I can't strum/hold a pick worth a flip

[spock]

First off, to be honest, I am not a great guitar player, having picked it up 20 some years ago in my mid 40's and eventually learning how to fingerpick and do a bit of flat picking lead on stuff I record and such. I know my way around the fingerboard pretty good, my sense of timing is good, I can easily do barre chords, have written a number of songs, and even improvise some when playing fingerpicked tunes.

But man o man, I have revisited the basic strumming a song with a pick thing more times than I care to remember and just can't seem to make that whole process work for some reason. Strumming with my bare thumb - no problem, but there are times when I'd just like to dig into a song with pick and it's like I'm worse than a rank beginner.

Probably two separate issues intertwined.

The pick slides around between my fingers and just won't stay put unless I grip it very tightly which everyone says don't do. Relax they say . . relax

My strumming is uneven, not fluid at all, and for the life of me I can't seem to relax my wrist and just let it go, probably because I'm so tensed up over the dang pick not staying put. And hitting a particular string consistently with the pick, well forget that. I can do it with my thumb without issue, but not the pick.

Help!!!

[DukeX]

Originally Posted by spock

First off, to be honest, I am not a great guitar player, having picked it up 20 some years ago in my mid 40's and eventually learning how to fingerpick and do a bit of flat picking lead on stuff I record and such. I know my way around the fingerboard pretty good, my sense of timing is good, I can easily do barre chords, have written a number of songs, and even improvise some when playing fingerpicked tunes.

But man o man, I have revisited the basic strumming a song with a pick thing more times than I care to remember and just can't seem to make that whole process work for some reason. Strumming with my bare thumb - no problem, but there are times when I'd just like to dig into a song with pick and it's like I'm worse than a rank beginner.

Probably two separate issues intertwined.

The pick slides around between my fingers and just won't stay put unless I grip it very tightly which everyone says don't do. Relax they say . . relax

My strumming is uneven, not fluid at all, and for the life of me I can't seem to relax my wrist and just let it go, probably because I'm so tensed up over the dang pick not staying put. And hitting a particular string consistently with the pick, well forget that. I can do it with my thumb without issue, but not the pick.

Help!!!

Maybe try a thumb pick. Lots do.

[NormanKliman]

The two main bones in your forearm, the radius and the ulna, come together at the elbow. In twisting motions, like turning a key in a lock, one bone pivots around the other. This is pretty much the movement that you want for strumming, and, although it may seem very obvious and intuitive, some guitarists have a hard time with it. If you’re among them, one way to ease into it is to grab a small pillow (like one that’s on your couch) and put your right arm (left for lefties) into playing position, as if you had the guitar in your hands. Start up with that twisting motion, and feel the weight of the pillow and the growing centrifugal force. Notice that tightening your wrist will hamper that movement. What you want is a combination of limp wrist and synchronized efforts from the muscles that drive the twisting motion. You want to be able to feel the centrifugal force in your hand, like the weight of that pillow. Does that help?

[Pitar]

In the beginning...

I couldn't hold a pick either so I taught myself to finger pick instead. Then I learned to use a thumb pick and now use it as a flat pick as well.

[Lkristians]

I wonder if the flexibility of the pick you're using has anything to do with this. Do you know what gauge you're using? Dunlop makes all gauges and has a coarse top that enables a better grip. Lots of choices. Keep on trying!

[mattyc71]

spock, I'm very much in the same boat, and I'm choosing from 3 possible fixes that I have come up with:
1) I sometimes use a large, thin triangle pick. By bending it between my fingers I can keep it in place. Volume takes a hit.
2) Something called "Mojo Grip" - it's a typical plastic pick with a rubber "jacket" over the half that you hold onto. Works pretty well.
3) Lately I've been working on my "attack angle"(?) I get a lot less spinning if the pick does not strike the strings flat, but at a bit of an angle.

All of this could be completely wrong according to the experts, but I don't need to make a living at this.
Good Luck!!

[JCPO]

I tried these and they work great: https://www.ebay.com/p/1384928994

[Lockback]

Originally Posted by Pitar

In the beginning...

I couldn't hold a pick either so I taught myself to finger pick instead. Then I learned to use a thumb pick and now use it as a flat pick as well.

Just to prove (as if we need to) that human beings can be so completely different, I'm a good flat picker and have a great sense of rhythm.
But, man, I can't use a thumb pick to save my life. It's like playing pool with a string.

[skyblue314]

I don't know what I was doing wrong, but I tried the thumb pick and found that I totally lost control of my picking dynamics. Those things immediately went into the pick jar and have remained there since.

Try either the Clayton Pick Tac:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Clayton-Pic...38d2ee27281c67
or the Monster Grips:
https://www.amazon.com/Monster-Grips...xpY2s9dHJ1ZQ==

That way, you can still use your favorite picks without them continuously falling out of your fingers. Start out by applying these "pasties" to one side of the pick and see how they work for you. If the pick still comes loose, you can apply another pastie to the reverse side of your pick for maximum grip.

[Pitar]

Originally Posted by Lockback

Just to prove (as if we need to) that human beings can be so completely different, I'm a good flat picker and have a great sense of rhythm.
But, man, I can't use a thumb pick to save my life. It's like playing pool with a string.

Same here, but I needed to get some amplitude and the bare thumb was just too thumpy and quiet. The thumb pick brought the missing sparkle to the bass sound. It took me about a week of stubbornness to conquer thumb pick-itis and get it coordinated in the mix.

I should start by saying I used the softer Delrin nylon thumb picks produced by Fred Kelly (Speed Picks) that aren't as uncomfortable on the thumb wrap as the polycarbonate type. Kelly's picks got me going and then I switched to the polycarbs after about a year with the Delrin.

When I was attempting to play with the flat pick there were only Fender thin, medium and heavy picks, all tortoise-colored polycarbonate. I tried using the rounded back corner of the medium weight and did manage to get some degree of skill with it. Neil Young songs, primarily, were what I used it for. But, that was about it as I had become a finger picker almost exclusively by then.

[Cobby]

Just a stray thought... how are you at using a pick for single notes? Things like scales or playing simple single-note melodies?

I think that's where I'd start when learning to use a pick. Then from there try some Carter-Style tunes but with a flatpick. That would be where you would play the melody on the lower strings then brush the upper strings to play the chord and keep the rhythm going during the gaps in the melody.

From there, you'll have pretty good pick control so regular strumming should come fairly easily....

If you want to, that is - I've just described how I learned to use a pick and to this day I seem constitutionally unable to just straight-ahead strum - I always have to hit some bass notes in there. I think that's a good thing though.

[spock]

Thank you all for the suggestions - I am going to try a couple of the mentioned pick aids.

I still believe it is also something to do with my arm/wrist motion, pick angle, or possibly a combination of many things as well but don't know exactly what that might be. I have pondered taking a few lessons just to have someone look at what I'm doing and say, "Hey, you need to do this or stop doing that" or whatever. I also wondered if standing up and playing with a strap would somehow make things different, but probably just groping on that idea.

The link just below is me playing/strumming with a flat pick. You might listen to some of this and say, definitely not the best, but not completely unlistenable either. But I am hitting a bass string basically before every strum (as Cobby alluded to) and there is really no continuous up and down strumming, which is what I would like to be able to do.


https://soundcloud.com/buck-eye-4713...d-cliche-blues


Now here is an example of someone doing the kind of strumming I would like to do but seem unable for whatever reason. The little intro part is not too bad, probably because the strumming is broken up with the individual notes between chord changes, but when he gets to just the regular strumming at about the 3:05 mark, that is my downfall.

[JBCROTTY]

There is another thread here that might hold a few suggestions for you:

https://www.acousticguitarforum.com/...d.php?t=577828

I believe everyone struggles with a pick at some early point in their playing. Only time and patience and trying a few different kinds of picks will resolve it.

[tonyo]

The pick slides around between my fingers and just won't stay put unless I grip it very tightly which everyone says don't do. Relax they say . . relax

Check out the bogstreet pick. I'm mostly fingerstyle, with and without thumbpick. But some songs just need a traditional pick/plectrum. They slide all over for me until I found the bogstreet pick. I like their "lead" model

[Robin, Wales]

Originally Posted by spock

Thank you all for the suggestions - I am going to try a couple of the mentioned pick aids.

I still believe it is also something to do with my arm/wrist motion, pick angle, or possibly a combination of many things as well but don't know exactly what that might be. I have pondered taking a few lessons just to have someone look at what I'm doing and say, "Hey, you need to do this or stop doing that" or whatever. I also wondered if standing up and playing with a strap would somehow make things different, but probably just groping on that idea.

The link just below is me playing/strumming with a flat pick. You might listen to some of this and say, definitely not the best, but not completely unlistenable either. But I am hitting a bass string basically before every strum (as Cobby alluded to) and there is really no continuous up and down strumming, which is what I would like to be able to do.


https://soundcloud.com/buck-eye-4713...d-cliche-blues


Now here is an example of someone doing the kind of strumming I would like to do but seem unable for whatever reason. The little intro part is not too bad, probably because the strumming is broken up with the individual notes between chord changes, but when he gets to just the regular strumming at about the 3:05 mark, that is my downfall.

Spock,

First off, your boom, chick strumming on Bad Cliché Blues is great - good timing and perfect for the song.

I have some ideas for practice to get that more fluid strumming pattern in the video in your post.

Pick - try some very light, flexible picks such as the Dunlop nylons in 0.60 or possibly better still the Fender 346 light in celluloid. The big triangle 346 picks have a slightly more rounded point than standard teardrop picks which makes open strumming less 'trippy'. These picks may sound really tinny and flappy on your guitar but they will help you get the movement right initially and you'll then be able to transfer that to a better sounding pick later.

Grip - try Pick Honey. You just rub it between your thumb and the side of your first finger. It will stop any pick rotating and allow you to loosen your grip. I use it all the time and it means I can use any pick I want. Also, just check your grip against some of the youtube videos showing pick grip to make sure you are roughly the same (they are all a little different but fundamentally the most common is holding the pick between the thumb and the side of the first finger).

Strum Practice - Stick that 'Loosing My Religion' video on but don't watch it - or just listen to the original track. Mute your guitar strings gently with your left hand. Now just start by strumming up and down chick-a chick-a chick-a along with the track - providing just percussion with your pick strumming across your muted strings. Don't think about it too hard, just adding a nice, in time, percussion to the track on muted strings. Then pick another track - anything you fancy - and do the same thing. It won't be too long until you are playing around with different percussion effects and syncopations on your muted guitar strings to different tracks. Well, I think you can see where this is going.....

Good luck