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Old 03-29-2018, 07:37 PM
David Rock David Rock is offline
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Default Guitar Zero...

Hello all:

Not 'guitar hero'...'Guitar Zero'...

I recently finished a book called Guitar Zero (Gary Marcus). It is a quick read with little to do about nothing (so to speak). It does have some interesting stuff worth the read. The gist of the book is related to the brainyisms of 'older people' learning music. I've been playing for 20 years now and hope some day to 'get it'. Yes, I am still searching.

Of note on pages 171-172 Gary Marcus congeals the following: "...Whereas errors of novices may be all over the map, errors of experts tend to be of three main types..."

(Not quotes)
1. Simple mistake: "slip of the fingers".

2. Anticipation error: "sort of like saying "I took the store" instead of "I took the car to the store"."

3. Semantic substitution error: playing another note out of melody, but in key (compared to beginners playing whatever the heck comes under their fingers).

I am guessing this all makes me a regular novice expert, or maybe an expert novice.

Another note in this is that a "good" teacher will identify your faults or weaknesses and will make learning fun! (Ouch! Yeah, I want to know and talk in detail about all my weaknesses! What fun. I can't wait till next week.)

Let us all keep learning however we can. Why the heck not? This book is worth the read if for no other reason than to help understand why something so simple can be so hard (at least for me).

Peace,
D
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Old 03-30-2018, 02:34 PM
Johnny K Johnny K is offline
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I thought it was pretty good. But I got the audio book on Audible. The author read it and he had some clips of him playing his guitar too. So he did learn something and so did I.
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Old 03-30-2018, 03:57 PM
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rick-slo rick-slo is offline
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Very iffy. His background is psychology apparently. Does he play guitar? - could not find any videos of him doing so.
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Old 04-01-2018, 08:09 AM
SunnyDee SunnyDee is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rick-slo View Post
Very iffy. His background is psychology apparently. Does he play guitar? - could not find any videos of him doing so.
The point was that he didn't play guitar. He was documenting his learning process, so not supposed to have expertise in that field.

I thought it was interesting. Also used the audiobook. It confirmed for me a lot of what I was seeing learning as a novice adult, especially how the process was very similar to learning a new language as an adult (as in what the OP described among other things). He did have access to a lot of great teachers, though, which I thought made his story a bit less accessible for people who don't. But, still interesting.
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Old 04-01-2018, 10:53 PM
funkapus funkapus is offline
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I read this book a few years ago. I was drawn to it because of the author's perspectives as both an adult learner and as an amateur, two things that applied to me. I found it an enjoyable read, but I wouldn't give it more than three stars out of five. My problem with the book is that it spends a lot of time discussing the study of learning, especially adult learning, in a way that suggests some things are settled questions or are resolved/understood when they aren't. As a working scientist myself, I found the facile (and possibly misleading) way in which some things were addressed frustrating. At the same time, though, there was a lot in his descriptions of his efforts to learn guitar that I could recognize in my own struggles, and that was entertaining enough to make the book worthwhile.
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Old 04-01-2018, 11:17 PM
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rick-slo rick-slo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SunnyDee View Post
The point was that he didn't play guitar. He was documenting his learning process, so not supposed to have expertise in that field.
Yes, was just checking, and as I thought since I did not agree with any of the 1-2-3 mentioned.
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Old 08-13-2018, 07:47 AM
beninma beninma is offline
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I got this book for my birthday last month. I just finished reading it yesterday.

I found it got fairly obnoxious and almost put it down.

It was starting off well with his personal experiences.. but then it got very annoying in a typical psychology way.. it turned into him lecturing about a bunch of stuff in a pop-psych way from a professorial/expert viewpoint on a subject he just finished telling you he was no expert at. And meanwhile he is constantly reminding you about how privileged he is to have an academic position that pays him to go learn guitar full time for 2 years and he is constantly name dropping all these famous players/teachers he dropped in on.

The way he talks about things that are settled when they are really not strikes me as common in many areas of psychology.
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Old 08-16-2018, 10:44 AM
tbeltrans tbeltrans is offline
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For folks interested in learning and playing music as an adult, there are much better books that are a good and interesting read:

Never Too Late by John Holt:

https://www.amazon.com/Never-Too-Lat...4437409&sr=8-1

Play It Again by Alan Rushbridger:

https://www.amazon.com/Play-Again-Am...ESAV25AZP3XWGQ

Piano Lessons by Noah Adams (the PBS "All Things Considered" guy):

https://www.amazon.com/Piano-Lessons...79ZWGSG66GC3Y6

Making Music For the Joy Of It by Stephanie Judy:

https://www.amazon.com/Making-Music-...+the+joy+of+it

...to name a few. These are not specifically (or even) about guitar, but the instrument is not nearly as important as the whole idea and experience regardless of instrument.

Tony
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Old 08-17-2018, 06:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beninma View Post
I got this book for my birthday last month. I just finished reading it yesterday.

I found it got fairly obnoxious and almost put it down.

It was starting off well with his personal experiences.. but then it got very annoying in a typical psychology way.. it turned into him lecturing about a bunch of stuff in a pop-psych way from a professorial/expert viewpoint on a subject he just finished telling you he was no expert at. And meanwhile he is constantly reminding you about how privileged he is to have an academic position that pays him to go learn guitar full time for 2 years and he is constantly name dropping all these famous players/teachers he dropped in on.

The way he talks about things that are settled when they are really not strikes me as common in many areas of psychology.
I had a similar experience in that it really had my interest for a awhile but then it just seemed to bog down because the author seemed to do too much bloviating and it got........boring.
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