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Old 09-22-2018, 04:10 PM
Sponserv Sponserv is offline
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Default Diatonic scales shapes

I have a two part question. Apologies up front if to some of you it seems like a no brainer.

1. If I know one major scale pattern will it transfer anywhere on the neck and differ in that whatever the first note I play is the root?

2. If I am trying to figure out a solo or melody and I know the key its in can I use this diatonic scale in that key to patiently figure out the riff?
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Old 09-22-2018, 04:23 PM
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rick-slo rick-slo is offline
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More or less when you avoid open strings. Also riffs, melody lines, etc. often include chromatic notes.
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Old 09-22-2018, 06:09 PM
FwL FwL is offline
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You'll be in the ballpark in both cases.

1. Depending on the scale pattern you learn and how you learn to play the pattern, the first note isn't necessarily the root. Whichever note in the pattern is the root will determine the key of the scale as you move that pattern around to different locations on the fingerboard.

2. If the melody sticks to the key signature, you should be able to work it out in whatever pattern you know. Ideally, you would also know at least one pattern for the other commonly used scales. Better still is to use your ear to figure out where the notes are and then figure out which scale those notes fit.

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Old 09-24-2018, 03:18 AM
EMLPicks EMLPicks is offline
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The one caveat to the first point is that if you move a shape across strings, you may have to adjust the shape to compensate for the major third tuning between the G and B strings
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Old 09-24-2018, 03:51 AM
JonPR JonPR is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sponserv View Post
I have a two part question. Apologies up front if to some of you it seems like a no brainer.

1. If I know one major scale pattern will it transfer anywhere on the neck and differ in that whatever the first note I play is the root?
Nope. I.e., yes, one major scale pattern will transfer (and become other major scales in the process), but the first note you play could be anything. It doesn't have to be the lowest note either.
It's important to know which note is which in every pattern. Mainly which note is the keynote (tonic) of the relative major scale, but that all the other notes can be chord roots, and most of them can be modal centres too. Most importantly, learn to see all the chord shapes (arpeggios) within every major scale pattern; every pattern contains seven chords, either as full shapes or as arpeggio patterns.
Also learn how to fit scales around chord shapes - or rather how to form a scale out of a group of chords in a sequence, by superimposing the shapes on one another.
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Originally Posted by Sponserv View Post
2. If I am trying to figure out a solo or melody and I know the key its in can I use this diatonic scale in that key to patiently figure out the riff?
Yes. But actually knowing the key is kind of irrelevant. You can figure out a solo or riff note-by-note directly. Chord sequences too. No need to identify what key (or mode) those notes might belong to.
Usually the key is obvious - the "home" note of the whole song or riff - but sometimes it's ambiguous. It doesn't matter either way, you just need to get the notes right; one by one.

In fact, one problem with knowing the key beforehand is it can prejudice your judgement. You might hear a note and think it can't be that because it doesn't fit the key. You might think your ears are playing tricks. Or there might be a very hard-to-hear chord, and you let your theory knowledge (of the key) determine the most likely answer. Don't do that! It always has to be your ear. Your theory knowledge is likely to be incomplete - unaware of all the possibilities - while your ear is always right. That is, you can use theory to guide you to the ballpark, but don't let it dictate details.
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Old 09-25-2018, 05:23 AM
SunnyDee SunnyDee is offline
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I would answer number 1 a little differently. It depends on what you mean by pattern. If you mean the W W H W W W H type of pattern, I'd say, yes. People usually talk about "shape" as in where do you put your fingers and talk about it like it's important to practice moving your fingers in a certain way so you can do it quickly, but I think that's what makes beginners think they have to learn lots of different shapes.

I preferred to learn the relatively few shapes of intervals that are practical and common to play on and across the strings (minor 3rd, major 3rd, 5th, etc) and then I can play any scale pattern, in any key, anywhere on the fretboard, without memorizing certain shapes. This way is easier, too, I think, when it comes to adjusting to the interval for the B string. I'm not doing any shredding this way, but that was never my goal.
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Old 09-25-2018, 07:16 PM
Davis Webb Davis Webb is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMLPicks View Post
The one caveat to the first point is that if you move a shape across strings, you may have to adjust the shape to compensate for the major third tuning between the G and B strings
This....important caveat.
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