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Old 09-25-2021, 07:16 PM
docyoung docyoung is offline
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Default McPherson Touring vs Journey OF660

I tried the search function and couldn't come with an answer. I have played a CG in about 8 years, a Rainsong years ago. So I want a short scale 24.5 inches or less. Looking for those of you that have opinion/knowledge which one, pro and cons. Me straight up fingerstyle player with some strumming little use of the pick which could change with practice. Different types of music from jazz, classical, blues, ballads, cowboy, old finger picking songs and modern ones too. Whatever my fancy just a nonprofessional player for serious fun. And if you think I missed it you can throw up the table another choice. Hope this wouldn't bore you. Just a retired guy looking to pick a guitar. Not super important if it breaks down to pack away. They both pretty small.

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Doc
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Old 09-25-2021, 07:47 PM
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Doc;

You've mentioned the polar regions of CF guitars. I think you'll find considerable difference in quality between the two guitars. Your best bet may be to wander through the numerous reviews for both guitars mentioned in the search sites mentioned on this forum.

If you have a price point in mind that would help in response to your question.

If you're just looking at the wide range available then you have to check out the big three: Rainsong, Emerald, Blackbird.
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Old 09-25-2021, 08:02 PM
Jeff350 Jeff350 is offline
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I have an Emerald X7 and an OF660. If the ability to break down isn’t a consideration, I’d choose the X7 every time. I really do love the OF660 but the Emerald is really next level.

Both are super comfortable, small bodies, short scales. The short scales are so nice to play I have to make an effort to keep my X20 in the rotation. [emoji1787]
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Old 09-26-2021, 01:41 AM
docyoung docyoung is offline
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You make a good point about the price high end might be $3000 or less.

Last edited by docyoung; 09-26-2021 at 02:17 AM.
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Old 09-26-2021, 02:05 AM
docyoung docyoung is offline
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Originally Posted by EvanB View Post
Doc;

You've mentioned the polar regions of CF guitars. I think you'll find considerable difference in quality between the two guitars. Your best bet may be to wander through the numerous reviews for both guitars mentioned in the search sites mentioned on this forum.

If you have a price point in mind that would help in response to your question.

If you're just looking at the wide range available then you have to check out the big three: Rainsong, Emerald, Blackbird.
You have a some good points. The price point is probably less than $3000 except the most money isn't necessary the right guitar. I'm not a collector. I'm home player. My dogs howl and sing with my guitar and harmonica. Looks are last, tone is boxy or clean into 12 or 13, playability, ergonomics neck mostly, short scale equal or less than 24.5. I have run the threads and read posts. I have watched many videos about Klos, Lava 2, No to both, touring, Little Jane (nice not CG), Journey of660, a few Emerald X-7 (short scale), no Blackbird or Rainsong (maybe too crystal/glassy). Kramster makes some of the best demos of CG guitars. Where does he get those models? I want the feel and close sound to acoustic guitar small body parlor or 01, no OM or dreds. I love music all kinds.
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Old 09-26-2021, 02:14 AM
docyoung docyoung is offline
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Originally Posted by Jeff350 View Post
I have an Emerald X7 and an OF660. If the ability to break down isn’t a consideration, I’d choose the X7 every time. I really do love the OF660 but the Emerald is really next level.

Both are super comfortable, small bodies, short scales. The short scales are so nice to play I have to make an effort to keep my X20 in the rotation. [emoji1787]
So Jeff you are saying has better tone or is it the built materials are better?
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Old 09-26-2021, 05:29 AM
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Methos1979 Methos1979 is offline
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Since you mention comfort as a factor and playing at home (so no travel) I'd say Emerald X7. Small body, short scale, extremely comfortable and great tone. Also, tons of options for colors and even more cool woody tops if you are will to pay or keep an eye out for a used one. I've owned many an Emerald and they are great guitars. I've never owned the McPherson Touring model but I bet it sounds very good as well. I have owned a couple Journey OF660's and they were also great guitars. If you ever plan to travel, especially by plane, then the OF660 is the winner hands down. For the best amplified tone and a more classic look, then the new RainSong Vintage series with the genuine spruce infused tops are great looking (in a more conventional, wood guitar way) and sound great. The wood fused top brings a significant warmth to the guitars and the LR Baggs Anthem StagePro pickup systems are the best I've played short of my Cole Clark guitars. Sounds like you don't plan to play amplified though so you could always get a non-pickup model and save a few bucks. The street price on a new one would be just under $3k. The Shorty model scale is technically a little longer than 24.5" but because it's a 12 fret neck on a 14 fret body, it feels and plays like a much shorter scale. That along with the thinner body makes it feel smaller but with a bigger sound. Of all the CF guitars I've owned, the RainSong Nashville OM Shorty is my all-time favorite for tone. Emerald wins for ergonomics and looks. OF660 wins for travel.
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Old 09-26-2021, 07:08 AM
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The McPherson Touring is a very nice small guitar. The emphasis on small: it has a 22 3/4" scale, which is bordering on too small for my tastes... and I like small, comfortable guitars. The OF660 is hard to beat if you need to fly a lot, but sacrifices tone and volume (to my ear) for the "break down" convenience.

The Emerald X7 has a 24" scale, but doesn't feel cramped due to the 1 3/4" nut width, and sounds great. I have a previous generation X7 that is a smaller body than the current model - the ergonomics on that guitar are truly amazing. The X7 (new) would be within your budget, depending on how you option it out. Used ones do pop up on occasion, but generally move fast.

The shortest scale RainSong is still over your desired scale length. The NS (24.875" scale) is their shorter scale; I find that neck profile pretty "chunky."

For what you're looking for in a guitar, I'd suggest the Emerald X7 or the Touring. Both are very nice guitars. In a similar price range (again, depending on how it is optioned out). You may find a Touring in stock at some McPherson dealers, but looking at Emerald's current in stock offerings, I am only seeing one X7 and it is a 12-string. If you are willing to wait for a build, you can order one out just the way you want. Check out Emerald's 3D builder on their site.
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Old 09-26-2021, 08:04 AM
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The X7 seems to be the best fit for the desired instrument.

I would also suggest a Blackbird Savoy. The Savoy is a superb but fairly rare instrument. I know there was one on the used market for around $1,800 (for a $3,000 guitar).
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Old 09-26-2021, 10:00 AM
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I can't speak to the X7 but it is definitely on my radar as a fuller sounding companion the the OF660. Initially my two main criticisms of the Journey have been remedied. The first was that the guitar was on the quiet side, the second was the brass frets.

The first issue was remedied to my satisfaction once I found some good loud strings and have found finger picks and a thumb pick that help immensely. I've also bought a Sagework which has both lifted the Journey off my lap and angles it in such a way that the sound hole is closer to my ears and slightly tilted toward my chest. The guitar is actually louder for me now than the Touring. My kids also complain that I'm playing too loud sometimes, so perspective isn't just mine. Is the tone of the OF660 as good as the Touring? No. But the tone of the Touring to my ears isn't $1700 better either, so there is that.

As for the frets, they felt gritty against the strings when bending. However after taking 0000 steel wool to them and giving them a good polish that has gone away. The brass also seems like a harder material than the nickel wire used on RainSongs. After 3 years of it being my primary player it is still a long way off from a refret. Nice.

If it were stolen I'd buy another.
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Old 09-26-2021, 01:05 PM
Jeff350 Jeff350 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by docyoung View Post
So Jeff you are saying has better tone or is it the built materials are better?

To my ear I do like the tone of the emerald better. It may have something to do with the angled sound hole on the X7. I only play for myself (and poorly at that) so I can’t say how if it sounds differently to the listener.

The build quality on the Emerald definitely is better, and the various curves/bevels make it just super comfortable. I love the cutaway neck joint on the X7. The OF660 really is well made for its price point though. The removable neck system is super cool.
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Old 09-26-2021, 04:39 PM
docyoung docyoung is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Jim View Post
The McPherson Touring is a very nice small guitar. The emphasis on small: it has a 22 3/4" scale, which is bordering on too small for my tastes... and I like small, comfortable guitars. The OF660 is hard to beat if you need to fly a lot, but sacrifices tone and volume (to my ear) for the "break down" convenience.

The Emerald X7 has a 24" scale, but doesn't feel cramped due to the 1 3/4" nut width, and sounds great. I have a previous generation X7 that is a smaller body than the current model - the ergonomics on that guitar are truly amazing. The X7 (new) would be within your budget, depending on how you option it out. Used ones do pop up on occasion, but generally move fast.

The shortest scale RainSong is still over your desired scale length. The NS (24.875" scale) is their shorter scale; I find that neck profile pretty "chunky."

For what you're looking for in a guitar, I'd suggest the Emerald X7 or the Touring. Both are very nice guitars. In a similar price range (again, depending on how it is optioned out). You may find a Touring in stock at some McPherson dealers, but looking at Emerald's current in stock offerings, I am only seeing one X7 and it is a 12-string. If you are willing to wait for a build, you can order one out just the way you want. Check out Emerald's 3D builder on their site.
Thanks Jim for your assessment. I agree with the Rainsong your assessment of the neck. How the scale length comes into play is mostly pure physics. Scale length and mostly string gauge not frets to the neck rules how much force it takes to play the neck. Hence I need the less force to play the neck so I can sort of manhandle the guitar finger style. I have hands actually smaller than most women let alone men, Lol coming from an ex-fighter. I have a Franklin aka Nick guitar at 24.9 love it. I have a 64 Gibson L00 24.75, we can Tango. When I get just a little shorter I can dance all night. However I discovered by going on site that I can get any model of Emerald guitar in a 24.5 scale length at no extra cost, wow! On the wood side I have been looking at Santa Cruise Firefly and Collings 1 or 2H Parlor guitar which I favor for tone. Don't know how the Collings Parlor sound for strumming does it get too tinny or boxy over the 10th frets or higher.

Last edited by docyoung; 09-26-2021 at 05:55 PM. Reason: Added clarity
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Old 09-26-2021, 04:53 PM
Captain Jim Captain Jim is offline
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Originally Posted by docyoung View Post
Thanks Jim for your assessment. I agree with the Rainsong your assessment of the neck. How the scale length comes into play is mostly pure physics. Scale length and mostly string gauge not frets to the neck rules how much force it takes to play the neck. Hence I need the less force to play the neck so I can sort of manhandle the guitar finger style. I have hands actually smaller than most women let alone men, Lol coming from an ex-fighter. I have a Franklin aka Nick guitar at 24.9 love it. I have a 64 Gibson L00 24.75, we can Tango. When I get just a little shorter I can dance all night. However I discovered by going on site that I can get any model of Emerald guitar in a 24.5 scale length at no extra cost, wow! On the wood side I have been looking at Santa Cruise Firefly and Collings 1 or 2H Parlor guitar which I favor for wood.
You might have to point out where "on Emerald's site you can get any model of Emerald guitar in a 24.5" scale length at no extra cost." Not saying things haven't changed, but I paid $400 additional when I ordered my X10 (right after they first came out) to get a 24.6" scale instead of the standard 25.5". I looked on their site after reading your post, but couldn't find that... of course, I am a guy, and as my wife frequently points out: can't find anything. Well, those aren't the words she used, but I try to follow the rules here.

-------

OK, I see that now on Emerald's site. Checking a couple different models, I see there is some price difference, but not as much $$ as in the past.
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Last edited by Captain Jim; 09-26-2021 at 05:14 PM.
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Old 09-26-2021, 06:01 PM
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Base price for an X7 is $1950.

Changing the scale length to either 23.5” or 24.5” bumps the price to $2400. Unfortunately, the builder doesn’t currently allow you to back it out the standard 24” - a bug which Mr. Hay acknowledged in an earlier thread.
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Old 09-26-2021, 07:13 PM
docyoung docyoung is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Jim View Post
You might have to point out where "on Emerald's site you can get any model of Emerald guitar in a 24.5" scale length at no extra cost." Not saying things haven't changed, but I paid $400 additional when I ordered my X10 (right after they first came out) to get a 24.6" scale instead of the standard 25.5". I looked on their site after reading your post, but couldn't find that... of course, I am a guy, and as my wife frequently points out: can't find anything. Well, those aren't the words she used, but I try to follow the rules here.

-------

OK, I see that now on Emerald's site. Checking a couple different models, I see there is some price difference, but not as much $$ as in the past.
Get on the site got explore models pick one. Then you get choice to customize it or check current stock . Jim go to customizing the guitar and then go scale length where they have a variety of scale lengths with check boxes. Actually they do charge $100 from 25 to 24.5. I had to move the checks around and watch at the top to get the price change. $100 for me no problem at all. Try it my directions and see if it gets you there. I tried a variety of models except X7 dah and could change all of them to24.5.
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