help me count this turn around

RockyRacc00n · #1 10-25-2018, 10:51 AM

Please listen from around 0:56 to 1:20. He is playing the last 2 bars, the turn around, of the 12 bar blues in E. The turnaround being a bar of E and a bar of B.

I am trying to count this in trip-o-la rhythm per beat. I can play it and stay in time instinctively, but as an exercise I am trying to count and I am getting lost.

I realize it may be hard to convey this in writing but let me try. I am going to use the words [trip] [o] and [la] to represent the 3 subdivisions of a beat in the trip-o-la count. I know there are musical notations that will better convey this but I don't know if I can type that out, nor would I know what the staff markings would even look like.

So, using my [trip] [o] [la] notation, a bar where all subdivisions are played would be written out as below. So that I can comment on each beat, I will write a beat per line, like so.

[trip] [o] [la]
[trip] [o] [la]
[trip] [o] [la]
[trip] [o] [la]

If a subdivision isn't played, then I will replace with an [x].

So... here is how I hear it. The bar of E is easy. It goes...

[trip] [x] [la] - This is where he strums the E power chord for the 1st beat.
[trip] [o] [la] - D 3 times
[trip] [o] [la] - C# 3 times
[trip] [o] [la] - C 3 times

I hope I got the notes right above.

But I get lost in the bar of B. It starts like this

[trip] [x] [la] - Like the E, this is where he strums the B power chord for the 1st beat. Actually, it's more the B note, I guess.

And then somewhere in beat 2, there is a muted strum, and the start of the walk into the B7 chord that spans beat 3. And finally on beat 4, he strums the B7 chord.

If you were able to follow my notation, (and hopefully, the parts that I wrote out is accurate to his playing), would you be able to write out beats 2 and 3 of the B bar?

FwL · #2 10-25-2018, 11:07 AM

It goes;

[E] [x] [E]

[x] [A] [A#]

[B] [x] [B]

[B7] [B7] [B7]

.

RockyRacc00n · #3 10-25-2018, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FwL

It goes;

[E] [x] [E]

[x] [A] [A#]

[B] [x] [B]

[B7] [B7] [B7]

.

I think your first line should be [B] [x] [B], no?

But more importantly, the rhythm... I think that's it, or something like it. I couldn't place the start of the walk in to the B7. Once I am home and with my guitar, I am going to play it again with the timing you wrote out, and hopefully get my timing more intentional, rather than going by instinct, which felt off from time to time.

rick-slo · #4 10-25-2018, 12:13 PM

To me sounds like straight tempo with a little swing triplet feel thrown in measure two for example:

stanron · #5 10-25-2018, 01:49 PM

The problem might be that he does not play anything on the first note of the second triplet in the second bar.

Code:

┌─────────────────────────┬─────────────────────────┐
├─────────────────────────┼───────────────────0─0───┤
├─────────────────────────┼───────────────────2─2───┤
├─────────────────────────┼───────────────────1─────┤
├─2───2─5─5─5─4─4─4─3─3─3─┼─2───2───0─1─2───2───────┤
└─0───0─0─────0─────0─────┴─0───────────────────────┘

 .1 + + 2 + + 3 + + 4 + + . 1 + + 2 + + 3 + + 4 + +
                                  ^

There is a slap on the second beat but no note played.

RockyRacc00n · #6 10-25-2018, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick-slo

To me sounds like straight tempo with a little swing triplet feel thrown in measure two for example:

I'm not a trained musician but I do know the "lengths" of the note (quarters, eights, sixteenths), and from what I think I am seeing, you're saying it's NOT in triplet count per quarter beat? Sorry if I am not reading your notation correctly.

EDIT: My response above was to the previous notation before Rick's subsequent edit. Now, I think it lines up better with what I imagined. Thank you Rick.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanron

The problem might be that he does not play anything on the first note of the second triplet in the second bar.

Code:

┌─────────────────────────┬─────────────────────────┐
├─────────────────────────┼───────────────────0─0───┤
├─────────────────────────┼───────────────────2─2───┤
├─────────────────────────┼───────────────────1─────┤
├─2───2─5─5─5─4─4─4─3─3─3─┼─2───2───0─1─2───2───────┤
└─0───0─0─────0─────0─────┴─0───────────────────────┘

 .1 + + 2 + + 3 + + 4 + + . 1 + + 2 + + 3 + + 4 + +
                                  ^

There is a slap on the second beat but no note played.

I think what you wrote out is what the first responder said and close to what I was trying to count while playing... but couldn't. Yes, I was thrown off from the 2nd beat of the 2nd bar to the strumming of the B7 chord in the final beat.

rick-slo · #7 10-25-2018, 09:29 PM

4/4 with a triplet feel. Best written rather than implied, so I rewrote it.

RockyRacc00n · #8 10-26-2018, 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick-slo

4/4 with a triplet feel. Best written rather than implied, so I rewrote it.

Rick. Did you update your notation? It makes more sense to me now. I see the triplet notation, where as before I saw eighth notes and 3 bars. I will have to update my reply to your post above.

rick-slo · #9 10-26-2018, 08:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockyRacc00n

Rick. Did you update your notation? It makes more sense to me now. I see the triplet notation, where are before I saw eighth notes and 3 bars. I will have to update my reply to your post above.

I rewrote all into triplets.

RockyRacc00n · #10 10-26-2018, 08:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick-slo

I rewrote all into triplets.

Thank you for confirming. I am just getting into the habit of counting the rhythm and it’s great help to my practice.

FwL · #11 10-26-2018, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockyRacc00n

I think your first line should be [B] [x] [B], no?

No. The first line is on the E chord.

RockyRacc00n · #12 10-26-2018, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FwL

No. The first line is on the E chord.

1st beat of the 2nd measure? Isn’t he picking the B note on the A string?

rick-slo · #13 10-26-2018, 06:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RockyRacc00n

1st beat of the 2nd measure? Isn’t he picking the B note on the A string?

Based on E chord. B is the fifth (V) of the E chord. Just strum an E chord over the whole thing and you hear it fits.

stanron · #14 10-26-2018, 06:15 PM

Yes. He is also playing the open E string. Funnily enough the first note of the second bar is still on the E chord. The B chord starts on the second beat, the one he doesn't play.

RockyRacc00n · #15 10-26-2018, 08:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rick-slo

Based on E chord. B is the fifth (V) of the E chord. Just strum an E chord over the whole thing and you hear it fits.

Quote:

Originally Posted by stanron

Yes. He is also playing the open E string. Funnily enough the first note of the second bar is still on the E chord. The B chord starts on the second beat, the one he doesn't play.

Ahh yes. That makes sense. I was strictly following the structure of the 12 bar blues and expected all of the last bar to be in B. But I guess as long as it sounds Ok...

And that explains what I was confused on the other versions of the turn around he does later. In those versions, it is clear the last bar starts in E.