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  #1  
Old 01-02-2022, 04:17 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Default Martin D-18 with Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2

Prior to likely soon removing the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 system from the Martin D-18, I thought I'd make one last EQ'ed recording of the combination when played fairly aggressively with a flatpick. The Schatten HFN pickup was installed with the Schatten-supplied 3M tape and is being 48-volt phantom powered by a FELiX 2 preamp. The FELiX 2 EQ channel settings for the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 are:

Low Control FLAT (125 Hz Shelving)

Mid Control +5 dB @ 90 Hz, Q 1 Octave

High Control -5 dB @ 1 kHz Shelving

From my experience, the Schatten HFN pickup needs more EQ to sound good whereas the Trance Amulet M-VT and Dazzo #70 sound really good with all EQ FLAT everywhere in the signal chain. There are NO EFFECTS of any kind and from the FELiX 2 the signal goes into a PreSonus Studio 192 Audio Interface and then into Audacity.

The song segment is just the guitar backing to my vocal in my version of George Strait's "If You're Thinking You Want A Stranger (There's One Coming Home)"

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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-16-2022 at 11:18 AM.
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  #2  
Old 01-03-2022, 02:49 PM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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I really like that tone for strumming with a pick. Albeit, you might want to drop some bass for picking with bare finger pads.

Considering that the pickup’s raw tone is unbalanced, and considering that it’s the most feedback prone type of pickup, it seems like the perfect candidate to test out ToneDexter with its upgraded software. When using it with 100% WaveMap it should give you the same tonal balance as the training mic heard when the WaveMap was being trained. When playing with your guitar top exposed to loud speaker sound, turning up the anti-feedback knob an appropriate amount (as judged by your ear) should keep your tone free of tubbiness and a tendency to feed back.
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Old 01-04-2022, 05:50 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Thanks, Gary for the suggestions but the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 is coming out of the Martin D-18, and likely my just received Ultra Tonic 3.2 will go in this weekend. Even with a fair amount of added bass EQ, the Schatten just doesn't offer much bass and clarity in the bass spectrum. There's little separation of bass-run notes within the chords. I should try a reinstallation of the Schatten but, as installed now it's perfectly centered under the saddle line and my feeling is the very thin supplied 3M tape I used is likely the best medium of the Schatten provided putty and 3M Tape. I'll likely remove the three-footed base from the pickup element and install just the pickup element in some other guitar someday. This is the second Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 system that I've tried, the first was in 2012 and I was disappointed then, too.

For comparison, please listen to my recent Trance Amulet M-VT Phantom and Dazzo #70 Set pickup systems that were recorded with FLAT EQ.
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Last edited by SpruceTop; 01-09-2022 at 10:09 AM.
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  #4  
Old 01-04-2022, 07:14 PM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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It really is a shame that the HFN has issues with bass. It's such a simple installation and it has a very natural tone. I really liked it in my Taylor but just couldn't get enough bass out of it. It was like the low E was somewhat distant with no sustain. I wonder sometimes how it would sound if it had adjustable feet or if it was natural slanted towards the low E?
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Old 01-04-2022, 08:37 PM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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Ken,

Many years ago Harvey Reid made the observation that a custom made Aura sound image could compensate for a poorly balanced pickup. I suspect that ToneDexter can do the same thing if one is using 100% WaveMap. I don't fault you for wanting to give the Ultra Tonic a try, however. It's getting a lot of praise from the folks here who've tried it, and it will likely give you the drier sounding (than ToneDexter) amplified tone which you've said you prefer.
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Old 01-09-2022, 10:13 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Follow Up: There is something I really like about the tone of the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 system in the Martin D-18. I'll bet that reinstalling the HFN transducer with Henkel Loctite 6-Minute Epoxy would help increase the HFN's signal strength and also provide more clarity of tone throughout the sound spectrum even with all EQ FLAT.
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Martin HD-28 Sunburst/Trance M-VT Phantom
Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic
Guild F-212XL STD
Adamas I 2087GT-8
Huss & Dalton TD-R
Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee D-03R Sunburst/Ultra Tonic
Larrivee D-40M Legacy/Dazzo
Larrivee C-03R Tommy Emmanuel/Trance M-VT Phantom
Emerald X20
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  #7  
Old 01-14-2022, 09:33 AM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Surgery Day! I'll perform an operation to excise the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 from my 2016 Martin D-18 and install an Ultra Tonic 3.2 system. Time to wash up! More to come ...
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Martin HD-28 Sunburst/Trance M-VT Phantom
Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic
Guild F-212XL STD
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Huss & Dalton TD-R
Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee D-03R Sunburst/Ultra Tonic
Larrivee D-40M Legacy/Dazzo
Larrivee C-03R Tommy Emmanuel/Trance M-VT Phantom
Emerald X20
Ovation Elite Plus
Republic Duolian/Schatten NR-2
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  #8  
Old 01-14-2022, 10:01 AM
jricc jricc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpruceTop View Post
Surgery Day! I'll perform an operation to excise the Schatten HFN Artist Plus 2 from my 2016 Martin D-18 and install an Ultra Tonic 3.2 system. Time to wash up! More to come ...
Then it'll be time for a new sound sample Sprucetop!
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Old 01-14-2022, 10:17 AM
JWJ915 JWJ915 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jricc View Post
Then it'll be time for a new sound sample Sprucetop!

I second this. I’d love to hear a sample of the D-18 with the Ultra Tonic.
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  #10  
Old 01-14-2022, 12:01 PM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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Here’s hoping that the “more to come” from Sprucetop won’t take nearly as long as the “more to come” from LR Baggs. Oh well. So many pickups. So much curiosity. So little time.
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  #11  
Old 01-14-2022, 12:23 PM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaniac View Post
Here’s hoping that the “more to come” from Sprucetop won’t take nearly as long as the “more to come” from LR Baggs. Oh well. So many pickups. So much curiosity. So little time.
I am not sure what Baggs product this is referring to, but when you really think about it, there hasn't been much innovation/development with pickups over the past 10-12 years. I mean the Anthem was probably the last really innovative approach and it came out in 2010. We seem to be in the IR phase where companies are focus more on that and less on the development of new pickups.
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  #12  
Old 01-14-2022, 01:25 PM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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Petty found a Charlie Worsham post on Instagram where he played a “mystery project” guitar in the LR Baggs office in Nashville on Jan 6, 2022. He teased us with “What could it be? Stay tuned.” It’s been crickets since then.
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  #13  
Old 01-14-2022, 01:50 PM
Petty1818 Petty1818 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by guitaniac View Post
Petty found a Charlie Worsham post on Instagram where he played a “mystery project” guitar in the LR Baggs office in Nashville on Jan 6, 2022. He teased us with “What could it be? Stay tuned.” It’s been crickets since then.
Haha you mean I forgot about my own post? Teaching online is having a serious impact on my ability to think clearly lol.
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  #14  
Old 01-14-2022, 02:26 PM
guitaniac guitaniac is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Petty1818 View Post
Haha you mean I forgot about my own post? Teaching online is having a serious impact on my ability to think clearly lol.
Forgetting about it only means that you have an interesting life outside gear discussions. More power to you. Me, I'm just a sucker for exotic stage guitars of every variety and amplification gear in general. The Baggs "mystery project" will haunt my dreams. I'm hoping to balance it out with some Ultra Tonic envy. (My Optima Air IRs invariably get sounding tubbier as I crank the level past a certain point. I think of the Ultra Tonic as a pickup which corrects itself as the sound level goes up and the interaction between guitar top and speaker sound increases.)
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  #15  
Old 01-14-2022, 03:55 PM
SpruceTop SpruceTop is offline
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Installation of the James May Engineering Ultra Tonic 3.2 system in the 2016 Martin D-18 is complete with more to come in a separate thread ...
__________________
RainSong BI-DR1000N2
Martin HD-28 Sunburst/Trance M-VT Phantom
Martin D-18/Ultra Tonic
Guild F-212XL STD
Adamas I 2087GT-8
Huss & Dalton TD-R
Taylor 717e
Taylor 618e
Taylor 614ce
Larrivee D-40R Sunburst
Larrivee D-03R Sunburst/Ultra Tonic
Larrivee D-40M Legacy/Dazzo
Larrivee C-03R Tommy Emmanuel/Trance M-VT Phantom
Emerald X20
Ovation Elite Plus
Republic Duolian/Schatten NR-2
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