Question about tops

[printer2]

Originally Posted by Guitarplayer_PR

I'm not so sure he's strumming aggressively at all. And if it sounds "thin" to you, it has more to do with the fact that, because it's a super shallow bowl, it won't move that much air, giving the sensation of lack of "fullness," which is an overrated word in the acoustic world, IMO.

Whether it is the top wood or the lack of depth to the body, seems like the bass end could use some help. As far as my own personal tastes go that is.

[Guitarplayer_PR]

Originally Posted by printer2

Whether it is the top wood or the lack of depth to the body, seems like the bass end could use some help. As far as my own personal tastes go that is.

Well, that's expected from a super shallow bowl. It is what it is. Not every guitar has to sound the same way. You choose what you like, what people like and/or what it fits to whatever you wanna do with it. What works in one song doesn't need to work on others.

[printer2]

Well, the thread was discussing tops. Seems the only top we are discussing is a Bubinga top. And since there is not a wealth of information out there on guitars with Bubinga tops, or reviews of guitars with Bubinga tops, I guess we have to go by the limited sampling of guitars with Bubinga tops at our disposal. And all have sounded thin to me so far. I do have some Bubinga in the house, but since I have a passing familiarity with the physics of acoustic guitars I am not about to squander the one set of Bubinga to find out spruce probably makes a better sounding top.

[charles Tauber]

Originally Posted by printer2

The cement thing refers to sanding the stuff, hard as a rock.

My reference to bubinga for use as an acoustic guitar top wood being one step better than concrete facetiously referred to its responsiveness for that purpose. It is not a wood from which I wood ever consider making an acoustic guitar top. For similar reasons, I also wouldn't use ebony or rosewood, both of which I have used to make back and sides. John gave the technical reasons why.

I was unaware that anyone had and assumed, incorrectly, that it was another of the many arm-chair what-if speculation-type questions. If you, the OP, like the sound that a bubinga-topped guitar makes - amplified or not - that's fine. It is not a wood that is likely to give me the sort of responsiveness and tonal qualities that I'm looking for in an acoustic guitar.

It was not my intention to insult your guitar, with its bubinga top, but you asked what people thought of bubinga for use as a guitar top. I provided my opinion. The video you provided supports my opinion that it is not the sound I seek.

[printer2]

Originally Posted by charles Tauber

My reference to bubinga for use as an acoustic guitar top wood being one step better than concrete facetiously referred to its responsiveness for that purpose. It is not a wood from which I wood ever consider making an acoustic guitar top. For similar reasons, I also wouldn't use ebony or rosewood, both of which I have used to make back and sides. John gave the technical reasons why.

I was unaware that anyone had and assumed, incorrectly, that it was another of the many arm-chair what-if speculation-type questions. If you, the OP, like the sound that a bubinga-topped guitar makes - amplified or not - that's fine. It is not a wood that is likely to give me the sort of responsiveness and tonal qualities that I'm looking for in an acoustic guitar.

It was not my intention to insult your guitar, with its bubinga top, but you asked what people thought of bubinga for use as a guitar top. I provided my opinion. The video you provided supports my opinion that it is not the sound I seek.

Sorry Charles, thought you mentioned concrete due to its sanding qualities. It seems that it was Tim McKnight that made the comment. I can see a use for a Bubinga top in a travel guitar, would not be as susceptible to top dents as cedar.

[Guitarplayer_PR]

Originally Posted by charles Tauber

My reference to bubinga for use as an acoustic guitar top wood being one step better than concrete facetiously referred to its responsiveness for that purpose. It is not a wood from which I wood ever consider making an acoustic guitar top. For similar reasons, I also wouldn't use ebony or rosewood, both of which I have used to make back and sides. John gave the technical reasons why.

I was unaware that anyone had and assumed, incorrectly, that it was another of the many arm-chair what-if speculation-type questions. If you, the OP, like the sound that a bubinga-topped guitar makes - amplified or not - that's fine. It is not a wood that is likely to give me the sort of responsiveness and tonal qualities that I'm looking for in an acoustic guitar.

It was not my intention to insult your guitar, with its bubinga top, but you asked what people thought of bubinga for use as a guitar top. I provided my opinion. The video you provided supports my opinion that it is not the sound I seek.

Actually, the one who asked was not him; it was me. It's fine. Not everyone has to like what others have. I'm asking because it's so rare to see bubinga as a top wood and it's good to know what others think about it. The way I see it is that opinions are divided. Some people that I've asked love the tone and others don't. Same with almost all kinds of guitars.

[Bearclaw Spruce]

Originally Posted by Wade Hampton

Guitarplayer PR, Ovations work a bit differently than most acoustic guitars. It would be interesting to sit down with your and your bubinga-topped Ovation and a few of my (mostly spruce-topped) acoustic guitars and play them together, both acoustically and plugged in.

I suspect your guitar probably wouldn't cut through the unholy din of an indoor bluegrass jam session as well as some of my guitars will, but obviously that's not the only place an acoustic or acoustic-electric guitar can be musically useful.

Getting back to bubinga itself, I think it's one of the great unsung and under-appreciated tonewoods. About fifteen to twenty years ago Gibson really tried to get the guitar-buying public to accept it as a wood choice, and made some terrific-sounding Gibson acoustic guitars out of it. There were several models they made back then where the back and side wood choices included bubinga, and I often found myself preferring the bubinga guitars over the maple or rosewood versions.

But the public evidently shrugged their collective shoulders, said "meh..." (or words to that effect,) and didn't buy enough of them because I haven't seen any bubinga guitars in Gibson's lineup in recent years.

Which is too bad.

Bubinga has actually achieved more acceptance with a few hand builders making ultra-expensive custom guitars than it has with general musician public, largely because

A.) It can look outrageously gorgeous;

B.) It can sound magnificent;

and

C.) Luthiers can and do have more influence and ability to guide the tastes, perceptions and decisions of their customers than the average sales clerk working in a music store can.


So while bubinga hasn't yet set the hearts of America's guitar-playing masses racing quite yet, there are some of us who recognize it as the fine tonewood that it is.

Anyway, you've got a cool-looking guitar there, and I'm glad that you like it.


Wade Hampton Miller

Interestingly, Huss & Dalton have announced on the H&D forum that they have chosen Bubinga as the back and side wood for their 20th Anniversary model.

[Guitarplayer_PR]

What I like about having a Bubinga-topped guitar like mine is that I have different options and tones. That can't hurt.

[Bearclaw Spruce]

Originally Posted by Guitarplayer_PR

What I like about having a Bubinga-topped guitar like mine is that I have different options and tones. That can't hurt.

Have you tried comparing it to a similar Ovation with a Spruce top?

[kydave]

Originally Posted by printer2

Sorry Charles, thought you mentioned concrete due to its sanding qualities. It seems that it was Tim McKnight that made the comment. I can see a use for a Bubinga top in a travel guitar, would not be as susceptible to top dents as cedar.

Why not spruce? Why would a travel guitar be particularly susceptible to top dents? Cedar is one of the softer tops woods somewhat commonly used, but much less so than spruce, so I'm curious as to the comparison.

Why not use (Any other wood) as a top wood when dents are your concern?

And if using (Any other wood) why not use one better suited for the application of top wood? As Charles says, there's a reason people generally don't use ebony and rosewood and other woods for tops...

If you're building a guitar not primarily associated with its unplugged sound qualities, and looks is your priority, sure... the bubinga makes sense.

[Guitarplayer_PR]

Originally Posted by Bearclaw Spruce

Have you tried comparing it to a similar Ovation with a Spruce top?

I own an Ovation with a spruce top (6768), but it's a deep bowl, so comparing both of them based on tops is tricky, since the bowls are different. Even with that, it's kind of a no-brainer to recognize that the spruce one is warmer tone-wise, regardless of the bowl. The bubinga has better string definition and clarity, more treble, kind of stiffer than spruce, but it's not harsh to my ears. And it sustains like crazy

[Guitarplayer_PR]

How about this?

[Howard Klepper]

Originally Posted by Bowie

You missed the point, he was agreeing with the ridiculous cement statement and I simply pointed to the video as evidence that it's a viable top wood after all.

You quoted a statement about top thickness, stiffness, and efficiency, and then you said it was a theory that had been disproved by a video. Now you say that the concrete metaphor, which came from someone else's post, was what you were calling a "theory?" OK, sure. That guitar definitely sounds better than one made of concrete.

[kydave]

Originally Posted by Guitarplayer_PR

How about this?

That guitar also exhibits the similar tone (or lack of tone) which failed to impress me in the first video.

Nothing wrong with that - people obviously like different sounds. But that does not have the richness that I expect, want and demand of a steel string guitar.

That type of top wood is more suited to furniture, IMO. But then, I like extremely even grained spruce, in all its varieties.

But that is merely one guy's opinion.

[buddyhu]

This thread appears to be mistitled. Rather than "Question About Tops", it would have been more apt to title it, "I like my bubinga topped Ovation, do you?". Because that is the underlying theme here.

I like the look of your bubinga top. I am glad that you enjoy your guitar.

Let's move on. Not much more to see here.