Osmo Oil finish

[fregly]

I have commisioned a build with a luthier who uses osmo oil as finish. What are the thoughts on this? He can achieve a very low mass application with it. I believe he used to do french polish and then uv poly, and seems to be moving towards the oil finish unless customers want glossy. For me my main concern is the most sound tranparent finish, whatever it is, and I assume this to be french polish.

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by fregly

I have commisioned a build with a luthier who uses osmo oil as finish. What are the thoughts on this? He can achieve a very low mass application with it. I believe he used to do french polish and then uv poly, and seems to be moving towards the oil finish unless customers want glossy. For me my main concern is the most sound tranparent finish, whatever it is, and I assume this to be french polish.

I've been using Osmo PolyX oil on my last several instruments, mostly as a neck finish. Do note that Osmo is available in different ranges from satin to gloss. I much prefer satin neck finishes and I'm pretty hooked on the feel of Osmo PolyX satin for the neck. A lot of folks are scared away by the moniker of "oil finish". This is an entirely different animal, and I encourage anyone to pick up a tiny can and test it for themselves. This ain't your daddy's "oil finish" and has been in common use for many years as a floor finish throughout Europe. It is fairly expensive, but worth the cost.

I've been experimenting with a few of the European hard oils and found Osmo the best for me. I love it as a neck finish, but prefer a bit tougher finish on bodies.

"Sound transparent" finishes can be the result of several types of materials, but generally the thinner the finish the better. You have to reach a happy medium between what's considered protective and what effects the body the least acoustically.

Here's an example of my last guitar with Osmo PolyX neck finish and a standard poly finish body.

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=578582

[justonwo]

If you’ve already commissioned the build and you don’t trust the builder’s judgement about the finish, things aren’t off to a good start. I think finish work is an important part of the build, and it’s one where you really need to trust the builder knows what they’re doing.

[Bruce Sexauer]

Rubbed oil finishes are generally frowned on in our industry, but technology is ever changing and the past is not always a reliable indicator. The main reason for this distrust is likely that since the oil penetrates the surface it alters the very nature of the wood. Most of us put a lot of energy into the wood, and altering a relevant percentage that makes us squirm. I have not seen this version of oil, and it will be interesting to hear what you think of it when the time comes.

[runamuck]

Originally Posted by fregly

I have commisioned a build with a luthier who uses osmo oil as finish. What are the thoughts on this? He can achieve a very low mass application with it. I believe he used to do french polish and then uv poly, and seems to be moving towards the oil finish unless customers want glossy. For me my main concern is the most sound tranparent finish, whatever it is, and I assume this to be french polish.

Osmo is a penetrating oil with wax in it, from what I recall. I've never used such a thing on a guitar top, back or sides and it seems most reputable builders don't either.

[fregly]

Are there not other penetrating finishes used generally, or is osmo in a category of different effect? Charles Tauber made a post here at one point listing surface finishes vs penetrating finishes. Is not the only issue whatever has lowest mass (and yes looks).

[fregly]

Deleted......

[fregly]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

I've been using Osmo PolyX oil on my last several instruments, mostly as a neck finish. Do note that Osmo is available in different ranges from satin to gloss. I much prefer satin neck finishes and I'm pretty hooked on the feel of Osmo PolyX satin for the neck. A lot of folks are scared away by the moniker of "oil finish". This is an entirely different animal, and I encourage anyone to pick up a tiny can and test it for themselves. This ain't your daddy's "oil finish" and has been in common use for many years as a floor finish throughout Europe. It is fairly expensive, but worth the cost.

I've been experimenting with a few of the European hard oils and found Osmo the best for me. I love it as a neck finish, but prefer a bit tougher finish on bodies.

"Sound transparent" finishes can be the result of several types of materials, but generally the thinner the finish the better. You have to reach a happy medium between what's considered protective and what effects the body the least acoustically.

Here's an example of my last guitar with Osmo PolyX neck finish and a standard poly finish body.

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=578582

The satin you use here is the one in question. Do you see any reason not to use it on the body -- how is it different from traditional oils?

[Rudy4]

Originally Posted by fregly

The satin you use here is the one in question. Do you see any reason not to use it on the body -- how is it different from traditional oils?

Osmo, Rubio Monocoat, Pallmann, and other brands of "hard oils" are a different class of finish than simple penetrating finishes. They are designed to penetrate, but also bond with the cell walls of wood to create a much more robust protective outer layer than what can be achieved with other oil products.

They are unique in their protective abilities but they absolutely do not protect against mechanical damage to the same degree as a tougher topical finish such as lacquer or varnish. The other feature that has to be considered when choosing a hard oil finish is that there is NO ability to "build" a protective surface thickness. The manufacturers stress that it is impossible to use additional layers, and there is NO ability to increase the level of protection beyond the single layer that bonds to the cell walls of the wood it is applied to.

Rubio "Monocoat" even spells it out in their name! Rubio states that a hard oil cannot stick to itself, so any attempt at using another coat will simply wipe off.

Hard oils do an excellent job of forming a THIN bonded long-lasting protective surface on the wood, but offer little protection against mechanical wear.

What you decide on for your custom ordered instrument should be the result of discussions with the builder and how comfortable you are after researching the potential advantages and/or pitfalls of using any given finish.

There are lots of review sites for hard oil floor finishes, among the best is the complete reviews of several hard oils by Naperville Hardwood Flooring.

Hopefully you'll love your custom built instrument and it will bring you many years of joy. I've been building instruments for close to 50 years and I'm sold on Osmo PolyX oil, at least for a neck finish.

[fregly]

Originally Posted by Rudy4

Osmo, Rubio Monocoat, Pallmann, and other brands of "hard oils" are a different class of finish than simple penetrating finishes. They are designed to penetrate, but also bond with the cell walls of wood to create a much more robust protective outer layer than what can be achieved with other oil products.

They are unique in their protective abilities but they absolutely do not protect against mechanical damage to the same degree as a tougher topical finish such as lacquer or varnish. The other feature that has to be considered when choosing a hard oil finish is that there is NO ability to "build" a protective surface thickness. The manufacturers stress that it is impossible to use additional layers, and there is NO ability to increase the level of protection beyond the single layer that bonds to the cell walls of the wood it is applied to.

Rubio "Monocoat" even spells it out in their name! Rubio states that a hard oil cannot stick to itself, so any attempt at using another coat will simply wipe off.

Hard oils do an excellent job of forming a THIN bonded long-lasting protective surface on the wood, but offer little protection against mechanical wear.

What you decide on for your custom ordered instrument should be the result of discussions with the builder and how comfortable you are after researching the potential advantages and/or pitfalls of using any given finish.

There are lots of review sites for hard oil floor finishes, among the best is the complete reviews of several hard oils by Naperville Hardwood Flooring.

Hopefully you'll love your custom built instrument and it will bring you many years of joy. I've been building instruments for close to 50 years and I'm sold on Osmo PolyX oil, at least for a neck finish.

Thankyou Rudy, very informative.

[J Patrick]

….I used OSMO on a recent electric partscaster build…I applied it to a redwood telecaster body that I sourced from Marc Rutters…..I used the satin version…very easy to apply and dried fairly hard….darkens wood quite noticeably…which also highlights wood grain…

….I like it on my partscaster ok but I do prefer a sprayed nitro finish…

….

[Dustinfurlow]

I've played a couple guitars with Osmo oil finish and the sound of them didn't make me feel anything was lacking but it wasn't my preferred finish on the neck as it felt a bit draggy, but this could've been from how the finish was applied and whether or not it was done well (enough coats, enough sanding, I have not the slightest clue). Just my personal experience.

[Robin, Wales]

Dare I say that I have actually used this kitchen surface OSMO Top Oil for dulcimers and fretted zithers that I have made. The dulcimers were a batch in plywood for running workshops and the fretted zithers were my own instruments for gigs made from repurposed mahogany windowsills. You can spill beer on it or unwrap your fish and chips on it and use your instruments as a table! It is food safe and kid safe. I use it for the toys and furniture I make for the grandchildren too.

Joking apart, you can rub on a very thin layer or two and it gives all the protection needed for a "working" item. It is much quicker drying than other oils I have used and doesn't seem to need as much UV exposure to go hard. It brings out the grain nicely.

I have no idea how it would behave itself sonically for guitar making but if I was making a "campfire" or open mic' workhorse guitar then I'd have a think about using something from the OSMO brand (I'm not capable of making a high end instrument anyway!). And I'm sure that a luthier who has experimented with the OSMO products for necks and bodies would be able to give some good reasons for using them.

[IndianHillMike]

Originally Posted by Dustinfurlow

I've played a couple guitars with Osmo oil finish and the sound of them didn't make me feel anything was lacking but it wasn't my preferred finish on the neck as it felt a bit draggy, but this could've been from how the finish was applied and whether or not it was done well (enough coats, enough sanding, I have not the slightest clue). Just my personal experience.

Probably too many coats or not sanded/wiped down enough -- an OSMO'd neck should feel very very smooth. If there is any drag, some very fine steel wool should take care of it.