The strings just seem significantly more vibrant and brighter-like new 80/20s. I suspect that strings mellowing out is them settling in under the tension. Once reset and then strung to pitch again, it gains some life. I posted about this a while back; some agreed on this observation and others didnt notice a difference.

I must say, this is probably one factor which falsely gives people the perception about saddle and bridge pin material making a difference in tone, when its just the string being strung up again.

As for the seemingly increase tension, you sort of increased the length of the string. Think of a long right angle triangle- The nut making one of the corners, X, and the 2 points the string touched the saddle, A and B.
(drawing this may help you)
The distance from A to B is the amount of saddle you removed, X to A is the string length BEFORE you adjusted the saddle, and X to B is the string length AFTER saddle adjustment.
IF you see what I mean, because you lowered the saddle, the string length got longer, and thus more tension. We are talking about 1mm here, so Im not sure if its even enough to feel that tension increase, but this is what I think.

Lowering the nut slot will help alleviate this if you feel its annoying, but be cautious about string buzz!

[murrmac123]

Originally Posted by ChalkLitIScream

As for the seemingly increase tension, you sort of increased the length of the string. Think of a long right angle triangle- The nut making one of the corners, X, and the 2 points the string touched the saddle, A and B.
(drawing this may help you)
The distance from A to B is the amount of saddle you removed, X to A is the string length BEFORE you adjusted the saddle, and X to B is the string length AFTER saddle adjustment.
IF you see what I mean, because you lowered the saddle, the string length got longer, and thus more tension. We are talking about 1mm here, so Im not sure if its even enough to feel that tension increase, but this is what I think.

I doubt that Pythagoras would have agreed with you.

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by murrmac123

I doubt that Pythagoras would have agreed with you.

Even I don't agree with him.

[rodmbds]

Okay, thanks for the inputs! I guess the tension might be just my impression in the end.

Nut is just right, I wouldn't dare to mess with it and get buzzing. Thanks!

Good point about the materials and tone. I definitely think there's something to it. Just loosing and restringing changes the tone, at least for a while, like when cleaning the strings.

I'd add that, after being frustrated trying to follow other people's measurements and fussing about 0.1mm... Nowadays I follow them as guidelines, but nothing like adjusting action by feel, IMO. I know it's a hassle to restring constantly as adjusting nut, saddle and etc... But it's worth it.