Curious about artists and recording studios

[Ryannn29]

I have my own setup that works fine, but I'm curious about all the artists I listen to, the artists/bands who have careers in music but aren't famous or well-known by any stretch of the imagination.

Many bands/artists seem to keep the same record label, but will change studios. Is this something the band or artists usually chooses? Also, do they tend to pay for it out of their pocket, or do they choose and their label pays (or does it vary and I'm asking to specific of questions :P)? I'm talking artists/bands who aren't famous, as a majority of professional musicians aren't, but still make 100% living out of it, usually by touring all year since record sales hardly cut it for people who aren't on the radio or winning grammy crackers.

Only curious. There's all this info online but it seems to be only about famous artists and "making it", but I'm interested in knowing about the actual artists I listen to who are professionally making it but are all these famous household name artists.

if anyone has any knowledgeable information to answer my nagging questions, thanks!

[Bob Womack]

I'm a recording engineer.

With labels and high-end, established bands, the label has classically given the band an advance on royalties to be used to record their next album. It used to be that the labels owned their own studios and had their own producers on staff and you recorded there and were produced by the company man but that changed at the turn of the 1960s to the '70s with the rise of independent studios and independent producers and engineers. Now the whole process can be out-sourced. Labels and bands will typically settle on a producer together unless the band is REALLY green. The producer will often have a favorite studio or studios and engineer or engineers.

There are several options in studios: Establish big studios where you can get the best mics and know you can get a sound based on their track record, smaller studios that are "hungry" and have good gear and a reasonable space, well-developed home studios, and "destination" studios - combined studios and vacation locations.

Producers, engineers, and studios come and go with styles like bands. For the last ten years the trend in production has been the "mothership" concept: recording in a home studio with inexpensive gear and bringing the tracks to a high-end studio for a few special overdubs and mixes. The style wasn't one emphasizing ensemble play, but instead layered overdubs. The result of this was basically the death of many of the top-end studios as revenues went down and real estate costs went up. The latest trend is back towards studios and ensemble playing, but instead of large complexes, medium sized single studio complexes with possibly an additional mix room. Classic 1970s and 1980s consoles like I started on are making a comeback and the console refurbishment business is really busy. I found my old favorite two consoles (the actual ones I recorded on in the 1980s) at other facilities via the Internet recently. Pardon a dog trail:


Highly customized 1979 Neve 8058
The six white switches on the fader row were a custom installation at my facility. This console with its elegant curved face was part of what lured me to my first career job! It was probably my favorite recording console. We had two.


Highly customized early '70s Neve 8024
The vertical EMT gold foil reverb tension meter and switches on right are dead give-aways. The quad master fader with red cap at right is a replacement - I have the original. The Internet is a wonderful thing!

Funding has shifted in recent years. It used to be that you recorded an album and then toured in support of the album. The tour was basically advertisement for the album, which was the vehicle from which everyone made money. Now no-one is making much money off albums and the band makes most of its money off touring. That means album budgets have shrunk. The funding models are turning upside down, with bands funding and recording their own albums and then shopping them around and negotiating for the labels to distribute them. It's a complex world out there.

Bob

[Ryannn29]

Wow, thanks Bob. Couldn't have asked for a better, more detailed reply. So I'm guessing bands just learn of studios and producers as they're in the business, from which they decide? As for "green bands", besides having the label pick the studio/etc, I guess they could look at a studios track record/records they've produced in order to help decide if they like them?

[Bob Womack]

Typically the bands and the record company will hear of producers. They will get together and compare notes. You see, a producer is not only the creative driver of the recording process, he is also the guy who sees to it that a product is made that will sell and is made within the available budget. As such, he is responsible to the record company in a big way.

As far as studios go, typically the producer will have some places he is comfortable working out of. Until the band has clout the often have no say in that. Now, if they live near some iconic studio they may include a day there for fun or the producer may have experience there so he may want to go there. Young bands may be taken into the producer's personal studio, for instance. One of the trends in home vs. pro studios is that producers are building studios outside their homes now because real estate is cheaper, a purpose-built studio offers more prestige, and they don't want their homes continually invaded. These are the single studio complexes I was speaking of.

Bob

[Ryannn29]

Ah, okay. As for recording engineers such as yourself, do you have a studio that you work out of, or do you go and work with certain producers?

Lastly I was also wondering what you believe the baisc range is for pricing in studios. of course I'm sure it varies as much as the wind blows, but I'm curious-what range do professional studios charge ( is $50-100, perhaps more for really high-end producers/studios)?

Thanks again for your info, I've just always had these questions laying around in my head, just never actually asked them.

[Bob Womack]

Engineering is fascinating. Typically, your first break is to start as a "second engineer" hired by studio whose job it is to assist the first engineer and protect the interests of the studio. If it is a busy studio it is a steady job but isn't paid horribly well. If you are good and get a break you are noticed by a producer and asked to be a first engineer on a project. You leave the comfort of the staff engineer situation and become a free-lancer, living from album contract to album contract. Your pay is linked to the level of the producers and artists with whom you work. It is a volatile market and tastes are fickle. There are only a handful of engineers who can survive beyond about ten years like this. Somewhere along the line you may get a break and become the house engineer for a label's studio which will both pay well and put you in contact with big names.

There are a variety of other engineer situations such as working as a recording engineer, editor, or mixer for a scoring stage, video or film. Many of those are staff positions.

Studio prices? It gets really dicey here. A lot has to do with the location (location,location,location), the market, the quality of room and gear (did they bring in an acoustic designer to create the rooms?), and experience and track record of the staff. The local guy with a couple of rooms at home and a DAW might charge you $30 per hour. A small local real studio might want $50. A good professional house with lots of mics that is hungry (wants either credits of work) might be more in the range of $100-150. An established studio with a track record might want $250. Be aware that block bookings will often offer the opportunities for rate discounts. There are places in the world where your money can't get you in - either you have to know someone or you have to be famous. Only then are you are offered the chance to spend the big bucks.

Bob

[Bob Womack]

Oh, and me. Very early in my career I fell backward into a job in the audio division of a media company that bucked industry trends and didn't have any second engineers! Though there was a pecking order to the eleven engineers (at the time) based on experience and skill, everyone got a shot at the gigs, a chance to grow, and a place in the rotation if you worked out. I did everything from music recording to live TV shows to a soap opera to foley to score recording to sound editing to post production. I mixed everything from name music acts to handbells to Egyptian Qanuun to orchestras.

These days I specialize in "Audio Post Production for Video" and my title is Audio Post Production Design Engineer, or Sound Designer. I still record scores and an occasional album. After years working in this facility I've been assigned to a particular room in our facility, a combined studio and post production suite.

Bob

[Ryannn29]

Ah okay, I see. As for studio pricing, that of course doesn't include paying for a producer? They're probably just as expensive?

[Bob Womack]

The producer typically works for a percentage of the revenue of the album.

Bob

[Ryannn29]

Ah okay. Last question! In your experience as a recording engineer since DAW's have come into play, what DAW's do you prefer or most often use? Just curious!

[Bob Womack]

I've been through a pile of boxes at this point. We got in on the ground floor with Avid and "had a bad experience" so we moved to Fairlight until they reorganized. From there we were early adopters of Steinberg's Nuendo. I've been very happy with Nuendo through four different physical boxes including both PC and Mac and many different interfaces. We are currently on Lynx interface cards. We do both music and video here so the video feature set on Nuendo is on-point. We have plugs by Waves, UAD, iZotope, Antares, Power Toys, etc. I have a Euphonix Artist Series MC Transport at my left hand for certain commands, jogging, and zooming and the DAW is remoted to a Yamaha DM2000 for fader control as well.

Bob

[muscmp]

very interesting information. it is amazing how things have changed!
thanks bob! and thanks to ryannn29 for the question.

play music!

[Legolas1971]

I have been a songwriter and producer for the past 15yrs or so. I've worked in big time studios and everything under that. One of the biggest things that has caused the demise of big studios is the technology. It's become smaller and smaller and cheaper and cheaper. Also, like Bob says, many producers (who are also engineers these days) build studios in their houses. I have done the same thing. I have my Mac laptop, Pro Tool's, an interface, some choice mics, an iso-booth hard wired to my interface, etc...the plugins that are available have become so powerful and realistic that it's pushed out board gear further to the fringes.

Regarding budgets for artists to record.....there basically are no budgets any more. Major labels and even many independent labels want a finished product brought to them.They have stopped developing artists almost completely. A&R Dept's have been slashed. The label in most cases is going to provide marketing, advertising, promotion, set up distribution, etc...It's all just business to them. Independent labels and the like may be more hands on in artist development but again you're back to no money for production costs.

[Bob Womack]

Yeah, one of the last albums I was working on the label was quibbling about song length. You see, when a song length goes over 4:20 (I think) they have to pay a royalty premium to the composer. We hacked and hacked on one song and gave up with it still over the limit.

Bob

[Ryannn29]

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

Yeah, one of the last albums I was working on the label was quibbling about song length. You see, when a song length goes over 4:20 (I think) they have to pay a royalty premium to the composer. We hacked and hacked on one song and gave up with it still over the limit.

Bob

Ah, now that's a bummer..

Really awesome to read all this information from someone in the business. thanks for taking the time to write it all down! Answered many questions I've had pending for a longg time..