Ideas for small hole parlor

[gr81dorn]

I have an awesome little style 2 parlor that I love and would love to put some kind of pickup in it, but I am not sure how I'd get inside it like I can on anything bigger.

It has a very small soundhole, no way a typical soundhole pickup would fit nor would I want it, I want to try and get a K&K or Lyric type in there.

The other issue is that, being a 12 fret, the bridge plate is a long way from the soundhole, so even the little bit I could get in there wouldn't get me back to the bridge plate.

Anyone have ideas or suggestions? I've read that some of the transducer style pickups can be mounted anywhere, not necessarily the bridge plate. Not sure how much that impacts the sound. I have a couple mandolin-family instruments with K&Ks on the under of the soundboard and not on the bridge plate and they sound pretty good. The builder installed them during the build so he could get inside such a small instrument, so that's how they're in there. Obviously can't do that here.

Any thoughts or experience or suggestions?

Thanks,

-CH

[varmonter]

I bought an archtop tenor f hole
That I installed JJB pickups
to the top . I pre tested the positions
Using that putty schertler sends with
Their dyn pickups. After getting the
Sound I wanted on the top I just super
Glued them in the same spot inside the guitar It sounds pretty Good. Ymmv
You could also just put a ust in..

[TRW1]

I was able to mount a Fishman Rare Earth pickup in the sound hole of a Baby Taylor. You just have to completely loosen one side of the cork pads and wedge it into place, then tighten it back up. It's a little bit of a tight space to work with, but once installed it worked just fine. I don't know if your Parlor has a smaller sound hole than that, but I've always felt the Rare Earth was one of the smallest pickups to install.

[JonWint]

Originally Posted by gr81dorn

I have an awesome little style 2 parlor that I love and would love to put some kind of pickup in it, but I am not sure how I'd get inside it like I can on anything bigger.

It has a very small soundhole, no way a typical soundhole pickup would fit nor would I want it, I want to try and get a K&K or Lyric type in there.

My Size 2 Martin has a 3-1/2" diameter sound hole. I can get my hand inside there.

What size is the hole on yours?

[gr81dorn]

Originally Posted by JonWint

My Size 2 Martin has a 3-1/2" diameter sound hole. I can get my hand inside there.

What size is the hole on yours?

I think it measures right about that....I am 6'6" with relative hands., but getting a hand in there is a totally different thing than getting well up the forearm in order to reach all the way back to the bridge plate.

[gr81dorn]

Originally Posted by TRW1

I was able to mount a Fishman Rare Earth pickup in the sound hole of a Baby Taylor. You just have to completely loosen one side of the cork pads and wedge it into place, then tighten it back up. It's a little bit of a tight space to work with, but once installed it worked just fine. I don't know if your Parlor has a smaller sound hole than that, but I've always felt the Rare Earth was one of the smallest pickups to install.

Typical soundhole pickups (rare earth included) don't stand a chance here.

I've read that Sunrise can work, but they are so expensive and definitely not for this instrument. Jeff Tweedy has them in a bunch of his stuff, small stuff in particular.



My desire is not to have a soundhole pickup at all, but if that is the only option, I would probably just mount find a funky goldfoil type or a strat pickup to one of those little mounting kits you can get. Those things would fit and if I'm gonna get that magnetic, might as well go all in.

[lkingston]

Keep in mind that electric guitar magnetic pickups are designed for electric guitar strings and acoustic soundhole pickups are designed to be balanced just picking up the much smaller inner core steel part of the strings. You can't just put an electric guitar pickup in there without changing to electric guitar strings...and then the acoustic guitar sound suffers terribly.

Yeah, there are hybrid strings, but they sound pretty terrible.


Also, you can get acoustic soundhole pickups with a mic blend, which sounds pretty awesome.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by lkingston

Keep in mind that electric guitar magnetic pickups are designed for electric guitar strings and acoustic soundhole pickups are designed to be balanced just picking up the much smaller inner core steel part of the strings. You can't just put an electric guitar pickup in there without changing to electric guitar strings...and then the acoustic guitar sound suffers terribly.

Yeah, there are hybrid strings, but they sound pretty terrible.


Also, you can get acoustic soundhole pickups with a mic blend, which sounds pretty awesome.

I've seen Richard Thompson many times live, and several of those times he used a Sunrise magnetic as his only transducer for his Lowden 025C. It can work fine.

My preference is the K&K Pure Mini, and if my hands were too large to install one I'd definitely pay a good tech to install one.

[gr81dorn]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

I've seen Richard Thompson many times live, and several of those times he used a Sunrise magnetic as his only transducer for his Lowden 025C. It can work fine.

My preference is the K&K Pure Mini, and if my hands were too large to install one I'd definitely pay a good tech to install one.

Would that tech have magic ferries to get inside to mount the 3 sensors on that K&K?

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by gr81dorn

Would that tech have magic ferries to get inside to mount the 3 sensors on that K&K?

This is what you related:

"I want to try and get a K&K or Lyric type in there."

Good techs are surprisingly creative in doing fine work through a sound hole. I'd think if you thought that a K&K install was impossible you wouldn't have asked for ideas of how to do it.

[gr81dorn]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

This is what you related:

"I want to try and get a K&K or Lyric type in there."

Good techs are surprisingly creative in doing fine work through a sound hole. I'd think if you thought that a K&K install was impossible you wouldn't have asked for ideas of how to do it.

I DO think it's impossible, so I followed up those comments specifically asking about alternative placement for the sensors or similar products that don't need to get onto the actual bridge plate because I think that's the only feasible option for going inside for these type. I don't want a UST, but that would be infinitely more possible and a the last of last resorts in my book.

At the end of the day, I could just do nothing and probably will versus doing something invasive or ugly. Or, probably first, I might just place a Schatten that I have as far back as I can reach it and see how it sounds....might be just fine.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by gr81dorn

I DO think it's impossible, so I followed up those comments specifically asking about alternative placement for the sensors or similar products that don't need to get onto the actual bridge plate because I think that's the only feasible option for going inside for these type. I don't want a UST, but that would be infinitely more possible and a the last of last resorts in my book.

At the end of the day, I could just do nothing and probably will versus doing something invasive or ugly. Or, probably first, I might just place a Schatten that I have as far back as I can reach it and see how it sounds....might be just fine.

Ah. Sometimes forum posts are a little difficult to understand exactly what someone is shooting for. Sorry if I misunderstood your intentions.

A shot of the underside taken with a phone camera and a message to Dieter at K&K might yield a suggestion for the next best thing to a bridge plate install. I know he has been very helpful to folks in the past and does have a lot of experience with his transducers and adapting them to many instrument configurations. His experience at using his products in a wide variety of instruments is one of the things that set K&K apart from the makers of similar knock-offs.

I've never found a UST to be an acceptable option, but there are ones that I haven't tried. For me, I have no interest in anything that requires a battery, has controls, is easily seen, or modifies the guitar beyond adding an end pin jack.

[gr81dorn]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

Ah. Sometimes forum posts are a little difficult to understand exactly what someone is shooting for. Sorry if I misunderstood your intentions.

A shot of the underside taken with a phone camera and a message to Dieter at K&K might yield a suggestion for the next best thing to a bridge plate install. I know he has been very helpful to folks in the past and does have a lot of experience with his transducers and adapting them to many instrument configurations. His experience at using his products in a wide variety of instruments is one of the things that set K&K apart from the makers of similar knock-offs.

I've never found a UST to be an acceptable option, but there are ones that I haven't tried. For me, I have no interest in anything that requires a battery, has controls, is easily seen, or modifies the guitar beyond adding an end pin jack.

Yeah, nothing with a battery, nothing that permanently modifies other than the endpin is what I try to be after if at all possible, but I don't really like the look of soundhole pickups in most cases, either, so I've been pretty loyal to K&K and now really like Schattens...both produce very good acoustic tone in a no-nonsense way.

I looked at my octave guitar, which is about the size of a mandolin and the soundhole is maybe the diameter of a soda can maybe. The lutheir who made it for me placed the sensors during the build because he couldn't get in there after the fact, but it's a K&K and the sensors are up in front of the bridge plate and it sounds pretty fantastic. I've played it at church the past couple weeks and it amplifies the authentic sound of that instrument very accurately. It's almost just worth a try, particularly with the Schattens since they are so much easier to put in and out than K&Ks.

I may reach out to K&K and see if they have thoughts on a good spot.

[Silly Moustache]

If it is a 2-17 or similr - it seems a shame (to me) to do this, but I've watched a tech friend install K&K pure minis by putting them on a bent stick with a slightly sticky end and guide it in using a small inspection mirror.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by Silly Moustache

If it is a 2-17 or similr - it seems a shame (to me) to do this, but I've watched a tech friend install K&K pure minis by putting them on a bent stick with a slightly sticky end and guide it in using a small inspection mirror.

That's a great example of what I meant by "a good tech can be surprisingly creative" when doing the supposedly impossible. The same goes for removal of transducers if that's necessary in the future. A good mirror and bent chisel can work wonders in the hands of a good guitar tech. No magic fairies needed.