Pao Ferro - Page 2

Craviola · #16 10-13-2018, 01:37 AM

All my Giannini Craviolas have Pau Ferro and I love it as a tone wood. Looks great and has a warm, rich, clear tone. Similar to rosewood but I would say not as deep or dark sounding. First video is of Emerald guitars picking out a peice of PF, 2nd is All Pettaway playing a PF guitar.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AwZKjAFncvQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dyWTyaGs6y0

godfreydaniel · #17 10-13-2018, 07:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaymarsch

One of the nicest 00s I have ever played was a Pao Ferro and Italian Spruce guitar by Dana Bourgeois. It definitely sounded in the rosewood ballpark.
It was warm and clear with nice overtone content and a focused sound that 00s can have. I think it is a wood worth checking out in the right hands.

Caveat - it has more to do with the luthier than the woods IMHO.

Best,
Jayne

Bourgeois uses pao rosewood, not pau ferro. I confirmed with someone at Bourgeois that they’re not the same wood on the now extinct Bourgeois forum. It also doesn’t look like Brazilian or EI rosewood. I have two Bourgeois guitars with pao rosewood, one of which is an 00 with an Italian top. I totally agree with you regarding how good it sounds.

mercy · #18 10-13-2018, 07:26 AM

The Wood database doesnt list a Pao wood but does list an african wood called Pao Rosa. If someone has some more info I would like to know.

Steve DeRosa · #19 10-13-2018, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercy

The Wood database doesn't list a Pao wood but does list an African wood called Pao Rosa. If someone has some more info I would like to know.

The correct spelling is Pau Ferro - that might help your search...

As far as the wood itself is concerned I've had a Pedulla bass with a Pau Ferro fingerboard for nearly 30 years, that was my grab-&-go for the first two decades of ownership: mine looks like Brazilian but "tighter" and less porous, has a harder feel much like striped ebony, given the amount of playing it received (and still does on occasion) shows very little wear - and why the major makers didn't adopt it sooner is beyond me...

marklm · #20 10-13-2018, 08:20 AM

I have been very fortunate to currently have three custom guitars built by three different luthiers. As I posted yesterday I had a wonderful Pao Ferro B/S guitar a few years back. I also used to have a couple of wonderful Brazilian Rosewood guitars, and am familiar with that tonal contribution. My current Wenge and EIR B/S guitars were built with bracing etc. to bring out the "Brazilian" type tone that I love. In my opinion they were incredibly successful in doing so without the $2,000 or more upcharge of true Brazilian. As one luthier said, "You are far better off using the saved money for a good top, and the features that are important to you. I can get very close to the sound that you are looking for with woods with a much smaller upcharge". Long story short a good luthier can make Pao Ferro, Wenge, EIR, or any excellent piece of wood from there "stash," into a lifetime keeper guitar in my opinion.

godfreydaniel · #21 10-13-2018, 08:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mercy

The Wood database doesnt list a Pao wood but does list an african wood called Pao Rosa. If someone has some more info I would like to know.

Pao Rosa is what Bourgeois (and some others) call Pao rosewood. Not a true rosewood, has a striped look to it.

https://bourgeoisguitars.net/guitar-...rosewood-7060/

hermithollow · #22 10-13-2018, 09:26 AM

I've built guitars and other instruments with Pau Ferro back and sides and owned a very nice classical (commercially made) that used it for back and sides.
It is a dense close grained wood that is reasonably easy to work and finish but whose dust many find to be a problem (severe allergic reactions) similar to cocobolo. This is not a problem for the end user of the finished product, but for many luthiers is a deal breaker.
It is a close match to ziricote in it's properties and if you like the sound of ziricote guitars should be similar, but as has been said, back and side woods are only one component in the sound of a guitar.
Pau ferro goes by a lot of different trade names - Morado, Santos Rosewood, Bolivian Rosewood, Caviuna,Palo Santo, Brazilian ironwood, etc..The wood can vary a lot in appearance, some pieces are fairly plain while others have contrasting colors similar to the true rosewoods.
If the dust was less toxic you might see more manufacturers using it. I "suit up" when I work with it (long sleeves, dust mask, eye protection) similar to what I do for Cocobolo.

jaymarsch · #23 10-13-2018, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godfreydaniel

Bourgeois uses pao rosewood, not pau ferro. I confirmed with someone at Bourgeois that they’re not the same wood on the now extinct Bourgeois forum. It also doesn’t look like Brazilian or EI rosewood. I have two Bourgeois guitars with pao rosewood, one of which is an 00 with an Italian top. I totally agree with you regarding how good it sounds.

That’s interesting as this was a custom build for Schoenberg’s and Eric said that Dana built it using pau ferro, a wood he had not used before. So sounds like the one I played was a one-off.

Best,
Jayne

godfreydaniel · #24 10-13-2018, 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaymarsch

That’s interesting as this was a custom build for Schoenberg’s and Eric said that Dana built it using pau ferro, a wood he had not used before. So sounds like the one I played was a one-off.

Best,
Jayne

Jayne -

I was told that Dana Bourgeois was given a small supply of pao rosewood from a Japanese luthier, so initially his supply was limited. I kept an eye on this one on Schoenberg’s website for a very long time before it sold:

http://www.om28.com/ProductDetail?product=P140705001

mercy · #25 10-13-2018, 10:24 AM

Thanks Steve but I was responding to Godfrey's statement. I am familiar with Pau Ferro as I used it on several fingerboards though I might not spell it correctly every time.

jaymarsch · #26 10-13-2018, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by godfreydaniel

Jayne -

I was told that Dana Bourgeois was given a small supply of pao rosewood from a Japanese luthier, so initially his supply was limited. I kept an eye on this one on Schoenberg’s website for a very long time before it sold:

http://www.om28.com/ProductDetail?product=P140705001

Ah, yes, thanks for that link as I was looking for it. Thanks also for clearing that up. It was a beautiful guitar and I would have been tempted to buy it had it not been so similar in tone to a 00 I already owned. The pau rosewood was gorgeous, kind of a cinnamon color. Straight grain but a lot of depth.

Sorry for the confusion as I clearly mis-remembered!

Best,
Jayne

Dwight · #27 10-13-2018, 12:04 PM

[QUOTE=godfreydaniel;5861802]
I was told that Dana Bourgeois was given a small supply of pao rosewood from a Japanese luthier, so initially his supply was limited. I kept an eye on this one on Schoenberg’s website for a very long time before it sold:

I have a 00 Bourgeois in Pao Rosewood and Sitka and it's a wonderful guitar!
The info on Schoenberg's website list it as Pau Rosewood but most likely it is the same wood and they used an alternate spelling.

Brian at Acoustic Music.Org has had several 00's in Pao over the years and they've all been stellar.

godfreydaniel · #28 10-13-2018, 12:39 PM

It was Brian who told me about the luthier who gave the wood to Dana B. Dana definitely found another source for pao rosewood as he’s still using it. I bought my first guitar with pao rosewood from Brian - an O prototype with a bearclaw Sitka top. Brian’s a great guy (as is George Youngblood) and has a great shop.

merlin666 · #29 10-13-2018, 06:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Craviola

All my Giannini Craviolas have Pau Ferro and I love it as a tone wood. Looks great and has a warm, rich, clear tone. Similar to rosewood but I would say not as deep or dark sounding.

The Craviolas sure are neat instruments. I have a fellow in town who brought one to a jam a few times. But I thought they were generally made with laminated bodies only few custom made for celebrities that were solid.