The Acoustic Guitar Forum

Go Back   The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Acoustic Amplification

Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #31  
Old 10-11-2017, 06:02 AM
Murphy Slaw Murphy Slaw is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Southern Illinois
Posts: 2,974
Default

Hate to hear this, I've owned and used an AG100D for well over a decade, probably closer to 15 years.

And an R1000 / 4;10 bass rig.

I also have a friend / business partner with a ton of Carvin p.a. gear and we use it all the time.

And so it goes....
__________________
The Murph Channel

http://www.youtube.com/channel/UCkomGsMJXH9qn-xLKCv4WOg
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 10-11-2017, 06:48 AM
Chriscom's Avatar
Chriscom Chriscom is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Northern Virginia/DC/USA
Posts: 1,792
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Yeah - whenever someone closes a shop, the first thing some people want to blame is high costs, over-regulation, taxes, environmental, whatever - none of which explains why California is the 6th strongest economy in the world, and the only state to be listed among the worlds top economic engines.

They closed because they didn't want to try to make and sell amps - but they like making guitars. Always a good idea to do what you like, especially if you can make money at it -
Well as has been pointed out, there were two different "theys."

Besides that, without a doubt, California has a gargantuan economy, but to some extent it's coasting at this point. It's an entirely uncontroversial fact in the business world, verified by publicly available statistics, that companies have been leaving California in recent years, primarily due to high regulation and taxes. The same goes for migration between the states--more people have left California for other states than vice-versa.

That's the overall trend--it will vary across business sectors. I don't know enough about amps and such, but given the insanely low production prices in Asia, it strikes me that Carvin may have been located in one of the worst states to have a fighting chance in the long run.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 10-11-2017, 07:18 AM
KevWind's Avatar
KevWind KevWind is online now
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Edge of Wilderness Wyoming
Posts: 19,878
Default

Wow that's a shame, it appeared that Carvin had carved a niche for themselves.
No doubt there are numerous factors involved personal as well as business , known and unknown
Attempting to sight one aspect seems a bit like ill-informed conjecture , and cliche'
__________________
Enjoy the Journey.... Kev...

KevWind at Soundcloud

KevWind at YouYube
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD

System :
Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1

Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Ventura 12.2.1

Last edited by KevWind; 10-11-2017 at 12:39 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 10-11-2017, 07:46 AM
rmsstrider rmsstrider is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Here and there, currently Chesapeake bay
Posts: 1,077
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PorkPieGuy View Post
Just heard the news that after 70 years in business, Carvin is going out of business. I think they will keep the guitar shop open, but as far as amplification is concerned, well, they are liquidating right now.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AJ92u5bWoP4


Right now, pretty much everything is 25% off.

https://carvinaudio.com/
Wow, sorry to hear this. I have used their powered speakers in the past and was very pleased.
The liquidation sale going on is sad, but some excellent equipment available .
__________________
Couple of CF guitars, Couple of wood guitars
Bunch of other stuff.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 10-12-2017, 01:20 AM
ricdoug ricdoug is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Vista (North County San Diego), California USA
Posts: 824
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by tadol View Post
Yeah - whenever someone closes a shop, the first thing some people want to blame is high costs, over-regulation, taxes, environmental, whatever - none of which explains why California is the 6th strongest economy in the world, and the only state to be listed among the worlds top economic engines.

They closed because they didn't want to try to make and sell amps - but they like making guitars. Always a good idea to do what you like, especially if you can make money at it -
Ball ****. My best friend is Ford's product trainer Todd Cameron who is a race car driver and an international Ford Product trainer who races and lives right here in San Diego and is best friends with Carvin Guitars co-owner/race car driver Jeff Keisel. Get your unsupported facts straight or stop flapping your soup cooler. Ric
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 10-12-2017, 01:26 AM
ricdoug ricdoug is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Vista (North County San Diego), California USA
Posts: 824
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ricdoug View Post
Ball ****. My best friend is Ford's product trainer Todd Cameron who is a race car driver and an international Ford Product trainer who races and lives right here in San Diego and is best friends with Carvin Guitars co-owner/race car driver Jeff Keisel. Get your unsupported facts straight or stop flapping your soup cooler. Ric
I am a retired Marine and Ford Fleet Manager who has lived and worked in Carlsbad North County San Diego for the same Ford franchised dealership for over 23 years that is calling you on your completely unsupported claims. Ric Douglas, USMC Retired
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 10-12-2017, 01:29 AM
ricdoug ricdoug is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Vista (North County San Diego), California USA
Posts: 824
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscom View Post
Well as has been pointed out, there were two different "theys."

Besides that, without a doubt, California has a gargantuan economy, but to some extent it's coasting at this point. It's an entirely uncontroversial fact in the business world, verified by publicly available statistics, that companies have been leaving California in recent years, primarily due to high regulation and taxes. The same goes for migration between the states--more people have left California for other states than vice-versa.

That's the overall trend--it will vary across business sectors. I don't know enough about amps and such, but given the insanely low production prices in Asia, it strikes me that Carvin may have been located in one of the worst states to have a fighting chance in the long run.
Fact! just look at creedmooresports.com
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 10-12-2017, 11:56 AM
GmanJeff GmanJeff is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Great Falls, VA
Posts: 498
Default

It's always disappointing to see a formerly successful business fail, for whatever reason. I'd think that the guitar/bass business has a niche with much less competition as compared to the separate amp/speaker/PA gear business. Keisel allows a tremendous amount of customization, unlike most other guitar/bass manufacturers, whereas Carvin produces products which aren't functionally or cosmetically too different from what is offered by numerous competitors. Further, Carvin's direct-sale model, and absence of local service locations for most buyers, makes it difficult to test-drive their products or to have them serviced, which is a disincentive for some prospective buyers who can also pick from alternatives readily available locally.

It is not improbable that their costs of doing business are also much higher than those incurred by competitors who manufacture elsewhere, making competitive pricing along with reasonable margins a challenge when they are competing for the mass market rather than with the boutique brands which can charge more.
__________________
Jeff
www.engine14.com
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 10-12-2017, 12:06 PM
Uncle Pauhana Uncle Pauhana is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 610
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by GmanJeff View Post
<snip>I'd think that the guitar/bass business has a niche with much less competition as compared to the separate amp/speaker/PA gear business. Keisel allows a tremendous amount of customization, unlike most other guitar/bass manufacturers, whereas Carvin produces products which aren't functionally or cosmetically too different from what is offered by numerous competitors.<snip>
Kiesel Guitars seems to be doing great. They're taking in orders as fast as they can build them (there's something like an 11- to 14-week wait), they keep coming out with new models and options, and if Facebook is any indication, Kiesel has a huge worldwide audience. The FB stats: 4.8 of 5 stars on 2.9K reviews, and an astonishing 1,049,321 "likes". I play 99.99% acoustic guitar with just a little electric bass, and I still follow them on FB just for the guitar porn.

.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 10-12-2017, 12:22 PM
zhunter zhunter is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 2,346
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chriscom View Post
Well as has been pointed out, there were two different "theys."

Besides that, without a doubt, California has a gargantuan economy, but to some extent it's coasting at this point. It's an entirely uncontroversial fact in the business world, verified by publicly available statistics, that companies have been leaving California in recent years, primarily due to high regulation and taxes. The same goes for migration between the states--more people have left California for other states than vice-versa.

That's the overall trend--it will vary across business sectors. I don't know enough about amps and such, but given the insanely low production prices in Asia, it strikes me that Carvin may have been located in one of the worst states to have a fighting chance in the long run.
Probably why Peavey has moved much of it's manufacturing out of Mississippi. Everybody knows how harsh regulation and taxes are in...Mississippi.

hunter
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 10-12-2017, 01:30 PM
menhir menhir is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Pittsburgh
Posts: 1,208
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by zhunter View Post
Probably why Peavey has moved much of it's manufacturing out of Mississippi. Everybody knows how harsh regulation and taxes are in...Mississippi.

hunter
Which actually may support some of the speculation about Carvin's business environment. If a company located in a less burdensome situation had to outsource to compete....but...but...wait...

I'd like to add something here: My original post on this tax subject was merely a relaying of some of the responses I found attached to one of the YouTube videos that I found interesting, possibly pertinent, and not previously covered here. It was never my intention to add any controversy to the thread...just to add to the discussion.

I'll admit to being taken aback at how sensitive some people were to the issue.

So for the record: I am not a troll.

I am a long-time business owner and employer. I have my own personal reality-based opinions on the subject and you'll never hear them argued here.

I'm here for gee-tar stuff. Even my first remark above was merely a thought about some else's comment, not meant to be an incitement.

I like thinking. I wish I did it more often.

I'll belly up to the bar to discuss laminates vs solids, bridge pins, amplifiers, microphones and yes...even capos.
(This is me, the guy who actually likes Bird of Paradise capos...Yeah...I can be controversial.)

As for Carvin, I'm just here to stand at the wake and talk about the recently departed.

Last edited by menhir; 10-12-2017 at 03:55 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 10-12-2017, 02:01 PM
NoodleFingers NoodleFingers is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Dec 2015
Posts: 545
Default

If I were to guess—and it's only a guess—I would think it's the change to the online landscape that did them in.

They started out as a way to buy top-quality gear for less money by buying direct. But with the growth and proliferation of Amazon, Musician's Friend, Sweetwater and and Guitar Center (online), I don't think they could really compete as a single-brand supplier, having lost much of their price advantage.

But that's just my guess.

Too bad, too. I've been eyeing an AG200 for over a year, and now it's too late.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 10-12-2017, 03:27 PM
Charmed Life Picks's Avatar
Charmed Life Picks Charmed Life Picks is offline
AGF Sponsor
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 9,032
Default

Another very happy owner of an AG-200, for several years now. As a matter of fact, I think I heard about it first in these very pages.

Bummer.

scott memmer
__________________
CHARMED LIFE PICKS
[email protected]
Celebrating Seven Years in Business!
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 10-12-2017, 09:28 PM
Chriscom's Avatar
Chriscom Chriscom is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Northern Virginia/DC/USA
Posts: 1,792
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by zhunter View Post
Probably why Peavey has moved much of it's manufacturing out of Mississippi. Everybody knows how harsh regulation and taxes are in...Mississippi.

hunter
I gather that Mississippi has extraordinarily low taxes overall, but to my surprise they appear to have a high level of regulation and are not rated as particularly business-friendly. They have some other things going against them including a poorly educated workforce.

CNBC has a detailed ranking of best-to-worst states for business. I'm going to add Texas as a state known for its decent economy in recent years.

CNBC's "cost of business" where you're looking for low taxes, low utility costs and incentives ranks Calif. 49, Texas 15 and Miss. #1.

"Business friendliness" covers regulatory levels and litigation. Calif. ranks #50, Texas 24, Miss. 44.

Workforce has Calif. 10, Texas 1, Miss. 46.

Overall these three come in as Calif. 28, Texas 4, Miss. 48.

Mississippi would also like to send its thanks to Hawaii and West Virginia.

https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/11/amer...l-ranking.html

Lots of things go into starting and running a business, including other factors in that survey like quality of life and infrastructure. One point I agree with was the ridiculously tough time a Carvin had competing against Sweetwater, Musician's Friend, its brick-and-mortar cousin Guitar Center etc. They have amazing selection and outstanding return policies. I had zero trouble, online-ordering, returning and getting a refund for one guitar each from Sweetwater and Elderly simply because I didn't like the sound. Looking at it that way it's amazing Carvin lasted as long as it did.

I understand they had great return policies too, but the selection issue played out with me when I when shopping for my first Martin over a year ago. I wanted to buy from a wonderful Mom and Pop store, but they had a tiny selection. Five miles away was Guitar Center, a big one, where I spent months playing pretty much every high-end guitar they had until I bought the GPC-28E, which I didn't even know existed when I started (and which the Mom-and-Pop didn't have in stock, nor would I have known even to ask for it). I'll add I was lucky to meet an extremely knowledgeable, helpful and patient salesman at this particular GC, we all know that ain't always the case. (Indeed it wasn't the case a few months later when I walked into the exact same GC when Expert Salesman was out and the B Team I encountered fit our stereotype of big box salespeople).

I'll keep my eye out for used versions of the AG200 and 300, but I was already keeping my eye out for them on Reverb and Ebay and rarely saw anything--which to me said people were happy with them. In fact the only AG200/300s I saw in eBay were new ones being sold by Carvin.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 10-12-2017, 10:46 PM
The Growler The Growler is offline
Charter Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 8,150
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NoodleFingers View Post
If I were to guess—and it's only a guess—I would think it's the change to the online landscape that did them in.

They started out as a way to buy top-quality gear for less money by buying direct. But with the growth and proliferation of Amazon, Musician's Friend, Sweetwater and and Guitar Center (online), I don't think they could really compete as a single-brand supplier, having lost much of their price advantage.

But that's just my guess.

Too bad, too. I've been eyeing an AG200 for over a year, and now it's too late.

This is more likely to be the case.
Reply With Quote
Reply

  The Acoustic Guitar Forum > General Acoustic Guitar and Amplification Discussion > Acoustic Amplification

Thread Tools





All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:34 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, The Acoustic Guitar Forum
vB Ad Management by =RedTyger=