Bog Oak

[j. Kinnaird]

Originally Posted by ross748

Found this quite interesting.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-norfolk-19722595

That is interesting

[tadol]

Originally Posted by Malcolm Kindnes

I realise that, in fact I'm often arguing on this forum that the back and sides wood makes very little difference to the sound of a guitar.

This is a blanket statement that needs a bit of clarification. There are a pretty fair number of builders whose builds don’t truly benefit from the qualities that the back and sides CAN contribute. But a master luthier chooses the back and sides for the tonal qualities they WILL contribute to the instrument, and not strictly for color/figure/rarity they may have.

Bog oak is very similar to sinker logs, in that there is a change to the material that is quite visible, lending to a wonderful aesthetic quality, but there is also a chemical/structural change - how that reflects in the tonal quality of a build is a very interesting question. But it needs to be in the hands of a great builder to see what its potential might be, and they won’t necessarily get it right every time, so I wouldn’t judge a materials capabilities by one or two random examples. As I said, I think that at the VERY least, bog oak has the same potential as other good oaks, which can be extremely good - and it can also build some extremely attractive guitars.

I think Mr Kinnaird will be more than capable of demonstrating bog oaks potential in a high quality instrument -

[Edbuff]

i have a Bog Oak guitar made by Rosie Heydenrich of Turnstone guitars. it is very nice.

[j. Kinnaird]

Originally Posted by tadol

This is a blanket statement that needs a bit of clarification. There are a pretty fair number of builders whose builds don’t truly benefit from the qualities that the back and sides CAN contribute. But a master luthier chooses the back and sides for the tonal qualities they WILL contribute to the instrument, and not strictly for color/figure/rarity they may have.

Bog oak is very similar to sinker logs, in that there is a change to the material that is quite visible, lending to a wonderful aesthetic quality, but there is also a chemical/structural change - how that reflects in the tonal quality of a build is a very interesting question. But it needs to be in the hands of a great builder to see what its potential might be, and they won’t necessarily get it right every time, so I wouldn’t judge a materials capabilities by one or two random examples. As I said, I think that at the VERY least, bog oak has the same potential as other good oaks, which can be extremely good - and it can also build some extremely attractive guitars.

I think Mr Kinnaird will be more than capable of demonstrating bog oaks potential in a high quality instrument -

Thanks very kindly for the vote of confidence.

Originally Posted by Edbuff

i have a Bog Oak guitar made by Rosie Heydenrich of Turnstone guitars. it is very nice.

Post some pictures, I’d love to see it.

[ross748]

https://youtu.be/-50hW3THU1k

[Craviola]

Originally Posted by ross748

https://youtu.be/-50hW3THU1k

Michael Watts, never heard of him. Amazing player and the sound of that guitar is incredible. Thanks for the post.

[TomB'sox]

Originally Posted by Craviola

Michael Watts, never heard of him. Amazing player and the sound of that guitar is incredible. Thanks for the post.

Michael is a great player, a great guy, funny guy. He is quite active on this forum and posts a lot of informative videos. He also played a concert at my home for a guitar event we held and was amazing to see in person. He is one of the best.

[CoolerKing]

Originally Posted by j. Kinnaird

This maybe a not very novel thread but I thought i would show a set that i recently (like today) got from merry old England. Its Bog Oak and dates from 3500 BC. This wood fell into the fens and bogs and was preserved by the acidic conditions and has recently been resurrected and cut into quartered sawn sets and lumber.
It taps out like most oak, that is to say about like hard maple. I think this is going to make an interesting guitar. I might pare it with a tunnel redwood top. Thanks to Han for turning me on to this wood.

I'm sure it sounds great. But it looks fantastic, and it's got some history. That's a triple threat in my book!

Plenty of wood gets hype these days: The Tree, Tunnel 13, etc. Some of it is real and some is marketing. Who says it can't be both?

[Malcolm Kindnes]

Originally Posted by tadol

This is a blanket statement that needs a bit of clarification. There are a pretty fair number of builders whose builds don’t truly benefit from the qualities that the back and sides CAN contribute. But a master luthier chooses the back and sides for the tonal qualities they WILL contribute to the instrument, and not strictly for color/figure/rarity they may have.

Bog oak is very similar to sinker logs, in that there is a change to the material that is quite visible, lending to a wonderful aesthetic quality, but there is also a chemical/structural change - how that reflects in the tonal quality of a build is a very interesting question. But it needs to be in the hands of a great builder to see what its potential might be, and they won’t necessarily get it right every time, so I wouldn’t judge a materials capabilities by one or two random examples. As I said, I think that at the VERY least, bog oak has the same potential as other good oaks, which can be extremely good - and it can also build some extremely attractive guitars.

I think Mr Kinnaird will be more than capable of demonstrating bog oaks potential in a high quality instrument -

I'm not suggesting that a great guitar cannot be made using bog oak, I'm just saying that we can't assume that it will be. Many people will pay a huge upcharge for exotic timber, with little or no evidence of how much it is influencing the sound of the instrument.
Good builders have made guitars out of whisky barrels and storage pallets just to demonstrate this fact. A highly respected guitar player and member of this forum has been known to say that your choice of pick has a greater impact on tone than your choice of back and side woods.

[tadol]

Originally Posted by Malcolm Kindnes

I'm not suggesting that a great guitar cannot be made using bog oak, I'm just saying that we can't assume that it will be. Many people will pay a huge upcharge for exotic timber, with little or no evidence of how much it is influencing the sound of the instrument.
Good builders have made guitars out of whisky barrels and storage pallets just to demonstrate this fact. A highly respected guitar player and member of this forum has been known to say that your choice of pick has a greater impact on tone than your choice of back and side woods.

Well said! Which is why I question so many people buying guitars BASED on wood choice, or asking for wood advice when spec'ing a custom build, and assuming wood choice is going to give them a great guitar - while in reality, the woods aren't going to make a whole lot of difference compared to choice of builder -

Braz RW is ridiculously expensive - and yet so many custom builds spec it almost automatically, and it is such an important headline when you look at the classifieds. But as you say - a guitar built with braz RW is NOT a guarantee of a great guitar. I know great guitars can be built with bog oak - but it's not a guarantee of anything. The same is true of The Tree, Tunnel 13, etc, etc, etc. Much like taking an incredible sounding guitar out of the hands of a great player, and putting it into the hands of someone, say, like me. I guarantee, it is NOT going to sound as good - ;-)

[redir]

I happen to love regular old White Oak for steel string guitars so I can only imagine Bog Oak is even better. I bought a few billets from a guy who sells from Bosnia. It really is beautiful stuff and the back story is wonderful. Can't wait to see how this one turns out.

[TomB'sox]

Bog oak has an amazing history that just blows my mind when you think about how old it is and what was happening on the earth when they started to grow!

John, how large is this piece, ie. what size guitar could you get out of it?

[j. Kinnaird]

Originally Posted by TomB'sox

Bog oak has an amazing history that just blows my mind when you think about how old it is and what was happening on the earth when they started to grow!

John, how large is this piece, ie. what size guitar could you get out of it?

The black piece is Om sized
The brown piece is big enough for a dread

[Jamiejoon]

Knowing John's work as I do (I have two of his guitars), I have total confidence in his ability to make a stellar guitar with the bog oak. I think he could make a good guitar with knotty old black locust or birch. With quartersawn bog oak? No doubt!

[j. Kinnaird]

Originally Posted by Jamiejoon

Knowing John's work as I do (I have two of his guitars), I have total confidence in his ability to make a stellar guitar with the bog oak. I think he could make a good guitar with knotty old black locust or birch. With quartersawn bog oak? No doubt!

Well thanks Jamie
Most kind of you to say so