Do any of the major builders allow the buyer to supply the wood?

H165 · #1 06-02-2016, 07:40 PM

This question has been bandied about a few times over the life of this and the UMG Forums. I was laughed off the Martin forum about 5 years ago for asking it.

The reason I ask it again now is twofold:

1. To find out if policies and opinions and facts have changed.
2. Because I have some very good wood and am considering a build

Some of the wood I have is Brazilian, and there are limits to what builders will do with undocumented Brazilian. This wood has been in my possession since the 1970s, and was purchased directly from Martin. We know that Martin has changed their policy on using existing Martins of all types to make "new" (conversion) Martins but I am talking about raw wood or wood sets never processed further than thickness sanding.

Let's temporarily define "Majors" as Martin, Guild, Gibson, Taylor" plus the CURRENT (not past) top five custom builders (thus generating a massive squabble over who they are

).

I've been building guitars for about 25 years and I am not included in my top 5. If you're all wondering who my top five are, that's an opinion and you're welcome to express yours, but please let's stipulate that there are many great builders out here and try to stick to the subject please.

So, does anyone know any current facts or policies about the subject?

The Kid! · #2 06-02-2016, 11:50 PM

David Myka

Bruce Sexauer · #3 06-03-2016, 12:18 AM

I imagine that there is no set policy across the spectrum of Luthier's, and would not even try to guess who anyone's top five would be. However, I have a solid policy and have not changed it in many years.

I am happy to build with other people's wood if it is wood I am willing to build with, which it almost never is. If it passes my muster, then it has to be in my shop for a period of time in order to aclimate, and this cannot be a matter of chance, so I treat it as definitely not acclimated; in the case of BRW that'd be six months or so. Then, because the profit that I am not making selling the wood Is a vital part of my business, I charge a "corkage" fee. In the case of BRW that is usually been $500 in the past.

jessupe · #4 06-03-2016, 09:49 AM

yes, the wood in the pic in the custom build gallery of the first 14 string guitar I made is the owners choice....a one piece birdseye maple billet, originally intended for a cello...came from poland, just about shot the postmans spleen out of his side when he was bringing it to the door...

Howard Klepper · #5 06-03-2016, 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by H165

Let's temporarily define "Majors" as Martin, Guild, Gibson, Taylor" plus the CURRENT (not past) top five custom builders (thus generating a massive squabble over who they are

).

That is a strange definition of "majors" in jumping from big factories to individual builders with nothing in between.

I can tell you that none of the factories you named would do it. The best way to find out about the builders on your secret list is to ask them. How is someone here supposed to be able to answer for them if you don't even say who you are asking about?

H165 · #6 06-03-2016, 01:50 PM

Quote:

The best way to find out about the builders on your secret list is to ask them. How is someone here supposed to be able to answer for them if you don't even say who you are asking about?

Hello, Howard. Mea culpa. I'm the first to admit my command of English for clear communication leaves lots of room for criticism. I thought others might be able to answer by having had this discussion or experience with a builder.

I deleted my current 'favorite five' list from my original post #1 To avoid that particular debate. #2 Possibly get others' opinions. #3 Because mine varies from time to time. Some humor comes from the juxtaposition of my deleted list and your perfectly reasonable statement. In the exact originally posted order; Klepper, Sexauer, Olson, Ryan, Thompson.

I do not actually know whether any of the above build custom orders at this time, but I had assumed they might from reading posts here and on another forum.

Quote:

That is a strange definition of "majors" in jumping from big factories to individual builders with nothing in between.

I can't really see how I jumped directly to individual builders, although you can see from my list it's headed that way. Seems to me Goodall, Olson, Collings and SCGC are somewhat "in between" and build custom orders, so I thought I'd left the question wide open.

Well, I've probably scrambled this up even worse now, but I still want whatever info might be out there.

Truckjohn · #7 06-03-2016, 05:08 PM

Right... You got an answer from Bruce... So there's one builder who will not reject it out of hand.

I think the reality is that many luthiers would at least consider it so long as you are not looking for a significant discount because of supplying the wood... It's pretty common to get requests to make instruments out of supplied wood ... But the wood is typically supplied for some sentimental reason rather than fiscal.... If you poke around, you can find some pretty interesting stories..... Such as one I heard about making a guitar out of a piece of the fellow's father's coffin.....

The down side about customer wood is that it's not easy to replace or substitute when something goes awry or it cracks up like crazy when it dries out in the shop.

Thanks.

Howard Klepper · #8 06-03-2016, 05:37 PM

Well, I'm flattered, thanks!

And I didn't get that you were including boutique "factories" among custom builders.

I don't have a fixed rule. I'll listen to the reasons and consider it, but there are lots of potential problems that make me very reluctant, even if the wood appears to meet my standards. Most builders will say that they won't guarantee customer-supplied wood against defects. But how can the customer guarantee the wood to the builder? What I mean is, for example, a side cracks in bending and needs to be replaced. If it's the builder's wood, he or she is responsible and may need to replace whole the wood set. It's not likely that the customer can replace the set. And even if the customer could, what happens to the builder's wasted time?

I do think Bruce's analogy to getting wine in a restaurant is a good one. It helps explain why we charge more than you may see the same kind of wood selling for at a wood retailer. And Bruce is right that the builder needs to charge "corkage" for lost profit. There is one other thing I would toss into the mix: it is considered very gauche to bring into a restaurant--even one that allows outside bottles and charges corkage for them--a bottle that they stock in their own cellar. It smacks of an impolite kind of cheapness.

redir · #9 06-03-2016, 06:14 PM

I once had a commission to build a 5 string and a 4 string bass from a guy who supplied all the wood and even the pickups and hardware. Really top of the line stuff too. I built them and the guy literally disappeared. I really have no idea what happens to him. It's like he died or something. It didn't cost me anything but my time and the bass's ended up selling after 5 years when I finally gave up waiting and 'legally' had the rights to do so.

I know it has nothing to do with the OP but just thought I would share

Truckjohn · #10 06-03-2016, 06:33 PM

While I totally get Howard's comment... I think I would be reluctant to trust my own BRW to someone who never worked with it. It's so expensive anymore that I would have a hard time turning it over to somebody to use as an experiment/learning experience. (Full disclosure - I don't own any...).

I would be less hesitant with easily sourced/more common woods... I wouldn't worry too much about letting somebody experiment with oak or cherry or some such.