Best RW Boutique Dreadnought

[Scoobtay]

Originally Posted by 67goat

How are you defining heirloom quality? Something that will last a long time? Plenty of cheap guitars will do this, but I doubt that's what you mean. Something that will increase in value? If that's part of the equation, boutique is probably not the answer. You'll get a better guitar for the money going boutique, but they don't seem to hold value as well. Unless you buy used, then potential losses would be minimal.

I do realize that for something meant to be passed down, value retention should not be a major concern. However, if you end up not liking it, not being able to pass it down, or find yourself in a position you need to sell, value retention will become important.

I do not claim to know every builder (by far), but $6K seems like the entry point for those specs by boutique builders. At least for new.

Pre War Guitars' herringbone, Indian RW dread is $5995. Waitlist is fairly long. That's also the neighborhood of a Boucher Bluegrass Goose. Bourgeois Vintage Professional or Heirloom should have herringbone right around that price. Used Santa Cruz Model D....

Thank you for your insight. To elaborate slightly, I mean “heirloom quality” in actual build quality only. I don’t care any about long-term value, though I do want to find something where the construction is familiar to skilled luthiers, so I can get proper care for the instrument through my life and beyond.

It also sounds like my budget ought to be bumped up.

[67goat]

Originally Posted by Scoobtay

I’m blown away by the number of responses thus far. Thanks everyone for your words of advise already.

In regards to your first question, I just mean guitars that are “built like” Martin pre-ww2 guitars. Similar bracing, vintage square headstocks, that sort of deal.

As for the actual “Pre-War” brand guitars, something about them throws me off. I’ve neither seen nor played one, but I just can’t chase a blank headstock for some reason. They are missing “something” to me. And I’m cool to really use any Back and Side tone wood, but something similar to any Rosewood that has good sustain and note separation.

Many pre-war Martin guitars did not have a logo on the headstock. Some of them only had a stamp selected by the distributor. So it is in line with what might have come out of the Martin factory during that time.

If what you want is a great guitar that will last a long time in your family, I wouldn't worry about the logo. The quality of the construction and sound is way more important. Personally, I would focus on those aspects above all else.

[llew]

I don't know that you'll find better build quality than a Boucher dread. And they offer EIR, Madagascar, and Braz rosewood. But one of the tone woods that I bought somewhat by happenstance is Bubinga. Boucher builds a Studio Goose (SG-22) in Adirondack/African Bubinga. Just a nod to your comment about the side and back tone wood not having to be rosewood. Not only is Bubinga similar in qualities to EIR and Cocobolo the "waterfall Bubinga" is visually stunning.

[sinistral]

Originally Posted by Scoobtay

Hello all,

As the title suggests, I am looking to track down a long-term, heirloom-quality dread. I would love to find my way into a vintage Brazilian RW Martin D-28, but this is a task that my wallet and time won't likely allow. With this said, I'm looking for a Pre-War-style Dreadnought with roughly these parameters:

- Adi or Sitka Top
- RW B&S
- 1 3/4 Nut
- Herringbone Binding
- Bone Nut and Saddle

I'm currently leaning pretty heavily towards a Collings D2H, BUT I'm only a few hours away from Preston Thompson...

Ideally I would love to stay under 6k USD but would stretch a little for the best of the best. I know that ultimately I would need to play and compare everything suggested, but don't want to leave any considerations out. I'm not interested in modern Martin stuff at the moment.

Thanks everyone,

When you say you’re looking for a pre-war style dreadnought, do you really mean it, or do you just want a beautifully made, $6k guitar that is in the shape of a dreadnought? If it’s the former, the closest you are going to get is with a used Martin D-28 Authentic, a Custom Shop Expert D-28 Authentic, a (headstock logo-less) Pre-War Guitars Co. HD, the Preston Thompson you mentioned, and some solo luthiers that don’t charge an arm and a leg for their guitars (Matt Arcara and Rufus Thames come to mind).

Of the boutique builders mentioned, the Huss & Dalton, a Collings Traditional. a used Santa Cruz PW/D or a Bourgeois dreadnought are all in the style of a pre-war dreadnought, but each has its own voice as opposed to trying replicate the vintage Martin sound.

I was just in Rudy’s in Scarsdale, and they had versions of many of the above guitars. If you were in Manhattan, you could go to Rudy’s in SoHo and TR Crandall and your head would be spinning. If you don’t have a shop or a couple of shops near you that carry these types of guitars, I highly recommend that you take a trip to a place that does (Nashville, San Francisco, etc.).

You need to play these guitars to understand which one or ones speak to you in terms of tone, neck carve, etc.

[Scoobtay]

Originally Posted by sinistral

When you say you’re looking for a pre-war style dreadnought, do you really mean it, or do you just want a beautifully made, $6k guitar that is in the shape of a dreadnought?

I believe the former. I have had the opportunity to play the big names in the past (Collings, Froggy, Bourgeois, Martin, etc) but only 000’s and OM’s, and to my ear, these old building techniques result in a tone that sounds the best to me.

Modern Martins that I can afford are slightly too woody and dark sounding for me in comparison to the “clearer” and more “separated” tones of the Boutique stuff Ive played in this price range.

[Scoobtay]

Originally Posted by llew

I don't know that you'll find better build quality than a Boucher dread. And they offer EIR, Madagascar, and Braz rosewood. But one of the tone woods that I bought somewhat by happenstance is Bubinga. Boucher builds a Studio Goose (SG-22) in Adirondack/African Bubinga. Just a nod to your comment about the side and back tone wood not having to be rosewood. Not only is Bubinga similar in qualities to EIR and Cocobolo the "waterfall Bubinga" is visually stunning.

The multiple Boucher suggestions in here has caught me off guard. This just wasn’t a name at all that I heard anywhere prior to 2021. This Spruce Goose model (I’m nearby the REAL Spruce Goose) is enticing for the name alone, and is now a serious contender just due to comments like yours.

[Br1ck]

Atkin is another newer brand on the scene. Time will bring notoriety and higher prices will follow. I'm used to the Gryphon newsletter, but other large dealers might have e mail notifications too.

[ataylor]

I went to Nashville this spring and played a lot of guitars in a handful of shops there. My favorite from that trip — and legitimately one of the most impressive guitars I’ve ever played — was a Martin Custom Shop 1937 D-28. I probably should have thrown caution to the wind and taken it home. Oh well!

I guess what I’m trying to say is don’t rule out Martin in this range. Yes, the luthier-built guitars are fantastic and I own one myself. But when the factory-built guitars are done well they are absolutely in the ballpark and sometimes at a lower price point and/or shorter wait time.

[soups]

Why not a Martin d-28 on their authentic line? In my mind, their recent authentics are just as good of not better than pretty much any other boutique brand in the similar price range. Of course this is highly subjective, but i own two martin authentics after many other similarly priced d-28 copies from boutique builders have come and gone. Just food for thought.

[Scoobtay]

Originally Posted by soups

Why not a Martin d-28 on their authentic line? In my mind, their recent authentics are just as good of not better than pretty much any other boutique brand in the similar price range. Of course this is highly subjective, but i own two martin authentics after many other similarly priced d-28 copies from boutique builders have come and gone. Just food for thought.

At the moment, it’s simply because I haven’t enjoyed the Martins I’ve played so far at the same level I’ve enjoyed these newer builders. I also feel like the money goes a little further since with boutiques:

- fewer hands touch the guitar, less room for error
- more skin in the game
- cost of advertising not baked into guitar cost/non-existent
- name on headstock doesn’t add 20%

I’d also prefer to have something less recognizable if possible, flies under the radar a little better.

[Joseph Hanna]

This'll get shot down six ways to Sunday, and I'm okay with that, but if you read up on how these are built, it undoubtedly meets the criteria of Boutique. Just not in the traditional North American way. Either which way, you might be very surprised if you get a chance to play.

Yamaha FG9 R.

[sinistral]

Whatever. If you actually want a guitar that is faithful to the way vintage Martins were built and sound, in your price range, nothing comes close to the Authentics, especially the aged Authentics.

Of the guitars you mentioned, Huss & Dalton is the least recognizable, which is reflected in their poor resale value. Based on your criteria, I would get a used Santa Cruz PW/D. Santa Cruz’s production is fraction of the other small factory/boutique builders. I personally think the D-28 Modern Deluxe competes very favorably with many of the guitars mentioned, for less money.

[Blackmore Fan]

Originally Posted by Glennwillow

Here is a Goodall TRD for sale on Reverb, these are very nice guitars.

- Glenn

I've heard great things about Goodalls!

[mcduffnw]

I have no affiliation with either the seller or the guitar in question...but...

Right now, out on our classified section, forum member matts67 has a Merrill C-18 for sale...which is his version of the Pre-War style Martin D-18...for a price well under your upper range.

Merrill guitars are IMO, as good as it gets in the vintage pre-war Martin repro world. That guitar would definitely give you the vintage look, feel, and tone you are after, and in spades. And under budget for you!

Jim Merrill builds a fabulous pre-war Martin repro guitar. You should seriously give this one a looksee and talk with the seller.

I believe fellow forum member "brencat" would/will back me all the way up on this if he see's this thread. He is a huge Merrill fan and owner/player.

Give it some thought.


duff
Be A Player...Not A Polisher

[bobster7]

Atkin would be my choice (D37 pre-war), dry vintage tone. The H&D TDR is terrific but quite lush sounding to my ears.