#76
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Well as far as mixing multi track recordings and in only a very general sense often the goal is to have a cohesive mix (that sounds and feels like it is all the instruments are playing live in the same room same time) BUT have enough distinction between the individual instruments so that they do not get lost in a muddy mess of similar mid range frequencies and can be heard individually in the mix. This is (again generally speaking ) often done in two ways. First consider that the sound field is 3 dimensional, not only stereo Left and Right being 2 D, but also front to back thus 3D #1 limit the number of stereo tracks in general, for example record the rhythm acoustic guitar track in stereo and pan hard left and right, then record additional tracks in mono and spread the panning of those tracks out to specific positions left to right. i.e. lead guitar 45 L and piano 45 R percussion instrument 25 L and tamborine 25 R etc. # 2 sculpt the sound of the various instruments to allow space for individual frequencies to be more and less predominant , by using subtractive EQ ( cutting by a few db) on slightly different frequencies for each instrument. Also compression can help move specific featured instruments like say vocal and or lead guitar riffs , to the front of the sound field, where supporting instruments can be a bit further back in the sound field .
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 Last edited by KevWind; 06-28-2019 at 07:58 AM. |
#77
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Thank you guys for your tips. Well I have to record one track, so the signal goes from 2 mic and 1 piezzo and I need to blend it together. Maybe there is no great magic here and I just have to figure out by myself and by my own ears. I'll try mix the signal from the mics and then from the piezo separately and then blend it together.
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#78
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 |
#79
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I am sorry, what I meant was record one piece of music. So the signal from 2 mics and one piezo at the same time
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#80
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Not sure why he wants to do that. It would have to be an incredibly good pickup system for me to choose it over a properly mic-ed track. But I tried doing the same thing when I started. At the time I figured the more sources I had, the more likely I was to get a good recording. Never worked out that way but I did it for a while. Gives me an idea though... A Flock of Seagulls cover band that plays their guitars using only piezo pickups. I'd call it "Flock of Ducks."
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Jim 2023 Iris ND-200 maple/adi 2017 Circle Strings 00 bastogne walnut/sinker redwood 2015 Circle Strings Parlor shedua/western red cedar 2009 Bamburg JSB Signature Baritone macassar ebony/carpathian spruce 2004 Taylor XXX-RS indian rosewood/sitka spruce 1988 Martin D-16 mahogany/sitka spruce along with some electrics, zouks, dulcimers, and banjos. YouTube |
#81
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Guys, I don't think, you get me right. Now I do all my records with 2 matcher pair mics, but I also have the L.R. Baggs Anthem pick-up system on my guitar, which contains internal mic+piezo.
For example, look at (or hear) these two videos, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HU2DghZESxE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNPCI8y9avc maybe I am wrong, but I clearly hear more than one source of signal. I belive, their whole track contains signals from microphone, piezo and magnetic pick up. And I am just curious, how they worked with it in mix, how they pan it etc. |
#82
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So from top. While the term "track" is commonly, widely and ambiguously used , to describe an entire session or project or multi track song recording. In recording parlance a "track" is actually a single individual "channel" within a recording and is either mono or stereo. So what it sounds like you are describing you want to do and what is happening in the videos are "multi track" recordings. Specifically either 3 mono tracks, or 1 stereo and 1 mono track. The pair of Mics either on a single stereo track or on two different mono tracks, and the Pickup on a single mono track (or at least that is how it probably should be recorded and is likely what is going on in the videos') . Because then as I describe in my post #76 you can then pan the mic track/s , hard left and right and pan the pickup track up the middle then mix to taste. As Jim pointed out, because you will likely get a different tonal sound from a pickup as opposed to mic/s , you want to able want to EQ the pick up track separately from the mic track/s As per post number 76 You might want to post a screenshot of your entire session. Here is what my sessions would look to accomplish what you are describing, If you have any questions about the screenshots, ( labeling, routing, etc.) please ask. 3 mono tracks 1 Stereo and 1 mono tracks
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 Last edited by KevWind; 06-29-2019 at 09:31 AM. |
#83
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#84
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Sometimes piezo "just works", was used throughout this entire album (do they still call'em that ?)
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Enjoy the Journey.... Kev... KevWind at Soundcloud KevWind at YouYube https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...EZxkPKyieOTgRD System : Studio system Avid Carbon interface , PT Ultimate 2023.12 -Mid 2020 iMac 27" 3.8GHz 8-core i7 10th Gen ,, Ventura 13.2.1 Mobile MBP M1 Pro , PT Ultimate 2023.12 Sonoma 14.4 |
#85
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Seems to work out fine for Rodrigo y Gabriela. In Rodrigo's case, with a pick.
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#86
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Well, it depends on the pickup system, and often what a performer uses live and the sound they are expecting to get in the finished recorded, i.e., if they use an amped/pickup system as at least part of their live performance, it's going to be hard to replicate that in a recording with only mics on the guitar. (I'm thinking folks like Tommy Emmanuel, Doyle Dykes, et al - not acoustic players that have their guitar also plugged in during live performances because...)
Any time you get all those extra tracks of the same performance, the possibility of phase issues creeps in - even tiny ones can create comb filtering so always include a mono mix test or A/B setup to test. Also, I keep the panning not too wide when I've got more than a single mic on a guitar and not mixing it down to a mono track. A wide spread on a single point instrument get a little unnatural in headphones for me. And, if you have something other than the same mics at the extents, there's always a chance that you'll get some artifact, e.g. one side capturing/producing a markedly different frequency curve than the other, and then you'll have a sense that the instrument location wanders as the piece goes up and down the fretboard. Now that really bothers me... My $.02, anyway.
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#87
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1) pan the mics hard left and right, stereo 2) cut the highs from the pickup, maybe add some bass 3) center the pickup in the middle 4) adjust levels to taste But there are all kinds of options. I recall reading Tommy Emmanual saying that on one of his CDs, they recorded mics+pickup and used the pickup to send to the reverb, keeping the mics dry and the pickup itself out of the mix. Why? No idea, but apparently they liked the sound. Michael Hedges apparently liked (this is live) to use a magnetic pickup with the highs rolled off and a stereo chorus on it. I don't recommend this, but one mic and the pickup, each panned hard to each side sounds huge (tho not natural). Antoine Dufour, whose video you posted, has a set of 3 videos on how he records, tho they are light on the specifics of what you are asking. You do get a glimpse of the many plugins he uses, including a "MaxBass" plugin, if I recall, which I'd guess is applied to his pickup to get that big bottom end. I rarely use a pickup, but I do almost always record with more than one pair of mics, and again, the its the same story - blend to taste. I can pick one or the other pairs to see which sounds best, I can use them both, I can adjust the relative levels of each, I can add reverb to one and not the other, I can pan them differently, I can adjust the relative levels - more of one vs the other, and so on. While trying any of this, I just listen and try to figure out if it sounds good.
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#88
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Anyway, thank you guys, this is excatly what I was looking for, some tips and tricks, how to do it. I'll try these things on my next song, which I am going to post here of course |